Les Paul And Weight Loss Project

[javacody]

Dude, definitely go with an SG, Pete Townshend and Angus Young can't possibly be wrong! They are extremely light, and if you are building your own, you could hunt down an extremely light chunk of black limba. You could probably get a guitar down to 5 pounds or so. Go with light tuners, and a lightweight bridge.

As far as the rest, I have only one specific problem with what you've said:

but the general consensus seems to be that the bolt on neck is an inferior attachment meathod

General consensus from who? I guess these folks have never heard of:

• Jimi Hendrix
  
• Eric Clapton
  
• Keith Richards
  
• Jimmy Page (played a Tele on the first few albums)
  
• Stevie Ray Vaughan
  
• Muddy Waters
  
• Eddie Van Halen
  

And the list goes on and on. One neck joint is DEFINITELY not better than the next, it is simply different. You take two of the exact same, high quality guitars, and give one a set neck and the other a bolt neck, I bet you'd hear less than a 1% difference in tone and sustain.

Your quote is definitely one from someone with a real lack of experience when it comes to guitars (no offense). If I were you, I would take a year and play every guitar you can get your hands on, and come back and decide what kind of guitar to build/mod/buy.

[1Way]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that if it's 1% better, it'still ,,, better. If you disagree that the bolt on neck is an inferior joint, and we never said by how much, then I have to politely disagree with you. Some may prefer a bolt on even if it is an inferior joint and that is fine, yet if any of those players would say that the bolt on neck is a superior attachment method (more secure, reliable, sustain, etc.), then that would be a whole different story. I'm sure they don't do that, and I'm sure that any professional player would categorize "sustain" and a "reliably true neck" as quality traits in an electric guitar.

It's simple physics, the more area given in a joint, the better, concerning leverage, the longer the joint the better. There is no doubt that the through neck design is the best for sustain and neck stability.

I've played and listened to many guitars. Your right, I could play through more, but that particular SG was "most" convincing. So is Black Limba lighter than mahogany? Light is good, but so is great tone. Will it give me more of an SG sound? So far I'd rather not stray from the ingredients that makes that great sound.

[westhemann]

It's simple physics, the more area given in a joint, the better, concerning leverage, the longer the joint the better. There is no doubt that the through neck design is the best for sustain and neck stability.

not really.a bolt on joint is stable enough to last a lifetime.and the joint is not going to determine whether or not the neck twists or warps.has nothing to do with

a "reliably true neck" as quality traits in an electric guitar.

but i must say.you are not talking about neck through guitars.you are talking about set necks.(all gibsons are set necks)and the neck joint of a set neck guitar is not automatically more stable than a bolt on.it depends on the quality of the fit and the glueing.

but since i have NEVER heard of a bolt on neck splitting at the neck heel,and i have seen numerous gibsons that have done so,i would have to disagree with your "simple physics"

remember that ANYTHING is only as strong as it's weakest point...and the weak point of a neck is the thin portion where the neck joins the headstock

[Hotrock]

I thought that the SG neck (a set one as it is) is very unstable due to the closeness of the neck pup to the neck, cutting into the tennon?

So the SG set neck is not as stable as a bolt on? True or talking out my arse?

Either way I've gone with a super long neck tennon (half way between set neck and neck through, just because I haven't seen anyone do it yet )

Kaj

[Setch]

I thought that the SG neck (a set one as it is) is very unstable due to the closeness of the neck pup to the neck, cutting into the tennon?

So the SG set neck is not as stable as a bolt on? True or talking out my arse?

Either way I've gone with a super long neck tennon (half way between set neck and neck through, just because I haven't seen anyone do it yet  )

Kaj

You might want to check out:

Jaros Guitars

McNaught guitars

And PG's very own:

Ormsby Guitars

These guys all use the deep set tennon, which extends right under the bridge. Nothin' new under the sun

[Hotrock]

I thought that the SG neck (a set one as it is) is very unstable due to the closeness of the neck pup to the neck, cutting into the tennon?

So the SG set neck is not as stable as a bolt on? True or talking out my arse?

Either way I've gone with a super long neck tennon (half way between set neck and neck through, just because I haven't seen anyone do it yet  )

Kaj

You might want to check out:

Jaros Guitars

McNaught guitars

And PG's very own:

Ormsby Guitars

These guys all use the deep set tennon, which extends right under the bridge. Nothin' new under the sun

ARSE

Nah only joshin' my tennon is visable from the front and back of the body though. Looks a bit like that McNaught without the cap on

Furry muff, not that original then.....

.....But the first time I've done it.

BTW Setch, being a cockney, ever get chance to visit the resonator centre?

[Setch]

Cockney... hmmm. I guess I'm more of a cockney than you, but probably still less of a cockney than Dick Van Dyke Barnet is comfortably out of the range of Bow Bells.

Never been to the Reso' centre, though I have been past it a couple of times. I don't get up Islington way too often. Why d'yask?

[Hotrock]

It’s the shop where my mate sells his resonators. I put them in a thread in case anyone wanted to have a look in the players section but anyway….

www.deltaresonatorguitars.co.uk

I had the bloke round my house the other night, asking me to do some CAD work and to rack my brains about a new line that he intends to be doing. I also asked him about a resonator I’ve been planning, hopefully to sell a couple so that I can afford to keep one myself. Obviously he would be doing all the woodwork but I have special plans for the resonator in order to make it very special indeed.

If we ever get round to doing it (obviously it depends on money, especially as my girlfriend has just blown up her car – but it’s stopped her taking the proverbial for blowing up my bike ) then it’ll more than likely be sold through there. I was wondering if you were ever passing the place, if you fancied taking one of the resonators for a quick thrash and give me an independent decision.

[1Way]

Q1

What is a jointer?

Q2

How close will I be able to come to recreating the tone I heard from that Epiphone Elitist 61 reissue SG? I could tell a difference between the Elitist LP Plus and the Elitist 61 SG. I wouldn't like spending $600-700 on a guitar and being disappointed when I was done.

Q3

How do I find out how to make the guitar shape? So far I want an SG. Any guides or suggestions for doing this?

Q4

Anyone know how much an SG weighs?

[Cloud]

A jointer is for planing the sides of stock down so they are straight for making tight glue joints(its a planer for the sides of the stock). To make a guitar shape you can order plans from stewmac or you can do what I did and find some very basic dimensions and freehand your own design as close to the guitar you want as possible.

[Mickguard]

More food for thought:

Why go for an Epiphone? There are other LP copies out there, cheaper, maybe lighter wood. Plenty of decent-quality guitars, most, if not all of which are built in the same factory as the Ephiphones.

You'll be less reluctant to experiment, that's for sure.

Instead of thinning out an LP you can look around for a Melody Maker --they go cheap, they're great guitars, extremely lightweight, easy to adapt for LP humbuckers and they're Gibson

Otherwise, just chamber the LP from the back, take out as much wood as you need, then cover it again --I'm using the back of an old acoustic for that--who ever looks at the back of a guitar?

[1Way]

cloud, thanks for the helpful info!

...Happy Thanks Giving Day everyone!!!

idch, another great suggestion, thanks! I like LP's and SG's, and the Melody Maker is sort of right there in the middle. Although I definitely prefer a pair of humbuckers and 4 knobs to suit, they are genuine Gibson and they do sell for relatively less. (...Grin...) I'm thinking, get one of those and mod it for two duel humbuckers and another volume knob.

One guitar on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...ssPageName=WDVW

used a metal treadplate as a pickguard, which is a cool idea to help cover up the duel humbucker mod, but I didn't like how they did it, the treadplate was too large scale and the cover shape I didn't like so much. But I do like that Fleck-Stone refinish. If I bought a new model MM, I think I would get rid of the paintjob, then apply some modest stain and clear coat if the wood looks good, if not, then, I don't know, maybe apply a laminate top, then put some sort of clear stuff pickguard (Plexiglas maybe) over it to show off the woodgrain and protect it at the same time.

Epiphone makes good stuff, especially if you don't get the cheapest models, and I keep hearing that their copies sound and play a lot like their original counterparts. I was really really impressed with that Epi SG 61 reissue. The neck played like a dream, the guitar was excellent, and the tone was completely there. The action was low and easy to string bend, even the fretboard looked so nice,,, ugh, I could go on and on. If I got it, I would end up replacing the bridge pickup with the best pu available which might be modest improvement, the neck pu was really full sounding and warm, very nice.

Now you really have my mind going on the Melody Maker idea. I could get a newer one off of Ebay and then when I have the funds, mod in some duel humbuckers and put in another volume knob, one tone should be enough. The one's I saw come with a P90. I guess those are supposed to be really good authentic type pickups, although I think I would prefer the PAF duel humbuckers. So Now I have another guitar to test.

I am really glad I bounced these ideas off you guys. I can't wait to bend some strings on a Melody Maker. I also thought about buying a used Gibson SG, I "might" like that route better than the new Epi.

Edited November 26, 2004 by 1Way

[1Way]

idch, any suggestable threads or posters for moding a Melody Maker single pup configuration into having two duel humbuckers?

I would want the neck pickup wires channel to stay well hidden under the surface. But how do I make the passageway? Seems like there isn't much room to do it from the front or back.

Anyone know if the Melody Maker sounds anything like an SG or not?

Thanks

[Cloud]

Ya thats a good idea as well going with the Melody Maker. Also you can route the wires under the top if you decided to add a maple laminate on top. For actually making the channel using something as simple as a dremel with a router bit and there base station(or you can jerry rig your own) would do more then a good enough job. As for a pickguard I plan to use some acrylic sheet I have laying around and hazing over the surface then backlighting it with leds for an ice effect because I already have to much polished aluminum on my project as it is lol. Plus acrylic is cheap enough to replace and scratches are easy to remove if you have some polish.

Edited November 26, 2004 by Cloud

[Hotrock]

If it's a nech through that you're buildiing then you can put a slot in the side of the neck that goes through the body and glue a McDonalds straw into it. Once the pups are routed, you will go through the straw and have a little cable duct going through the wood between pups.

[Mickguard]

. Although I definitely prefer a pair of humbuckers and 4 knobs to suit, they are genuine Gibson and they do sell for relatively less. (...Grin...) I'm thinking, get one of those and mod it for two duel humbuckers and another volume knob.

Hi,

Actually, it's hard to find a Melody Maker that HASN'T been modded with at least one humbucker...

In fact, BOTH of my Melody Makers were modded that way.

Here's some photos of one of them (I'm selling it here in France):

http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...me=STRK:MESE:IT

This one was done really well--it was routed out for the humbucker. The pickguard was cut just enough to fit the humbucker. The ring sits on top of that. So it looks quite nice that way.

My other Melody Maker is a single pup model --on that one, the pickguard was cut away and the humbucker ring was mounted directly to the wood.

You might like the finish of the Melody Makers --they're a transparent cherry, so you can really see the grain of the wood (and from the looks of things, they're made from a SINGLE piece of mahogany).

There are tons of Melody Makers for sale on ebay all the time --they usually go for around $500 or so, give or take a hundred...depends on the condition. Since most MMs were modded (the original tuners and stop bar really blew), it's easy to find one that has already been fitted with buckers.

[Mickguard]

idch, any suggestable threads or posters for moding a Melody Maker single pup configuration into having two duel humbuckers?

I would want the neck pickup wires channel to stay well hidden under the surface. But how do I make the passageway? Seems like there isn't much room to do it from the front or back.

Anyone know if the Melody Maker sounds anything like an SG or not?

Thanks

I'm looking at my single-pup MM ....you could route for a humbucker below the strip that says "Melody Maker" and dig a channel for the wire that will be hidden by the pickguard.

The pickguard for a double pickup MM won't fit the single pup model --the guitar's a little bit narrower at the bout.

The stock pickups on the MMs were pretty weak (that's why everyone mods them!), though the single coil in the neck of my double pup MM kicks ass--has a really nice rich tone to it.

I don't imagine they sounded anything like an SG with the stock pups...you can probably get close to that by changing the pickups though.

It's definitely a great little guitar, and you can't beat the price for a REAL Gibson from the 60s.

[1Way]

Cool, so far most of the MM's at ebay (USA) are the newer ones which has not been modded yet. They go for about $350 or so new. So I would need new tuners, a bridge, stop piece and pickups. These either come in TV yellow, or some kind of red or black I think. I wish they had an upgraded model with good hardware and two pickups (even if they are singles, easier to mod I would think). The Epi SG is sounding more and more like what I should start with, but it's rather expensive.

Nice guitar idch. Again, I was hoping to cut out a 2nd pickup area without channeling through the top. If I built my own, which seems less likely now, then I could do as Hotrock said and just run that channel prior to assembling the side wings. I would want a clear pickguard to show off the woodgrain, and somehow carve out the channel underneath the surface. Do they make a Dremmel tool attachment that would allow me to do that? Something with a curved snake or bent elbow drive section so that I can get down inside from the back panel and maybe rout it out that way from the bridge pu to the neck rout out.

hmmm...

[1Way]

Cloud, thanks for the ideas and suggestions.

I'm going to a guitar swap meet a week from this Sunday to sell my guitars so that I'll have enough to get into some sort of SG guitar. Every time I think about getting that special sound/tone, I realize that buying a prebuilt Gibson or Epi SG is a sure bet. I wish I had experience playing a Melody Maker, but I don't yet. I'll see if I can find one to play before next Sunday.

Maybe in the spring I'll be looking into getting a Marshal amp equipped with "power scaling" from "London Power". This kit offers some impressive features:

• "power scaling", (play quietly with "cranked power tubes" sound, control any amount of output wattage from below 1% to 100%. I understand it's better and cheaper than speaker power attenuators)
  
• "drive compensation", (control any amount of preamp verses power amp proportion, and this is what helps the amp remain in the same tone/sound the more you power scale down the amp)
  
• and flexible "tube biasing" which would allow plugging in just about ANY tube and in any combination.
  

I might get an 18 watt clone amp which is more than enough watts for me. The TMB version of the 18W is supposed to be more of a plexi preamp and thus have more gain available. The stock 18 watt amp does not come with as much preamp gain distortion that I like. Also, if I go with the 18 watt TMB, the power scaling kit is cheaper too. :-) It's like $148 for a fixed biased amps, or $90 for lower wattage cathode biased amps like the 18 watt.

In the mean time, it's practice time. I've got about 8 or 9 different tab books and videos to learn from, plus this winter I'll be making a speaker cabinet for my future amp. I wonder if I'll ever be good enough to play in a band or not. At least I'm having some fun.

Edited November 27, 2004 by 1Way

[Mickguard]

I wonder if I'll ever be good enough to play in a band or not. At least I'm having some fun.

Hey, that never stopped me...I'm a lousy player --though I've started taking lessons finally, so there's hope

That's what my guitar project is all about -- I'm celebrating the idea that maybe one day I'll really know how to play this thing...

In the meantime, the best way to get good enough fast is....you guessed it...play with others...you must know a few other players?

No point in being intimidated --if they don't welcome you and your learning process, then they're not the right people to play with anyway...

I'm taking my own advice, I just started playing with my band (I'm the singer)...so far so good, I've figured out parts to play on three of our songs so far...(it helps that I wrote the songs!)

My Melody Maker didn't sell! I couldn't believe! I started it at a good price too...damn French!

Edited December 7, 2004 by idch

[1Way]

IDCH, you crack me up. But I'm sorry to hear about your guitar not selling. I know how you feel, I faired about the same way at this last guitar show I went to last Sunday. Not a single dealer seemed interested in it, a few wanted to know what it was, and that was it, nothing more. Mine is not a classic vintage guitar, it's more of a working man's ax. It's a Gibson Explorer 425, with 3 pickups (2 single coils) and a tremolo. I'm thinking about going to a local music store and have them auction it off on ebay.

Thanks for the encouragement. I've played since I was a young-in, only I never stuck with it much. I'd say I tried to learn how to play for about a year or so, and then since then I only learned a new riff or lick about once or twice in ten years or so.

As to playing with someone else, I really lucked out and ran into this neat guy recently. And he likes some of the same guitarists that I like. Only thing is, he's a business owner type, probably has money and a nice home, etc. Me, I'm like the opposite. But he is not the snooty type. I think we would get along great. AND, after our first and only personal meeting a few weeks ago, the last thing he said was that we will have to get together and play sometime! I sputtered back something about needing to practice a lot first, but that I would love to listen to his playing.

I did play with a buddy of mine who does a great job playing drums. It was me and him and a jam box for backing. He was great really, and we both said that we had a blast. I'm looking forward to jamming with him sometime again too.

I finally got a tab book plus examples CD that has something that I really need and want to learn. It's blues riffs, and it's not too difficult. After learning some of these riffs, then I will feel more comfortable jamming with others without recorded musical accompaniment. Next I want to a blues licks tab book plus CD to help me with lead play.