DrummerDude Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Hi dudes! I would like to know what is the lowest action (distance between strings and fingerboard) that could be achieved on an electric guitar. My own experience - 1,2 mm at 12-th fret on a BC-Rich Assassin NJ guitar. Let's share some opinions. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pott Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 I did 1mm on my Charvel once, without ANY buzz. I also tuned it down to C standard, and still no buzz. I had set her up myself, but then I changed string gauge and it was never the same again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivin Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 1mm to the fingerboard? I don't know about you guys, but the frets on my guitars are higher than that... Maybe you mean from the strings to the top of the frets? - Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pott Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 To the frets, not the fingerboard That's what action is always measured as, I forgot to pick on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerDude Posted August 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 1mm to the fingerboard? I don't know about you guys, but the frets on my guitars are higher than that... Maybe you mean from the strings to the top of the frets? - Dan ← Yes, Jivin, that's what I meant. Distance between the strings and the top of the frets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 I did 1mm on my Charvel once, without ANY buzz. I also tuned it down to C standard, and still no buzz. I had set her up myself, but then I changed string gauge and it was never the same again ← And im going to call you a liar. 1mm action at the 12th, equates to 0.3mm at the 12th when you fret at the 5th. A low E string vibrates 3mm total (light picking), and just over 2mm (extremely light picking, almost no sustain, very quick string fade). So, not only does a string vibrate more than your suposed action height (when not fretted), but it tries to vibrate more than ten times the distance when the string is fretted at the 5th. Those measurements are at E (and light guage strings), not C, and C (and heavier guages) is EVEN WORSE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pott Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Nah, it was 1mm. I trippled checked because I was surprised myself. That's from the middle of the low E to the top of the 12th fret, without depressing the first fret. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Nah, it was 1mm. I trippled checked because I was surprised myself. That's from the middle of the low E to the top of the 12th fret, without depressing the first fret. ← 1mm from THE MIDDLE of the low e (itself 1mm diameter) to the 12th fret??? So its really 0.5mm action?!?!?!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Nah, it was 1mm. I trippled checked because I was surprised myself. That's from the middle of the low E to the top of the 12th fret, without depressing the first fret. ← 1mm from THE MIDDLE of the low e (itself 1mm diameter) to the 12th fret??? So its really 0.5mm action?!?!?!? ← yeah..i don't buy it either...it's impossible without rattle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclej Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 just a couple of days ago i finished up a tele project for a customer. installed a set of texas specials. modded it with a four way switch that puts the pickups in series at the fourth setting. leveled, re-crowned and buffed the frets, installed a set of 9's and then set the relief. fender calls for 2mm clearance at the 17th fret for the e,a and d strings and 1.6mm for the g, b and high e. i dropped them to 1 1/2mm and 1mm respectively with no buzz. no buzz, no rattle and probably one of the top 3 or 4 teles i've ever played. i had my partner play it and he loved it..i had one of my staff instructors play it and he didn't like it that low. the important guy, the customer, loved it. one thing that i've found over the years is that it takes a really good neck or a customer willing to shell out the bucks to get the neck right to get your action low with no buzz. now, if i could get my takemine to play like that tele without sounding like a sitar i'd be a happy camper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 What mods are you doing to the strings so they defy the laws of physics?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Sorbera Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 (edited) Right now all the guitars I made are taken apart and being bufferd of refinished so I can't measure them... But on my Godin it's 1.3mm from the bottom of the fattest E string to the top of the 12th fret. On one of my takamines (G series) It's 2.1mm from the bottom of the fattest E string to the top of the 12th fret. On my other takemine (nautraul series, so built in japan and setup correctly) it's 1.9 mm. All this is without buzzing even when I play prety hard. On my godin I can lower it just a hair if I play very softly. The wenge guitar I made has a slightly higher action than my godin due to the 24" scale legenth. I'll measure it as soon as it's strung up. I'd estimate it's around 1.4-1.6mm. It's very close to the godin but not quite there. There next guitar I make is gonna be 25" scale so I can get the action down even more. Perry, whats the action on your guitar? Edited August 28, 2005 by Godin SD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegarehanman Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 (edited) I won't say that 1mm at the 12th is definitely feasible as I've never cared to try. I'm not a low action guy myself, but I think you're out of line Perry. You and I both know that wether a string buzzes or not can depend entirely on how a person plays, and when did you start picking your strings perpendicular to the plane of the strings? Strings that vibrate as the result of force imparted by pick(unless you have an oscillating actuator at your bridge) will only vibrate on a 2 dimensional plane. I took a course that solely dissected the vibrations within open and closed systems, and I'm certain you can not say something like 1mm action at the 12th fret is 100% impossible. In your support though, it would take one hell of an accurate fret job and straight neck. Edited November 26, 2005 by thegarehanman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 (edited) I have a guitar I made myself (first) and at the 12th I have an action of around 1-1.5mm and that has some, but very little rattle? But maybe you can prove all the critics wrong with a pic? Edited August 28, 2005 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 i just checked my ibanez neck through...it has the lowest action of any of mine... it has distance at the 12th of right at 1.2 mm from top of fret to bottom of low e string. .5 mm is just not possible without buzz.my neck is perfectly straight(no relief..i don't believe in it) and i believe the radius is around 15"...which is all that makes it possible for me to bend without fretting out on the radius. it also has a recessed floyd...and somehow i can pull all the way back on it anywhere on the neck without fretting out.... i can go with a 1 mm action if it is not floyd equipped...but 1 mm to the CENTER of the low e sounds like an exaggeration but anything lower than my ibanez is a waste of time...it actually starts to get less playable because you can't grab a bend as well and it just starts to sound like cat claws on a tin roof with all of the scrabbling over the frets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 I won't say that 1mm at the 12th is definitely feasible as I've never cared to try. I'm not a low action guy myself, but I think you're out of line Perry. You and I both know that wether a string buzzes or not can depend entirely on how a person plays, ← Excactly, which is why i never bothered supplying the measurement for a string that was plucked any harder than LIGHTLY or EXTREMELY LIGHTLY. You do some research. You have a guitar handy. YOU DO THE MEASUREMENTS and when did you start picking your strings perpendicular to the plane of the strings? Strings that vibrate as the result of force imparted by pick(unless you have an oscillating actuator at your bridge) will only vibrate on a 2 dimensional plane. ← Ya wrong mate. Grab a guitar, and try plucking the string any which way you like. It will ALWAYS vibrate in a oval motion, spreading to a full circular pattern. Ever noticed some guitars dont buzz instantly, but DEVELOP a buzz a half or full second or so after the strings been plucked?? Perpandicular, horizontal, diagonally, bla bla, its all irrelevant. PROVE ME WRONG I took a course that solely dissected the vibrations within open and closed systems, and I'm certain you can not say something like 1mm action at the 12th fret is 100% impossible. In your support though, it would take one hell of an accurate fret job and straight neck. ← Straigh neck, fret job, bla bla, got nothing to do with it (string vibration that is...). If a string PHYSICALLY vibrates, when LIGHTLY, or even EXTREMELY LIGHTLY plucked (horizontal, perpandicular to the fretboard, whatever, YOU choose how you want to pluck it), and the PHYSICAL UNDENIABLE NATURE OF THAT STRING is to vibrate in a pattern that can be measured as a GREAT DISTANCE THAN THE ACTUAL ACTION OF THE STRING COMPARED TO THE FRET, then it is going to buzz. PROVE ME WRONG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitarfrenzy Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 I don't use metric to do any of my measurements first off. The action at the 12th fret if measured from the center of the string to the top of the fret, can't be 1 mm or like Perry said .5mm from bottom of string to top of fret without rattle. I totally agree with that. I bet he just worded his sentence wrong though. I'm sure he meant to say 1mm clearance at the 12th fret, which is still rather low and actually could be umcomfortable to play on even though it might not buzz. The 1.2mm measurement that Wes had is more like a low action setup measurement that you will see. Maybe he just rounded his measurement to the nearest mm, which could be the case, but I'm with you guys, I don't see how .5mm clearance at the 12th fret can be done without a lot of buzz, no matter the fret job, or neck jig.. lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criss Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 (edited) I Just looked at my les paul , got my steal ruler and its at 1mm . So my les paul is telling me it is in fact obtainable . Anything lower than the 1mm on my guitar would be very very low and would buzz for sure . Edited August 28, 2005 by criss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitarfrenzy Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 I Just looked at my les paul , got my steal ruler and its at 1mm . So my les paul is telling me it is in fact obtainable . ← Yes, but I don't think Perry has an arguement with that, only the statement made where it was 1mm from top of the 12th fret to the middle of the E string, which would make it .5mm after you accounted for half the width of the string. That's what we don't agree with. Again, I think he just worded his statement wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criss Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 (edited) I Just looked at my les paul , got my steal ruler and its at 1mm . So my les paul is telling me it is in fact obtainable . ← Yes, but I don't think Perry has an arguement with that, only the statement made where it was 1mm from top of the 12th fret to the middle of the E string, which would make it .5mm after you accounted for half the width of the string. That's what we don't agree with. Again, I think he just worded his statement wrong. ← Im guessing thats what this fellow ment . I thought it was from the bottom of the string to the top of the fret also . My bad i should read twice post once . Edited August 28, 2005 by criss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digideus Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Is string height to the nearest .00001 mm really that important? As long as it plays and is intonable, who cares? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Is string height to the nearest .00001 mm really that important? As long as it plays and is intonable, who cares? ← that's my feeling on the matter.i adjust action by getting my neck straight and taking it to where it feels good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 Yes it is Digi. Its called bragging rights. Seriously low action impresses your mates, but not the guys who record or want to ability to "slack off" and actually dig into the string to get those nicer tones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeB Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 on 10-52 tuned to DCGFAD i have 1.7mm low and high, but the nut is too low forcing me to raise the action to avoid buzz. new nut and ill bet it will go down. i think the lowest i have managed is about 1.1 ish - the string rubbed the 1.14 dunlop pick, and about 1.3 low on the 7 string with 10-52 tuned to BEADGBE. i like low action, but you can go too low! I think you need a certain amount of resistance. Yng apparently plays with wild high action, go figure! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted August 28, 2005 Report Share Posted August 28, 2005 My blonde maple DC measures 1.5mm on the low E, and 1.2 on the high E. The LP is a hair higher, but not enough to be noticeable. I tend to take the strings as low as I can, until I get some buzz. Then I back up a little until the buzz is gone. As some folks have mentined, it's actually far nice to play with the action up a little, it makes it easier to dig in to bends. Of course, I'm a hack, so my playing preferences should be taken with a pinch of salt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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