Green Day..suk?

[jmrentis]

Wow thanks for that link, pretty cool site, lots of quotes. I enjoy reading that kind of stuff, gives you a bit of insight into the members of the band, they hardly ever do interviews, and are never on TV so it's hard to know much about the minds behind the music. It seriously seems like forever since the last album came out, I am really looking forward to it, but I still haven't seen a release date for it, I know it will be amazing, so far everything they have done has been, I don't think they would even bother releasing it if it wasn't epic, I heard it was going to be a bit heavier than the last album, the last tour they had Meshuggah opening so maybe that was some inspiration for the heavier feel. J

Edited December 6, 2005 by jmrentis

[Primal]

Yea, they said that Meshuggah would be a big influence on their next album. I seriously cannot WAIT to hear it.

[GregP]

That "Jesus of Suburbia" is 9 minutes long, and "When September Ends" SEEMS long, especially when you haven't changed the channel on the video version.

I wonder if Green Day got tired of doing 3-minute songs, too.

I, on the other hand, LOOOooove 3-minute songs, as long as they're well-crafted. I don't have the attention span for many 'epic' songs. I used to have no problems listening to Bohemian Rhapsody and Stairway To Heaven, until "Wayne's World" ruined both of them for me in one fell swoop. Don't get me wrong, I loved the movie-- but you know, overplay with Rhapsody and dissing of Stairway.

"Jesus of Suburbia" makes me want to gouge my eardrums out.

Greg

[marksound]

Green Day. Is that like Doris Day's grandkid?

Yanno, the simple fact that enough people here have listened to them enough to know the songs tells me they're doing something right.

A couple of show business truths:

1. There's no such thing as bad publicity

2. Say anything you want, just get the name right

Those are really the same, but you get the idea.

Most bands don't get famous enough for people to hate them.

[rokeros]

Don't you agree that songs with lyrics and a story should only go on for approx. 3 minutes? I mean people like mozart and john petrucci go on for 9 or 10 minutes.

[Primal]

Don't you agree that songs with lyrics and a story should only go on for approx. 3 minutes? I mean people like mozart and john petrucci go on for 9 or 10 minutes.

←

Mozart composed operas, which go on for FAR longer than 10 minutes.

[Jehle]

Hard to believe that Green Day is getting such a licking in this thread. I like 'em. Their new CD is the best thing that they've produced ever. The songs are catchy, and the way that the guitar is mixed in you can crank it and not blow your ears out. I'm trying to figure that out by looking at the CD through a series of spectrum analysers.

Having said that, while I don't really care about the lyrics, what the message is, or any of that, I can say that I do like them more now and have sought out some of their earlier works because the latest CD is that good IMHO.

[Jehle]

Green Day. Is that like Doris Day's grandkid?

Yanno, the simple fact that enough people here have listened to them enough to know the songs tells me they're doing something right.

A couple of show business truths:

1. There's no such thing as bad publicity

2. Say anything you want, just get the name right

Those are really the same, but you get the idea.

Most bands don't get famous enough for people to hate them.

←

Unless you are Dimebag Darrell. People shoot you on stage in that case.

[jmrentis]

I think I should go get a copy of a newer album by them, So you really liked the new stuff banana man? I think you will like theolder stuff too, although it's far more raw especially the first few albums, I think the first one is very raw and poorly mixed, like old school garage recording, I think it was called 1039 smoothed out slappy hours of Green day, the second was Kerplunk, then Dookie. I haven't listened to many after that era, but I hear their stuff all the time and still like it. Also there was a band before green day was formed called Bullethead Gunpowder I believe, and basically that was green day before it was formed, I think Billy Joe was the singer and maybe Mike was still the bassist but I can't remember, I think it's really hard to find any of there records but they all sound the same as the early green day stuff. ANyways I think I will go grab a copy of the new album, my brother probably has it he loves green day, I think he has every album or at least all the latest ones, and honestly I think he has a good taste in music.

PS:Jehle you didn't want a mod job? DId you see the offer?

[Jehle]

PS:Jehle you didn't want a mod job? DId you see the offer?

←

Looks like I didn't see the offer in time. Oh well.

As far as Green Day, check out Nimrod. It's very underrated IMHO. Also search for "The Network" on eBay. It's Green Day under another name. They wear masks on stage so you can't "see" who they are, but one listen will give it away.

I missed seeing Green Day in Las Vegas and "The Network" was the opening band! That would have rocked!

The really early stuff that they did was before Tre Cool joined the band. I'm really not into the really early stuff. I just barely tollerate Dookie. Now, after seeing them in concert, I have to admit that Green Day are the first band I went to see to watch what the drummer did instead of the guitarist! Tre is freakin mental and is the fastest drummer I've ever seen. Mike Dirnt is a fantastic bassist too. I learned a few things from watching him in those shows. Play bass with a pick and dig in!

<edit>

Crud. I looked back and saw all the "dancing banana mod" nominations. Guys, I'm so sorry that I missed that.

[jmrentis]

Yeah I will check out that album, I think I have heard some of it. And I never have heard about "The Network" but it sounds cool and kinda funny. THanks for the tips.

Also maybe ask Kevan if you can jump in on the poll, even though it's late you never know, or maybe we can have a second poll for a second mod and you can be in that. I am not sure if they said they wanted to hire more than one or not, but I think it couldn't hurt. Well good luck.

[BJC132003]

I like Greenday quite a bit, but their new album is as annoying as heck. And its also annoying how people call them 'THE' punk. Rebellion isnt all their is to punk. Sheer stupidity isnt either. But hey, maybe they'll see that light eventually.....and start singing about their brain-disfunctions again =b Instead of ragging on the President.

[tirapop]

Having said that, while I don't really care about the lyrics, what the message is, or any of that, I can say that I do like them more now and have sought out some of their earlier works because the latest CD is that good IMHO.

←

I don't know if it's an age thing, but, lyrics seem to register with me less and less. Crappier hearing? Not enough time? Songs click whether I know what they're singing about or not. Lately I've been listening a lot to My Morning Jacket. I got tired of mumbling along and found the lyrics to a couple songs I really like. The lyrics were on the verge of being incomprehensible nonsense. No longer mumbling, I still don't know what the songs are about, but, I still love them.

[GuitarMaestro]

Everyone keeps saying that they can't play for crap, maybe while making dookie they still sucked but that was what 8-10 years ago or something, after touring all that time and putting out many more records some of which have won some serious awars, I highly doubt that they still have problems playing. Everyone sucks at first, it takes time to get good, think about it they have been touring probably much longer than many of us have even playing guitar, and on tour most of the time you must play your instrument and play it well otherwise noone will like you. Greenday never made the promise that they would be a super techincal epic band, there was no ficade put out, they just played what they wanted and said what they wanted if you like it cool if you don't, well then don't listen. To sit there and say they have no talent is straight ignorant, how many of you have hit records, how many of you have gone on tour year in year out, how many have 5+ records that were top sellers, damn if someone with no talent can do so well I would like to see how well someone with talent does. What is boils down to is everyone that says they don't like them, don't like them because it isn't their style of music, so to rip on them because you listen to other things is lame, a bunch of people here don't like them but some of us have respect for them because we know what it takes to do what they have done. So instead of ripping on them more go out win a bunch of awards tour for 8-10 years and come back and insult them, because by then you will have a better understanding for what they have done and not just heard a couple songs on the radio and hated them. If you don't like that type of music fine, but you need to show some respect, they have done and been through a ton and are still very successful. J

Did you read my post at all? Would have saved you some typing....I never said they have no talent. I even stressed their songwriting talent. I simply told some facts about the Dookie records and that I(!!!!) hate most of Greendays music. I never said that it is bad and I have nothing against people who like them. And I am still convinced that they cannot really play in comparison to people who really mastered an instrument. Sure they can play their songs now, but their songs can be played(not composed and that is what I respect them for) by everybody who is playing for 3-4 years and has some talent.

[Gemm012]

I don't know about 3-4 years. At my 8th grade graduation (which was a huge waste of time by the way) a kid played the guitar for one of their songs and he couldn't have been playing more than 9 monthes. And I played Paganinni's 5th ( gotta thow in some self promoting ) for the talent show that year and hadn't been playing guitar* for more than a year. (*that's a misleading statement though cause I had been playing bass guitar for about 2.5 years by then) But I can't see anything Greenday has as anything close to Paganinni. But now I'm just niggling on how long it would take playing guitar before you could successfully pull off a Greenday song so... whatever.

Galen.

Edited December 9, 2005 by Gemm012

[BJC132003]

Hey, I could play BBD on my first day of playing....Greenday doesnt understand the terms 'Mix It Up A Bit', it must be said.

[tirapop]

I think their skill as musicians is kind of irrelevant. Great technique doesn't guaranty a great song. Some songs just rock and don't require great skill, just a lot of passion to sell it. Just think of some great old John Lee Hooker song... any flashy technique would just get in the way.

I appreciate listening to great musicians playing wonderful songs that allow them to use their skills. But, if the song doesn't connect, however much skill and musicianship they demonstrate, it's just an exercise or a seminar.

Lately, I've been listening to Sister Gertrude Morgan. Some DJ has remixed an old album she did in 1970 and it's gotten on the radio. Her original stuff is just her voice and a tambourine... a black street preacher from New Orleans singing gospel. Her original music just rocks. You catch that whole gospel-blues-rock&roll thread, listening to her. Really simple, visceral stuff.

[jmrentis]

Did you read my post at all? Would have saved you some typing....I never said they have no talent. I even stressed their songwriting talent. I simply told some facts about the Dookie records and that I(!!!!) hate most of Greendays music. I never said that it is bad and I have nothing against people who like them. And I am still convinced that they cannot really play in comparison to people who really mastered an instrument. Sure they can play their songs now, but their songs can be played(not composed and that is what I respect them for) by everybody who is playing for 3-4 years and has some talent.

Yes I read your post along with all the posts in this thread multiple times, and my response wasn't solely directed at you, the part about them not being able to play was. Putting something on a record that is tough to play in person in nothing to new to many newer bands, and maybe they weren't great at first but who is, they obviously picked it up quick otherwise the entire dookie tour would have failed. The part about no talent was from another post not yours, and I fully respect that you hate Greenday, many people do and I am totally cool with, I just don't like people that say that they are worthless no talent people that got lucky(ie the title/point of the thread), bands don't blow up for no reason, if they had nothing going for them they would be like the rest of us dreamers that play and play and try and try for nothing or just a 2 minute shot at out spot light. But I do disagree that they are poor players, everyone is welcome to their opinions, I just don't see it, I have seen plenty of live stuff and video of them writing music in studios and always felt they play well, nothing super technical, but their music was never supposed to be that anyways, it is what it is, if someone came up with a song that was one note and one chord and everyone liked it then so be it, just because they don't play tough stuff or techincal stuff you can't really say they are not good at it, if you have seen them try to play a vai song and completely blow it then yes fine. I had heard one of the producers once saying that during the making of a record they nailed it all the way through, some songs were a one take and others were only a couple, especially vocals. Anyways again my post wasn't directed at you, just the part about the not playing well, the rest of my post was in response to all the other posts before yours.

[GuitarMaestro]

@jmrentis: Yeah....I agree with you. I still am convinced that they nowadays can play their songs very will but not much more. I doubt they are really good at their instruments. But as you said that is not the point of Greenday at all.

@BJC132003 and Gem012:

Thinking that you "can play a song easily" if you are a beginner and recording it in the studio are different worlds. Most people that only play for 2 years neither have the ears trained well enough nor the rythmical ability to pull of the most simple stuff in a way that is good enough for use in studio. Sure they might be able to play Pagnini and do some tapping etc., but to make a pro sounding studio take you simply need way more musical skills than a beginning player has. In studio every nuance counts and I did enough studio work to see even advanced players fail in playing something basic tight and good enough for use on a properly produced cd. And then there is the whole live thing. To play the shows a band of the size of Greenday plays you simply need alot of epxirience....

[daveq]

I don't get into that type of music. I don't own a single piece of their stuff.

It's hard for me to bash anyone (even rap artists - well, maybe not rap but you get the idea) who has the ability to put a song together and sell it to millions. I wish I could. I can play almost anything I want to (given either time to figure it out or tab) and make it sound spot-on but I don't seem to have what it takes to create something from scratch.

I can create pieces here and there and maybe some lead work that sounds good on it's own but I cannot incorporate it into anything that resembles a complete song. I've been playing for a long time (since 1985/86?) but only on a rare occasion with a band. I think that has a lot to do with it but I still think I'm missing something that others are born with.

I've often sat down with my guitar with the notion in mind of creating a song only to find that I end up with several pieces that don't fit but sound good separately.

To sum it up: If someone were to challenge me and Green Day to come up with a song - I would likely lose every single time. Even though I know I can play circles around Billy - I cannot do what he does. Actually, I don't even know if he writes his songs but I think you know what I mean.

Maybe you can tell me - if I went for music lessons (not guitar lessons), is that all I would need or is it something that you're born with?

[possum1284]

billy joel armstrong is a terrible guitarist. the bass player is scary looking,, looks like a pedaphile. there music is crap but compared to sopme of the other stuff today its tolerable. in perspective 10 years ago i hated greenday, now if its on the radio imght listen to it based on the fact that i could finf worse. i would never by a cd of theirs. though. all their songs sound the same.

Adam

[Primal]

There is only one Green Day song that I actually like, now that I think about it. Its actually got a pretty nifty bass line... I think its called "When I Come Around" or something...

[SamIAmUBUF]

Dookie wasn't all that bad. Since then, it's been a steady downhill slide

[jmrentis]

There is only one Green Day song that I actually like, now that I think about it. Its actually got a pretty nifty bass line... I think its called "When I Come Around" or something..

The guitar on that song was one of the first songs I picked up, from the start I could play cheesy 4 power chord songs easy but from there I needed timing and that song was one of the first that I could do, it's easy but I also think it sounds good, the guitar is simple but the bass really makes the song, and actually I think a lot of their songs have a great bass element but none are as pronounced as that one, they need to mix up the bass high and drop some of the treble on the guitar like they seemed to do in that song.

It's funny even though their stuff has always been similar they really changed a lot, progressed actually, dookie was right in the middle, it was still really simple yet sounded a bunch better than their first two effforts, really clean and smooth. 1039 and Kerplunk were good but you can tell they were just when they first started, really bad recordings and pretty bad mixing, some of the treble on 1039 is insane, the songs are good and everything though, and then after dookie they really seemed to step up their game, play songs with more than 3 or 4 power chords and got way better mixing and recording, probably much better producers involved.

If you listened to each cd from beginning to end in order from the first you would see how much they improved and progressed and you would realize how many hits they actually have and how long they have been doing this, for what they play it is amazing that they are still around and doing well, to me they are to punk what aerosmith is to rock or something like that. J

[Anon]

it just that "im hurting inside" characteristic of there music that todays teens identify with,write a song that talks about A. being individual B. hating your parents or C. how bad life sucks  and you'll hit it big because even though its all the same crap, kids eat it up. and if you hadnt guessed, i hate them

←

You summed it up right there. I like greenday though, I liked them before they were "real famous" ..but hell i'm a teenager.

Cheers!