krazyderek Posted October 31, 2003 Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 how to build info cd-rom http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...&category=11810 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...&category=25255 and this one just sounds cool, c'mon just say it "plasma" hehehe pretty decent price, but i know more about the true location of atlantis then CNC's.. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...&category=25276 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted October 31, 2003 Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 FlexAbility? Either somebody has had his fair dose of Steve vai, or they just have bad spelling and try to come across as professional sellers...somehow didn't work for me. Well Derek, what's unclear about a CNC? You program it to route as you want it in a special programming language, press enter, and it does just that...apparently you should first insert your wood, though. And a Plasma cutter is only that cool if you use it on metals, not that good for wood I think. I also think that once you've designed your piece in CAD you can upload it into the CNC software pretty easily and don't have to write millions of lines of sourcecode for the router. After all, I don't have experience with a CNC, but a couple of friends of mine did a course in school that had one semester of basic CNC instruction. I remember the stories of the instructor (who was missing a couple of fingers...) telling them to be dang careful with that expensive machine and drilling a nice 1/4" hole into the mounting block about 2 minutes later... so long ace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weezerboy Posted October 31, 2003 Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 CNC millers are pretty easy to use...i've been doing it since i was like 12 and all you do for simple routing is draw the picture in a very simple program, say how deep you want it and press GO. But you can upload CAD stuff really easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted October 31, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 oh i understand how they work... just showing you guys some cheap tables and what not i found.. bored.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Posted October 31, 2003 Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 CNC's easy if you know what you're doing... but I would hardly want to attempt to build one of those suckers myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted October 31, 2003 Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 but i know more about the true location of atlantis then CNC's.. In that case I misinterpreted the above statement...could you help me out with the coordinates to atlantis then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted October 31, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 i'd tell you, but then i'd have to kill you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jai Posted October 31, 2003 Report Share Posted October 31, 2003 yep, them crazy CNCs. I was thinking of taking 2 plates of alum and cnc me a guitar here one day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted November 1, 2003 Report Share Posted November 1, 2003 Well, it seems to me that opinions differ on that. I mean, of course a CNC is very convenient but I know many people think "if it's not handcrafted, I won't buy it". Especially for builders I think the sword is double-edged: on the one hand you take pride in your art (I say you not including me because I have yet to build one...), on the other hand, a CNC would make life a lot easier. Will it be just as rewarding if you build a guitar using a CNC? If you designed it yourself it probably will, but imagine you have a CNC and an image of a strat, you have the body CNCed, and all you have to do is put on the neck and the hardware and you're set...that's about like buying a kit guitar, only more costly. Of course, if you become a bit bigger as a builder, eventually selling a couple guitars per month, a CNC will take a great deal of work from you while you can concentrate on things other than routing and shaping. But for most of us, even if home-built, a CNC will not likely be on the shopping list in the near future I suppose, still it's something to keep in the back of one's head </ranting> so long ace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Posted November 1, 2003 Report Share Posted November 1, 2003 Well, it seems to me that opinions differ on that. I mean, of course a CNC is very convenient but I know many people think "if it's not handcrafted, I won't buy it". Especially for builders I think the sword is double-edged: on the one hand you take pride in your art (I say you not including me because I have yet to build one...), on the other hand, a CNC would make life a lot easier. Will it be just as rewarding if you build a guitar using a CNC? If you designed it yourself it probably will, but imagine you have a CNC and an image of a strat, you have the body CNCed, and all you have to do is put on the neck and the hardware and you're set...that's about like buying a kit guitar, only more costly. Of course, if you become a bit bigger as a builder, eventually selling a couple guitars per month, a CNC will take a great deal of work from you while you can concentrate on things other than routing and shaping. But for most of us, even if home-built, a CNC will not likely be on the shopping list in the near future I suppose, still it's something to keep in the back of one's head </ranting> so long ace My opinion: f*ck "handbuilt". I will always build my own guitars by hand. It's no fun to just punch it up and watch the machine go. It's highly gratifying to mill other things, but really, homebuilt guitars are meant to be done by hand. On the other hand, I'd much rather have a precision machine cutting my neck, pickup pockets, neck pockets, and contours than a human. IMO, as far as mass-production and corporate guitar-building goes, handbuilding guitars leads only to imperfections in the work, and I'd much sooner trust a CNC machine to give me the neck I want than I would some guy who's trained to crank those puppies out as fast as possible. When it comes down to the man against machine (precision-wise), the machine will win 99.99% of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckguitarist Posted November 1, 2003 Report Share Posted November 1, 2003 Well, it seems to me that opinions differ on that. I mean, of course a CNC is very convenient but I know many people think "if it's not handcrafted, I won't buy it". Especially for builders I think the sword is double-edged: on the one hand you take pride in your art (I say you not including me because I have yet to build one...), on the other hand, a CNC would make life a lot easier. Will it be just as rewarding if you build a guitar using a CNC? If you designed it yourself it probably will, but imagine you have a CNC and an image of a strat, you have the body CNCed, and all you have to do is put on the neck and the hardware and you're set...that's about like buying a kit guitar, only more costly. Of course, if you become a bit bigger as a builder, eventually selling a couple guitars per month, a CNC will take a great deal of work from you while you can concentrate on things other than routing and shaping. But for most of us, even if home-built, a CNC will not likely be on the shopping list in the near future I suppose, still it's something to keep in the back of one's head </ranting> so long ace My opinion: f*ck "handbuilt". I will always build my own guitars by hand. It's no fun to just punch it up and watch the machine go. It's highly gratifying to mill other things, but really, homebuilt guitars are meant to be done by hand. On the other hand, I'd much rather have a precision machine cutting my neck, pickup pockets, neck pockets, and contours than a human. IMO, as far as mass-production and corporate guitar-building goes, handbuilding guitars leads only to imperfections in the work, and I'd much sooner trust a CNC machine to give me the neck I want than I would some guy who's trained to crank those puppies out as fast as possible. When it comes down to the man against machine (precision-wise), the machine will win 99.99% of the time. good points reaper, i've got another opinion... f*ck ed roman stupid hand-built rants Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Posted November 1, 2003 Report Share Posted November 1, 2003 I have to say I agree. Really, I think the only reason Ed Roman rants against CNC machining is because he doesn't like PRS, and doesn't really have any other argument against them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 1, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2003 it's one thing for me to make 1 guitar body and 1 guitar neck on a CNC, with designs i made my self, and then spend the next 2 weeks radiusing the fretboard, fretting, making the nut, painting, assembling, wirring, and setting up vs a company that does this 20 times an hour and that has a percentage of manufacturing defects that are considered acceptable per hundred guitars.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsera Posted November 2, 2003 Report Share Posted November 2, 2003 Derek are you looking for cnc router plans? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitarfrenzy Posted November 2, 2003 Report Share Posted November 2, 2003 I used to think that using a CNC was cheating, but then again what does handmade mean? I don't think anyone can cut out a guitar body or build a neck without help of some kind of tools. Unless someone knows something I don't know, then it's impossible to build a guitar without the aid of somekind of tools. I think it would be hard to say the least to chop the body by hand.. lol So with that in mind, what is the next criteria for calling your guitar handmade? We'll, if we already decided you have to have some kinds of tools, does a handmade guitar mean that you only used anything other than a powertool? If that's true then I still say that there are very few guitars built like this, but I might be wrong also. (please correct me if I'm wrong about this) So finally the last thing to consider is since you'll be using some kind of powertool to build your guitar, then what's the difference between building a template and following it or designing one and programming it into a computer that will cut it out the same also. Your still using the router principle, only you can do the carving and the design cutting all at the same time with the CNC. The thing is, both of them are powertools in a way, so what makes a CNC machine any less a powertool than a regular router? I'm still not sure I can answer what can be considered HANDMADE, but I do know that the CNC is just another powertool,, a bit more costly but still one to say the least. I guess if I was trying to make alot of money and wanted to be as competitive as Fender, Gibson, PRS, Ibanez, I would get a CNC because we all know they use them and you'd never keep up using a bandsaw, router and sandpaper.. lol So to me it just really depends on what your trying to do with this hobby. Keep it a hobby or make it a business? That's for you to answer though. Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted November 2, 2003 Report Share Posted November 2, 2003 horra! good points... wellI always dream a bout making guitars, so making one on a cnc machine would be considered a challenge for me cos, after all, we are all normal people who love guitars, aand we would do any thing for them. And its a shiney new tool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 2, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2003 Derek are you looking for cnc router plans? not really looking to buy any plans if that's what you're asking, BUT, if you have a set you're willing to share send'em on over, it's something i'd like to keep my mind open too.. and to reply to GF.... to me handmade applies as long as your the one physicallly pushing the tool being used to make the guitarweather it be a fancy router with a template, a disk sander, hand sanding block, an air paint brush, or a paint roller, they're all man powered, so it takes skill to yeild a good product using this methot, where as CNC the human skill starts and end at drawing a picture and pressing the green button. course like i said i wouldn't want anything fancy, just something i could maybe build for under 1000$ that could cut out boodies for me, and maybe ruff out the neck, it'd be nice if someone sent me a cad file of the body they wanted and i could give them that EXACT body shape, it would also save time reproducing the same shape over and over, since that's just tedious template tracing. Then you i'd take that raw body and position the neck pocket and other stuff according to how i wanted to for that particular guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitarfrenzy Posted November 3, 2003 Report Share Posted November 3, 2003 Sounds like you want to build a wood duplicator then, since you still can control it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2003 Sounds like you want to build a wood duplicator then, since you still can control it. hmm... i guess, for the handmade part, and copying something i've already made but the cnc would help in duplicating a guitar i don't actually have at the time, like a guitar designed by someone in say the UK that they want me to make? i suppose i might try to add in the neck pocket part to the cnc routing so that it was made exactly as they specified (if they already had the neck and based the cad file around that neck) who knows..... this is all just hypothetical anyways Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAI6 Posted November 4, 2003 Report Share Posted November 4, 2003 Personally I don't care how a guitar is made, as long as it's well-made. But I do see a problem with someone using a CNC machine, and still charging "hand-made" prices... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsera Posted November 5, 2003 Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 I just bought 2 different cnc plans,they are both in cad and print version. the first being a bigger unit for router like DE WALT and the other abit smaller for these DREMEL tools and at about $30 a plan not to bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 5, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 is that actually comparable to a dremel? i saw a couple of little cnc router attachments... like, just router... going for a couple thousand on ebay, so i assumed they were much more powerfull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsera Posted November 5, 2003 Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 I am not sure about what you saw, but this is a CAD plan to build a CNC router from scratch and adjust its dimensions to fit YOUR needs.Those bigger more powerful machines are more for industial use I would think and you could prolly use this for your work but I dont know if they are also able to be used with a computer.The plans I got are for 3 axis routing and have 3 small stepmotors in them and a controller so it can be hooked up to a computer or laptop.btw the cost of the smaller one was about $275 for everything accept the 3 stepmotors and electronics for controlling it,that you already have a pc was like taken for granted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbkim Posted November 5, 2003 Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 Derek are you looking for cnc router plans? not really looking to buy any plans if that's what you're asking, BUT, if you have a set you're willing to share send'em on over, it's something i'd like to keep my mind open too.. [snip] course like i said i wouldn't want anything fancy, just something i could maybe build for under 1000$ [snip] I found this site while surfing around... "Total cost - $952.25" It was linked from the cnczone forum which might be worth checking out if you're interested in CNC... especially the "Musical Instrument Construction" section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsera Posted November 5, 2003 Report Share Posted November 5, 2003 very nice but I was not looking to build somthing that big Ilive in a apartment so it has to fit in my basement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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