Prostheta Posted May 4, 2008 Report Share Posted May 4, 2008 Veritas or Lie Nielsen planes are probably the best pieces of work I can perceive myself owning anytime soon....but check out this handplane!! http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=200220900600 That is just unfair. WOW. It makes making wood smaller, beautiful.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anderekel Posted May 4, 2008 Report Share Posted May 4, 2008 Wow, that's awesome. I just bought a couple older planes, but nothin' near that cost or size, damn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted May 4, 2008 Report Share Posted May 4, 2008 Too much plane for me, on many levels . I think if I owned that it would never collect dust (it would be locked up in a glass display case or something). Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killemall8 Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 what the heck? what on the planet makes a plane worh 15k? and 8 thousand for that one? and whats the big deal? i dont think 22" long is that big. i have one that big. its the only one i have. someone let me know why this is so outragous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyManAndy Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 (edited) I know nothing about plane prices, but I'm going to go out on a limb. It's like most markets. If a brand or person has a excellent reputation for making something, their products can get quite pricey. In addition, products from boutique makers tend to be expensive by nature. CMA Edited May 5, 2008 by CrazyManAndy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjack Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 (edited) Well, not to mention the precision, materials, time, and effort that go into making hand a plane that large completely level??? Right? (mostly a guess) Edited May 5, 2008 by newjack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killemall8 Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 well, i dont see what makes that worth over 10k. maybe 200 bucks. but 8k for a starting bid? you could by a whole workshop full of tools for that. mine works perfectly fine, does that make it worth that much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyManAndy Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 Well, as far as what makes it "worth it", I couldn't say. I'm not an expert on planes. And different people have different reasons for something being "worth it". The reason may have nothing to do with practical advantage. Who knows. Some folks have money, and like to spend it. Maybe someone with more knowledge of planes could jump in here. CMA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 Why are many very well made acoustic guitars around $1000(give or take), and at the same time Jeffrey Elliot acoustics start at $13,000 with a fifteen year waiting list (not accepting deposits for new commisions). It comes down to the maker, and the makers reputation. Worth thinking about if you want to make a living selling hand crafted items, a reputation for quality carries a lot of value to the right market. I can't justify that kind of money for a plane, but if you have a certain level of income and do not need to accept anything other than just what you want to use(money is no object). They look like nifty planes, no compramise in quality. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jer7440 Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 You should check out this guys web site. Hotley planes The planes with the steel bottoms dovetailed to the brass sides are very cool looking! I agree the prices are high, and I could never justify such a tool, but for hand made quality like that I don't think the price is out of line. Precision metal work like that takes time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted May 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 But *look* at them :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donut Man Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Looks like some precision engineering. For 4k, I'd pay someone to build me a guitar, and watch them instead though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmth Builder Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 A CNC machine in china could make millions in the same time, to the same quality for a fraction of the price your just paying for this hype over the 'hand built quality' as if hes poured his life and soul into it and all that. (I'm no doubter of hand built guitar but $15k plane? Are you serious???) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted May 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Same as any CNC machine piece - it's only as good as the assemblers, quality checkers, finishers etc. You can't take a piece of X and cut it according to Y and expect a £4000 plane to come out of the other side. CNC is only part of the process, and in fact I believe Karl Holtey actually uses CNC for some parts. They won't come out anywhere near finished of course...! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myka Guitars Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 I remember a thread a while back where people thought Lie Nielsen's were too much. I would gladly pay for a quality tool like this. His #98 looks really nice. It might take a few years to save up and justify the price but I would buy one of these just to be able to work with such an amazing tool. Craftsmen like this are so rare in the world. And $200 for a plane like this is an insulting price. That might cover materials if you went with the cheap stuff. I know my time is worth more than that. Geez.... ~David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 If you need a really, really good tool for a fair price, there's Lie Nielsen and Veritas. This stuff's a cut above, it's the top end custom shop of the plane market. The workmanship, quality, etc. is worth it, and no, CNC will not achieve that all on its lonesome. As with most of these things, if you don't understand the price, it's not for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supernova9 Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 A CNC machine in china could make millions in the same time, to the same quality for a fraction of the price your just paying for this hype over the 'hand built quality' as if hes poured his life and soul into it and all that. (I'm no doubter of hand built guitar but $15k plane? Are you serious???) No you can't do the same in china for a fraction. Have you never heard the old rule - "You can get something done to a good quality, for little money, or quickly, pick two."?? This is more than just cutting bits out on a CNC and putting them together. Why you appreciate craftsmanship that goes into guitarbuilding but not plane-making is beyond me. Skill is skill regardless of domain. This is like getting a private stock PRS built by Paul Reed Smith himself. That's the equivalent of this plane. That guitar would cost you way more than $15k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 It just drives me crazy ,that people do not understand what it takes to make the high end tools and products today.Just the time spent alone is worth a third of the price.People now days are to use to, low quality and throw away products.These tools made by these guys will last many life times,not just the one who bought them.The metals are made to the tightest specs,and then fine tuned to the highest grade.The top 1% of the tools in the world.Also when their gone their gone,if the skills are not passed down ,it's lost forever..I wish there were more true craftsman in the world today,but most of us could not afford them.In the land before time ,people would be born into a trade or work into a trade, and that is what they did all their life.We as a people have lost trades ,and can not do things they did before motors and all the fancy tools of today.That's why true craftsman stand out so much today and get the prices they do.If everyone could do it ,they would be cheep.And for everyone jumping on the China band wagon,shame on you.Made in America is going to be gone soon,and the pride with it.We send the best metal ore to China ,just to get cheep stuff back.We should get back to Made in America ,we have the skills, we just let them go to save a little.IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregP Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 I must be thick, but how can 'hand crafting' result in a completely flat plane? I'm not doubting it, I just would in all non-sarcastic sincerity like to know. Is it about sourcing naturally-occurring materials that are naturally flat? How the heck is it done? I always assumed that some sort of computer guidance would be able to produce a much more perfectly flat surface than a person's bare hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 CNC machines can have runout issues, etc., and do not in and of themselves guarantee absolute perfect flatness; the user needs to fine tune the machine and ensure it all works - CNC is nothing more than a tool, after all. Reference flat plates are still the gold standard for reference flatness in machine shops. Doing it 'by hand' can mean someone spends the time to make sure everything is ground perfectly flat (not just cast, which can warp and move) and square, and there's no reason for it to be inferior to CNC machined parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregP Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 No, I wouldn't want to imply that right out of a CNC machine it would be perfect or inferior, either. I'm well aware of the tolerances in CNC machines not being 100% perfect. But since there are surely other computer-controlled processes, I'm just saying that I don't know how you'd get that 99.999% flat surface by hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted May 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 Flatness is just one factor that perhaps machines can get you within the ballpark of, but skill and patience refines and re-refines by factors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supernova9 Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 No, I wouldn't want to imply that right out of a CNC machine it would be perfect or inferior, either. I'm well aware of the tolerances in CNC machines not being 100% perfect. But since there are surely other computer-controlled processes, I'm just saying that I don't know how you'd get that 99.999% flat surface by hand. Hand lapping on a flat reference surface until the engineer's blue you apply comes off equally on all parts of the plane sole at a time I'd assume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim37 Posted May 13, 2008 Report Share Posted May 13, 2008 cnc does not mean perfect far from it a cnc is only as good as its operator. that said damn i could go down to a gauge shop and have a plane made for less than what that guy is charging Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted May 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2008 ...and you'd probably end up with something which is less than a tenth of the quality in terms of materials, engineering.... If you can't afford a plane of that quality, buy a Lie-Neilson or Veritas. If you can't afford those, buy a random make :-D Those planes do have their place, but they tend to be with artisans and career woodworkers. Can't perceive one making it to my bench, and even if I could afford it, my bench wouldn't fully benefit from their workmanship and quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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