Project S907 #3

[RestorationAD]

[RestorationAD]

[Johnny Foreigner]

WANT!

[CrazyManAndy]

WANT!

+1

[plinky]

Absolutely love these builds. I can only hope my first build (if it ever happens) will look remotely close in fit and finish.

Do you do any floating tremolo setups? Just curious.

[RestorationAD]

Absolutely love these builds. I can only hope my first build (if it ever happens) will look remotely close in fit and finish.

Do you do any floating tremolo setups? Just curious.

I am not a tremolo guy... never really ever was. I believe the last time I did a trem route for a floater was Jan 2008... try this post

However my RG and the Diablo build have semi floating tremolos... meaning you can pull up a 1/2 step or maybe a full before they smack the body.

Keep your eyes peeled I may post a retro build I am working on soon. It will have a floyd... not sure if I am going to recess it.

[Cactus]

Schweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeing!

[RestorationAD]

Oily.

[ScottR]

RAD, I forgot to ask.

What kind of oil are putting on this?

SR

[RestorationAD]

RAD, I forgot to ask.

What kind of oil are putting on this?

SR

If I tell you I have to kill you....

I once asked Jaden about his oil he used through PM. Later 3 black suburbans showed up at the house and took my laptop.

I think Verhoevenc has a better chance of me showing him how to wind pickups.

Behlen Teak oil on this one... I have used Watco Danish Oil, Boiled Linseed Oil, Tru-Oil, a homebrew BLO, and now this. So far I have had good results with the Watco Danish Oil (varnish/oil mix). I have used the Behlen Teak oil on a few necks and I like the way it holds up. Whatever varnish they mixed with the tung oil and dryers is pretty good. Works really well on hard woods (like bloodwood) and oily stuff like cocobolo.

I like the feel of oil finishes ... but there is really no protection from the elements. The oil/varnish mixes are a mixed bag. I think Tru-oil provides better protection than most but it is also more like a film finish in feel.

Oh well this is a subject of great debate. I will let you guys know how well it works out.

[Our Souls inc.]

RAD, not that my builds are anywhere NEAR the level of greatness that yours are, but I am a big, big fan of teak oil ... I tried it on my carved explorer ; here: http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=43011&view=findpost&p=461262

and I've been using it since.

I absolutely love its ease of use, relatively low fumes and level of protection it offers.

these pics look saturated.... do you do a rub-down while its still wet, or let it dry first?

I try to give it about 5 minutes to soak in, then rub it in/off. Then re-apply after an hour and keep at it for 6 or so coats.

My last two basses were finished in it too. I just don't hear about it too often on these forums, so I thought I was the odd man out.

Nice to see others using it too.

[ScottR]

I remember a post a year or so ago where the guy used a polymerized tung oil that looked great. I think it built a film and was essentially to tung oil what Tru-Oil is to linseed oil. (Polymerized). I am a fan of watco danish oil and have tried watco teak oil...which IIRC turned out to be nearly the same thing as the danish oil. Have not tried Behlin's. I'm looking forward to your verdict.....and will be watching for the suburbans.

SR

[RestorationAD]

RAD, not that my builds are anywhere NEAR the level of greatness that yours are, but I am a big, big fan of teak oil ... I tried it on my carved explorer ; here: http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=43011&view=findpost&p=461262

and I've been using it since.

I absolutely love its ease of use, relatively low fumes and level of protection it offers.

these pics look saturated.... do you do a rub-down while its still wet, or let it dry first?

I try to give it about 5 minutes to soak in, then rub it in/off. Then re-apply after an hour and keep at it for 6 or so coats.

My last two basses were finished in it too. I just don't hear about it too often on these forums, so I thought I was the odd man out.

Nice to see others using it too.

First up all Teak Oils are different. Manufacturers use names like Teak oil, Danish oil, and Tung oil however they want with no regards to the actual product or any type of standard. Know what you are using ahead of time. Read stuff from Bob Flexner on finishing before you try and <speaking in general terms>flame anyone about how/what with oil finishes.

So the oil stays wet on the surface for about 15 minutes or so... depending on the temperature outside (if it starts to cure get it up) it was cold on this day and I think I left it wet for 20 minutes. What I try to do is watch the bubbles on Mahogany. When it stops bubbling you have enough penetration... on harder woods just wait until you are bored.

Then I clean all the excess off and hang the guitar somewhere. Then I go in the house and eat some lunch... or build other guitars... don't start drinking yet though.

After about 30 minutes come back and clean up any places where the oil has bubbled out. Keep the guitar clean of oil bubbling from the pores for about 2 hours or until you notice that the little bit you left on the counter has started to cure.

Behlen Teak oil takes a little longer to cure than Danish Oil (especially in the winter) so I wait a few days between coats (rather than the 60 minutes the can suggests). I will do another coat this afternoon or tomorrow...and repeat the above process... then wait a few more days.

I am really not trying to build a film... you really can't do that with a oil mix. I am trying to make sure the wood is covered well. So I will only do 2 coats or so.

After it stops smelling... about a week. I will take it in the house and leave it a day or two. Then when I am absolutely sure it is cured I hit it with BreeWax....

I used a relatively similar process for the 7_B with Danish oil and it still looks like the day I did it. Lets hope this one goes well.

Oil finishes offer very little protection... but with the bloodwood top this guitar really doesn't need much finish.

Edited February 16, 2011 by RestorationAD

[RestorationAD]

I remember a post a year or so ago where the guy used a polymerized tung oil that looked great. I think it built a film and was essentially to tung oil what Tru-Oil is to linseed oil. (Polymerized). I am a fan of watco danish oil and have tried watco teak oil...which IIRC turned out to be nearly the same thing as the danish oil. Have not tried Behlin's. I'm looking forward to your verdict.....and will be watching for the suburbans.

SR

Wow... this is a can of worms.

True Polymerized tung oil is tung oil that is cooked to accelerate the first stage (polymerization) of the two stage (polymerization and oxidation) drying process. However I wouldn't use it alone. Real tung oil takes forever to cure (I wouldn't use it straight). I have a bottle of the good stuff (pure tung oil) and use it for concocting home brews and non-guitar projects. IMHO the pure oils (tung or linseed) just don't provide enough protection.

The other problem is deciding what "Oil Finish" is best. That is a trial and error thing... so few "Tung Oil" finishes are pure tung oil. Most are varnish/tung oil/dryers mix. The two times I tried "Formby's Tung Oil Finish" one went great (Mahogany/Koa 6 string bass) and the other went south (gummy mess) really fast (a Pau Ferro stool). IMHO Tung Oil and oily woods is a risky combo that can be beautiful or ugly.

Tru-Oil is a BLO recipe finish. I believe it is Polymerized linseed oil and "Other oils" mix. I believe it contains Japan Dryer. I like it but... well I just don't know. I have used it several times and had good results. But just not what I wanted.

I am hoping that the Behlen "Teak Oil" which contains some tung oil and god knows what else produces a finish closer to what I want.

I want bare wood. Bare wood that is protected. I will find the best answer... just not sure when or how.

[RestorationAD]

BTW I test these crazy Oil finishes on simple stuff first. Like napkin holders and the lot... I don't just slap it on a guitar to see how it works without some idea of what is going to happen.

This is a disclaimer. If you try Behlen and it sucks please don't blame me.

Edited February 16, 2011 by RestorationAD

[Our Souls inc.]

First up all Teak Oils are different. Manufacturers use names like Teak oil, Danish oil, and Tung oil however they want with no regards to the actual product or any type of standard. Know what you are using ahead of time. Read stuff from Bob Flexner on finishing before you try and flame anyone.

Thanks for the education on 'oils' .

I'm using Watco's Teak oil, which it claims offers great protection, saying it hardens 'in' the wood, not on it. My explorer is holding up fine after almost a year, no wear thru's or faded looking spots and it still feels really smooth. I'll probably keep using it until I find a better wipe on finish, but for ease and function, I'm sticking with this for now.

FWIW, the 'splorer is African mahogany with a Padouk neck

I did notice different levels of glossiness on the bloodwood I did ,Vs. the mahogany, which has a very consistent finish.

[ScottR]

Wow... this is a can of worms.

Nah, I was just curious.

IMHO the pure oils (tung or linseed) just don't provide enough protection.

+1

I want bare wood. Bare wood that is protected.

+2 Well, when I want an oil finish at least. For instance, I will use Watco danish oil on the neck I am currently building and only as much as will soak in. I don't want any sitting on the surface. And it is extremely hard wood. The rest will get lacquer.

SR

[RestorationAD]

First up all Teak Oils are different. Manufacturers use names like Teak oil, Danish oil, and Tung oil however they want with no regards to the actual product or any type of standard. Know what you are using ahead of time. Read stuff from Bob Flexner on finishing before you try and flame anyone.

Thanks for the education on 'oils' .

I'm using Watco's Teak oil, which it claims offers great protection, saying it hardens 'in' the wood, not on it. My explorer is holding up fine after almost a year, no wear thru's or faded looking spots and it still feels really smooth. I'll probably keep using it until I find a better wipe on finish, but for ease and function, I'm sticking with this for now.

FWIW, the 'splorer is African mahogany with a Padouk neck

I did notice different levels of glossiness on the bloodwood I did ,Vs. the mahogany, which has a very consistent finish.

Good to know that the Watco Teak Oil works. How often have you been playing the explorer? (trying to gauge the wear level).

I guess "hardens in the wood" implies that it has resins in it... and that the resin is carried into the wood by the oil??? That would make it an oil/resin mix??? <maybe> Labels can be misleading...

I have done some research and can not find the exact ingredients that make a "Teak Oil".

I would hazard a guess that the glossiness difference between the bloodwood (and other similar hard woods) and the mahogany has to do with the ability of the wood to accent a polish without oil. I know bloodwood will shine like it has a finish bare. Again I am speculating...

[RestorationAD]

Wow... this is a can of worms.

Nah, I was just curious.

I meant just trying to answer the question without saying something stupid...

ok enough on oil voodoo!

I want to finish this thing so I can play it more... best part of running a guitar company. Playing all the new guitars!

[Our Souls inc.]

Good to know that the Watco Teak Oil works. How often have you been playing the explorer? (trying to gauge the wear level).

I guess "hardens in the wood" implies that it has resins in it... and that the resin is carried into the wood by the oil??? That would make it an oil/resin mix??? <maybe> Labels can be misleading...

I have done some research and can not find the exact ingredients that make a "Teak Oil".

I would hazard a guess that the glossiness difference between the bloodwood (and other similar hard woods) and the mahogany has to do with the ability of the wood to accent a polish without oil. I know bloodwood will shine like it has a finish bare. Again I am speculating...

Its not a heavily played guitar, maybe 1/2 hr a week is a good average. but thats around 26 hours of use so far,and/or 3 sets of strings.. it'd be like getting a new axe and playing 15 shows or so without signs of wear. So, at this point its still a win. maybe we'll check back in on it in a year and see ... [/threadjack/finishing tute].........

[RestorationAD]

The second coat doesn't need to be very thick... the guitar is sealed already so no more soaked in. Good to know one coat did most of the work. I might like behlens teak oil after all.

[RestorationAD]

Double post

Edited February 21, 2011 by RestorationAD

[RestorationAD]

Ended up with about 6 coats of oil. It was really more like 3 different soakings though. Saturday I had it out drying in the sun and the wind blew the ladder over... it put a ding in the neck and a small scratch.

I ended up steaming the dent out and then adding another 2 coats of oil to cover everything up...

When I took the guitar out in the sun I saw 600 grit swirl marks on the top. This made me mad. The main reason I hate working in the garage with the door closed in the winter is not being able to see this stuff.

So I went 800, 1000, 1500, 2000 on the guitar using the Teak Oil as a lubricant. After a bit of work I removed all scratches and left a nice clean guitar.

It is curing out this week and should get assembled next week.

[ScottR]

I'll bet it looks glossier this time around.

SR

[RestorationAD]

I'll bet it looks glossier this time around.

SR

It does. Still satin though... It will shine for a little while after I wax it then it will die down again.