djobson101 Posted March 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2017 About time for more updates! I sprung for some acrylic templates, mostly to deal with the f-hole cuts. I wasn't really sure how to go about making a clean template for them and the time I have had to work on the guitar lately, I've been anxious to make progress quickly. So it seemed like a good idea to get these I put the whole body in my router sled with a neck/fretboard template on to take the thickness of the body down enough to allow for the top to sit on top. For whatever reason, I think I went lower than I had originally wanted, but I like seeing the little bit of the neck woods showing through. Seen as the f-holes have some really tight corners, I wanted to try out the drill press routing method. I forget who I recently saw make the post with the link to the video of Robbie O'Brien doing this on a classical head stock - but thank you! It seemed to work pretty good, considering I missed some of the instructions that a second time going back and watching I picked up - had the drill running at too low of an RPM, wasn't being great about removing the waste material from the cut. Not sure if it was my ignorance or the softness of the cedar, or both, but it tore through in some spots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted March 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2017 After a little bit of filling and sanding, I got it looking a little better. If you are looking at it from a foot away, it's a little haggard but it's better than it was. I'm still window shopping for a band saw, so for now I have this contraption - jig saw screwed onto an MDF box it did the trick for this thin piece of cedar, but beyond that it's usefulness will be limited: I used the template from the body route to oil the back of the top & body cavity just to.. protect it from what, I don't know. It's just some furniture polish type stuff from home depot, beeswax & orange oil I believe. Nearly forgot to cut the channels for pickup & bridge grounding wires. That would've been unpleasant! And finally, just went for it and did this: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted March 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2017 Onto some neck updates. Got me a truss rod and some fiber rods! I'll explain in a moment why the good looking picture is first This whole process was done on a day when I was really rushing and it shows. Everything from cutting the rods, to the truss rod channel being slightly too wide (template moved on me maybe? not sure), to THIS: I was too impatient to make investments to do this job via the router, so I hastily decided to go back to the drill press routing, and of course, being that the body is present, made it a huge pain in the ass. On one of the passes I didn't realize that the body pushing against the column on the drill press forced the template out of place... Not something that'll be seen of course, but I will certainly hit the drawing board much more seriously in the future as far as which steps need to be done first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Natural Posted March 13, 2017 Report Share Posted March 13, 2017 7 hours ago, djobson101 said: Seen as the f-holes have some really tight corners, I wanted to try out the drill press routing method. I forget who I recently saw make the post with the link to the video of Robbie O'Brien doing this on a classical head stock - but thank you! It seemed to work pretty good, considering I missed some of the instructions that a second time going back and watching I picked up - had the drill running at too low of an RPM, wasn't being great about removing the waste material from the cut. Not sure if it was my ignorance or the softness of the cedar, or both, but it tore through in some spots. that is a bummer. One thing I have noticed with that method is its best to make the first few passes VERY shallow- so as to cut the surface of the wood ever so slightly- then maybe once two or three passes are done you can hog out more as you are deeper in the cut. it also helps to re-file the cutting end on the drill bit you are using- do you think maybe you tried to hog out too much on the top layer? also- the pattern template usually holds the wood "down" as the drill bit cuts- I noticed on the pic above- there is no tape underneath (or near) where the f holes are- perhaps the pattern template was lose under there(?) I hate this happened to you- I love that method and tout it all the time. This build is coming along nicely- even the couple of hickups which you have appeared to recovered from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted March 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2017 On 3/13/2017 at 7:14 AM, Mr Natural said: that is a bummer. One thing I have noticed with that method is its best to make the first few passes VERY shallow- so as to cut the surface of the wood ever so slightly- then maybe once two or three passes are done you can hog out more as you are deeper in the cut. it also helps to re-file the cutting end on the drill bit you are using- do you think maybe you tried to hog out too much on the top layer? also- the pattern template usually holds the wood "down" as the drill bit cuts- I noticed on the pic above- there is no tape underneath (or near) where the f holes are- perhaps the pattern template was lose under there(?) I hate this happened to you- I love that method and tout it all the time. This build is coming along nicely- even the couple of hickups which you have appeared to recovered from. Overall it was a fun process, but yeah I'm pretty sure I probably tried to go in too heavy. I would like to practice this method some more in the future - definitely satisfying in it's own way. And thanks! Of course at the moment they happen the hickups are a real drag, but in exchange for learning through experience it's not a bad trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted March 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2017 After much deliberation, I decided to make a slotting jig with the table saw blade they sell on LMII. Basically just cut a little MDF "pin" to recess into a sled, and then marked and cut position slots with a small router bit onto another sheet of MDF to tape the fret board wood to. I didn't do the greatest job of getting good angles to show what's going on in the sled but you probably get the idea. The fretboard is attached to the side of the MDF piece closer to the middle of the sled and those little jig clamps keep it pressed against the bottom of the sled. And then the "pin" is up against the back of the sled. So on the fretboard wood - I bought a piece of mora from the local Rockler store knowing not a whole lot about the wood. It's pretty hard stuff right? Are there any other pros/cons/indifference for this as a fretboard choice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted March 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2017 Before gluing, shaped the end of the fretboard to the same template that I had used to take the body down for the top to slide on. Kind of starting to visualize that the strings are gonna be higher off the body than I would've liked - in terms of the combined height of the fretboard and the bit of the neck that is peeking out mistakes were made when I was removing material to allow for the top to sit on there. It may come down ever so slightly when radiusing the fretboard I guess. Will have to wait and see.. Dun dun dun! Trimmed up: That's about where I'm at for now. I'm really hoping to make some good progress this next week in a couple different areas. Going to want to start carving the neck soon. I have all the hardware now, so have to figure out how to start tackling the bridge & nut placement. Tuner holes Figure out the electronics cavity and hope that I don't tear out massive chunks that you can see through the f-holes (perhaps should've started some kind of opening before the back was glued on. Oh well) At this point, I couldn't wait any longer to do a mockup: One last thing I should ask - I have 2 sets of ferrules like these. Is that proper usage of the hardware, or do they make a different style ferrule for where the string goes through the body like this? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightroExpress Posted March 27, 2017 Report Share Posted March 27, 2017 Looking very nice! I get a very cool Languedoc sort of vibe here. To answer your ferrule question: yes, there are specific top-side ferrules. Allparts stocks them here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariahrob Posted March 27, 2017 Report Share Posted March 27, 2017 This is such a great thread. It's great to see you overcome the little hurdles and also interesting as I'm a step behind with my semi hollow build. Yours is looking ace and really like your approach to jig building and so on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted March 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 @KnightroExpress it is indeed quite Languedoc inspired I should say, at least leaning in that direction. I can't imagine how many hours that guy put into making some of those guitars, especially getting into all that crazy binding and inlay. Thanks for the reference too, I'll be getting a set of those ferrules on order asap. @Pariahrob thanks! I'm definitely discovering my learning curve on it. Probably my biggest setback is learning to plan more and be patient before cutting wood. I guess I will have to employ this philosophy on the next build Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted April 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 I started to play with shaping up the back of the headstock and some neck carving. I still have a ways to go because I was very apprehensive about removing too much material from the neck. And for good measure wiped some mineral spirits on. I am beginning to see why people like doing this! It's still rough with scratches but now I'm really excited to get further along. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted April 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 One bad habit I keep repeating is jumping around to different jobs before completing them. I definitely feel like it is somewhat detrimental to work flow, but sometimes when I only have a short time in the evening to work on the guitar I'll hop around out of just plain old impatience. Routed for humbuckers: Then decided to drill the bridge post holes, and ack did that bit wander! As for the band aids: Decided to invest in some nicer brad tip bits for the second attempt. Happier test fit than last time! So I am going to need to get a router bit with a longer shank to complete the humbucker cavities. Can't cruise the router around the body at the neck position with that fretboard glued on... Maybe a written list of processes is in order for next time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted April 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 Managed to find some time to get back to the LP project. I'm going to just link to the old thread instead of updating the threads individually: I am happy to report that the second time using the drill press routing for f-holes, it turned out much better. I used the same template from the other guitar. Finally got the top glued on, and cleaned it up on the spindle sander. Ran a cove bit around and drilled/routed for electronics. Randomly decided that it will have independent volumes & master tone. So you can still do the "on-off-cool-les paul-thing", but I don't care for 2 tones. And mini toggles for coil tapping: Don't ask about that horrendous truss rod channel... lol. Never will I ever attempt to make that cut on a neck that's shaped already, I just didn't have a choice and the old impatient gremlins were at it again. Couldn't keep a template on it for anything and for what this guitar is, I'm just going to live with it. Did some carving on the top. I forgot to take during pictures but came up with this: I want to soften the line some more at the top of the cove. Will have to get back to that soon. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted April 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 Slotted this piece that I've been saving for the fretboard. I am going to have to do some math to place the bridge... I used my 27" template but started at the 2nd fret because it measured that it would fit into the old fretboard area, and I still got 22 frets. So I have no idea what the scale length is. I will need to go back to the scale length calculator I used on stewmac and subtract whatever the 2nd fret value is from 27... Sound right? Dug out some old epiphone humbuckers (that I won't be using for this) to do a mockup. The only work that was from tonight was starting the nut slot & radiusing the fretboard: I'm going with a 20" radius, so hopefully it shouldn't be too much of a PITA to glue. We shall see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottR Posted April 6, 2017 Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 This is looking good! F-holes came out quite nice this time around. SR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted April 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2017 Thanks Scott! I am thrilled with them and definitely will feel better about tackling them in the future. But I regrettably now have discovered that I messed things up on the LP. Since I was lazy in making a new template for the 24.75" fretboard and just "wung" it by using frets 2-24 of the 27" scale from the other build - I ended up with a ~24" length... Putting my bridge post location right inside the bridge humbucker cavity that was supposed to be 3/4" from the bridge Looks like it's gonna be shelved for awhile. Just a small update on the semi hollow. I did some more neck carving, during the process I noticed that while having the body clamped to the table and the neck free, there was a lot more movement than I was comfortable with.. I am thinking I removed too much material with that heel cutaway thing. Glued in a piece of walnut to try and stabilize things more, then gave it the pass with the round nose bit and a little carving. I don't know how effective it'll be but next time I won't remove as much wood. So now I have this weird transition area (wiped everything with spirits for inspiration): I have no recollection of where that hole near the scarfed joint came from, but it appeared so there it is That's it for now. Hoping next week to tackle the nut, tuning machines and ferrules! Thanks for checking out. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottR Posted April 22, 2017 Report Share Posted April 22, 2017 13 hours ago, djobson101 said: So now I have this weird transition area Before I read your explanation I was thinking what a cool little heel carve. You might want to add at least one more walnut accent to balance it out. Maybe a cavity cover? SR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted May 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2017 You know... The cavity cover is one of those things I've been overlooking since the beginning... using walnut there would certainly even things out and look cool. I think it has been decided Now if I can just catch a break from painting houses, I might be able to get some more much needed time back in the shop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu. Posted May 3, 2017 Report Share Posted May 3, 2017 This is all looking great! You have some pretty sweet jig-making skills too. Just as an aside, is your bridge perfectly perpendicular to the centre line? People would usually angle the bass side backwards slightly; the saddles on a Tune-O-Matic don't have a huge range of travel, so it can help with intonation. I don't know what the tolerance is like though. It may only be important for particular scale lengths or tunings. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted May 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2017 I do remember reading that there should be a slight offset there, which I did forget. I will probably redrill this post since I'm still at a good point to hack this guitar up a little more I'm currently struggling with getting the ferrule holes on the back properly drilled as well. They came out fine on the front but I didn't prepare a good system for aligning them the 2nd time around and they came out pretty lousy and uneven The front ones that I bought required an 11/64" hole so.. I think the plan is to clamp a piece of wood/wood box to the drill press big enough to allow the bit to sit decently flush within it, drill the 11/64 hole in that, and then use the end of the bit that goes in the chuck as a locating pin to drop the front of the guitar onto when drilling the larger 3/8" holes for the back ferrules. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu. Posted May 4, 2017 Report Share Posted May 4, 2017 The best solution I've seen, beyond using CNC, is to have an old ~3mm drill bit mounted on MDF as a locating pin (as you've suggested). If you drill half depth from the front and half from the rear, it won't matter if the bit wanders slightly. Someone on here had a great example, but I don't remember who! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan_kara Posted May 5, 2017 Report Share Posted May 5, 2017 Could be this one from RAD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted May 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2017 Wow! Thanks for linking that thread @pan_kara. There really is so much great material on this forum, I've only seen such a small fraction of it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyjr1515 Posted May 6, 2017 Report Share Posted May 6, 2017 I like the look of the back very much. Love that little bit of walnut The carve on the top is pretty cool too 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djobson101 Posted May 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2017 Back tracking just a bit with this update - this was the original run of ferrule drilling. As mentioned, while they came out okay enough on the front... The back, was another story. In the end, I plugged both sets and did it again. Redo of the front (and compensating for the TOM bridge post, to make for the 3rd attempt..): And after employing the old bit-in-the-box-o-matic, got the rears much more acceptable: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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