Mr_Riddlers build thread

[Prostheta]

Nice! What camera are you using? Myself and Brett could possibly help with settings if you're using a DSLR or semi-advanced device. A tripod or some other way of keeping the camera still for longer exposures/slower shutter speeds makes a huge difference.

This was taken with the room light off, with the glow of the monitor in the background. It's very close to how it looks in real life.

 

Settings were ISO 100 at half a second shutter speed. Lens is a Canon EFS f2.8 24mm STM. You could run the CCD sensitivity at up to ISO 800 with little added noise for a faster shutter speed, but since it's static and on a tripod, you can go for broke on the ISO. In low light, any handheld shot will be very poor either because of the long exposure times required to capture enough light or a lot of noise from a super high sensitive ISO. A larger aperture lens helps (such as the 50mm f1.8 Brett mentioned, which I use also) however you have a far shorted depth of field and tighter framing, especially with crop sensors like that in my EOS 100D.

I hope this was good info, or at least helps you figure out the direction to research this field. 

[Mr_Riddler]

Well, since my regular camera have taken a permanent vacation the only one I have at the moment is my cell phone 😂 think I will be buying a decent one later on.

Any chance someone could talk me out of doing fluorescent bindings on this one? 

[Prostheta]

Do you mean luminescent? Some materials do fluoresce however I'd guess you are matching up the inlays. Go for it! How are you thinking of managing this?

[Mr_Riddler]

Yes, the same stuff I used on the body and fretboard, well I think I need to make something to keep it in place, dammit! You was supposed to talk me out of it 😂

[Mr Natural]

you know when someone says "hold me back" they get pushed into the middle of whatever it was they didnt want to get into. I think that would look absolutely killer. 

I am not a big fan of carbon fiber on guitars- but your design, style and execution on this so far has been excellent. Well done man. Keep it up. 

[Mr_Riddler]

3 hours ago, Mr Natural said:

you know when someone says "hold me back" they get pushed into the middle of whatever it was they didnt want to get into. I think that would look absolutely killer. 

I am not a big fan of carbon fiber on guitars- but your design, style and execution on this so far has been excellent. Well done man. Keep it up. 

 

 

Yeah, I know what you mean. Maybe I do the bindings after all. But it's not fun if it looks to much. But I think it will turn out great, Only time will tell. 

[Prostheta]

If I were doing this myself, I would rout the channels for the binding, then dam them up with tape or a thin strip of polyethylene (epoxy doesn't stick to it well). Then pour or inject the epoxy mix into the channel with a syringe. Music Man do a similar process with their "liquid binding" which is injected into a channel cut by CNC. When dried, the outline is cut and the binding is an integral part of the body blank. I wouldn't risk trying it here, however that is one way to go about it.

@StratsRdivine would have better advice to kick mine straight to the kerb I bet. I wouldn't mind trying this using straight off the shelf Z-Poxy 30min. Maybe in the future I will.

[Mr_Riddler]

5 minutes ago, Prostheta said:

If I were doing this myself, I would rout the channels for the binding, then dam them up with tape or a thin strip of polyethylene (epoxy doesn't stick to it well). Then pour or inject the epoxy mix into the channel with a syringe. Music Man do a similar process with their "liquid binding" which is injected into a channel cut by CNC. When dried, the outline is cut and the binding is an integral part of the body blank. I wouldn't risk trying it here, however that is one way to go about it.

@StratsRdivine would have better advice to kick mine straight to the kerb I bet. I wouldn't mind trying this using straight off the shelf Z-Poxy 30min. Maybe in the future I will.

 

 

Yeah, that's probably the way I would do it too..

[Prostheta]

I find that the epoxy gets very grainy and prone to picking up air once a decent amount of luminescent powder is in there. It would make working a chore to get down in 15-20 mins, plus a larger than usual batch would be required. Again, all about that ticking clock. The idea would need a lot of testing, practice and proofing before committing.

[Mr_Riddler]

That's right and the powder don't dissolve in the resin so it sinks to the bottom of the jar. This isn't really a problem when pouring into a channel that isn't visible to the sides. But when doing a standard binding channel this could result in a grainy line at the bottom of the channel, That would be a nightmare. maybe it's possible to do the pouring with the body standing vertical, or maybe it's possible to do the pouring after 2 hours or so when it's a little more sticky. 

 

[Prostheta]

It really depends on the epoxy. The dot casting tutorial I did used Z-Poxy 15min and I used a LOT of powder. Since it isn't miscible with the epoxy but wets, I figured that it shouldn't affect the process and I went hell for leather. That's why the pot up there (which was a byproduct of that tutorial) is seriously bright. I didn't notice any settling out, however I was working on a far shorter timescale than yours.

[StratsRdivine]

Pouring epoxy as pour-in-place binding is what I would do too.  The real trick to keeping pigments suspended without settling is to mix in Cab-O-sil, as a thickening (Thixotropic) agent.  This works great in epoxy, and many epoxy mfr's sell it as the primary thickening agent, although may not reveal the common name, mostly known as cab-o-sil, which is finely ground fumed silica powder.  Add enough and the mixture won't even pour.  Add just the right amount and your pigment will stay in suspension fine without settling.  It does tend to add a tiny amount of opacity, making it slightly white. 

[Prostheta]

What's your opinion on the percentage of glow powder to an epoxy? I used (let me see if I have a photo)....

33%!!!

 

It was kind of like melted buttercream consistency.

 

Drizzled fine. The remaining (about 1/2"?) product in the pot cured without any noticeable separation. Not sure if the sheer quantity of glow powder product had anything to do with that. The components were pre-heated a little.

[Mr_Riddler]

47 minutes ago, StratsRdivine said:

Pouring epoxy as pour-in-place binding is what I would do too.  The real trick to keeping pigments suspended without settling is to mix in Cab-O-sil, as a thickening (Thixotropic) agent.  This works great in epoxy, and many epoxy mfr's sell it as the primary thickening agent, although may not reveal the common name, mostly known as cab-o-sil, which is finely ground fumed silica powder.  Add enough and the mixture won't even pour.  Add just the right amount and your pigment will stay in suspension fine without settling.  It does tend to add a tiny amount of opacity, making it slightly white. 

 

 

Thanks! that's some great info i will look into that.

@Prostheta Well that's ALOT of glow powder  I used maybe 20% Also painted the channels with white paint before the pour that made a huge difference.

 

[Prostheta]

I wanted to see how much product I could get the epoxy to handle before it refused to bind it together or became too gritty. I think it might have handled more....even though I think by this point it was a case of diminishing returns.

[StratsRdivine]

Its hard to overfill epoxy.  When I fill the back of my quilted carbon fiber, I mix in glass microspheres (glass bubbles) to displace volume (cutting cost of expensive epoxy) and act as a sanding aid.  I add as much as 150 to 200% by volume.  Then the epoxy acts like morter around the "bricks".  Then add cab-o-sil, of course to thicken it more so it spreads like frosting.  

You would have to add a lot of pigment to degrade the properties.  

One trick is to mix in to capacity, then heat it gently, which wets out the pigment.  Then it flows better, bonds better, but apply it before it kicks.  

[Prostheta]

That's probably the best way in this proposed application. Not sure how much of a window the 30min Z-Poxy (since I prefer to talk about simpler off the shelf stuff) might have given the mixing time, and whether heating closes that window up for pouring. It would need to be very organised.

[Stu.]

Do you chaps have any experience mixing the glow in the dark pigments with casting resins?

[Chuck_Chill-Out]

On 9/18/2017 at 2:38 PM, StratsRdivine said:

Pouring epoxy as pour-in-place binding is what I would do too.  The real trick to keeping pigments suspended without settling is to mix in Cab-O-sil, as a thickening (Thixotropic) agent.  This works great in epoxy, and many epoxy mfr's sell it as the primary thickening agent, although may not reveal the common name, mostly known as cab-o-sil, which is finely ground fumed silica powder.  Add enough and the mixture won't even pour.  Add just the right amount and your pigment will stay in suspension fine without settling.  It does tend to add a tiny amount of opacity, making it slightly white. 

@ProsthetaFrom a safety standpoint (sorry for being late to the party) how fie is the silica powder? Silicosis is a nasty respiratory condition.

 

And @Mr_Riddler, this is a cool build.

[StratsRdivine]

 

1 hour ago, Chuck_Chill-Out said:

@ProsthetaFrom a safety standpoint (sorry for being late to the party) how fie is the silica powder? Silicosis is a nasty respiratory condition.

Pretty fine.  Got me interested, as I likely have the most exposure on this forum, and need to be wary, but for occasional use, I wouldnt worry about silicosis, especially when using a respirator or just not inhaling when mixing this stuff  "Brief or casual exposure to low levels of crystalline silica dust are said to not produce clinically significant lung disease" from Wikipedia.  

[Prostheta]

I haven't been able to source casting resins at a reasonable price here (yet, I have things in the works) and don't have enough direct experience or knowledge to compare.

I would say that any exposure is bad, and I'm unsure whether "casual" carries to much of a lightweight attitude to it. "Casual asbestos exposure" wouldn't be fine. I think that protecting yourself is a bare minimum at all levels otherwise you risk being too casual with where the line is drawn. I work with dust on an occupational level though, so I need to be zero tolerance. Silicosis is highly unlikely for most, but a lot of unpleasant side effects occur in the range....I can end up with sleep apnea if I have a bad day and allow myself to be dusted by the table saw without a respirator for extended periods of time. It's a concern for me.

[Chuck_Chill-Out]

On 9/20/2017 at 11:42 PM, StratsRdivine said:

 

Pretty fine.  Got me interested, as I likely have the most exposure on this forum, and need to be wary, but for occasional use, I wouldnt worry about silicosis, especially when using a respirator or just not inhaling when mixing this stuff  "Brief or casual exposure to low levels of crystalline silica dust are said to not produce clinically significant lung disease" from Wikipedia.  

Got it. I appreciate the explanation. Sometimes I can't turn off my job.

[Mr_Riddler]

Well last time I posted I was thinking about doing luminescent bindings. So I gave it some more thought and at least I could do a test piece. But then nobody remembers a coward right? So I routed the channels and made the pouring without testing this idea first. Kinda stupid but in worst case scenario I would just rout it off and start again.

So how did it turn out? Pretty darn good. But still got a lot of scraping left and some areas needs a refill. But I'm very pleased with the result

 

[pan_kara]

wow this looks awesome! and cool design

damnit now I'm gonna go online looking for glow in the dark powder ....

[Mr_Riddler]

2 hours ago, pan_kara said:

wow this looks awesome! and cool design

damnit now I'm gonna go online looking for glow in the dark powder ....

Thanks! Do that it's fun stuff! 

Just saw your swirl video awesome build, how about a luminescent swirl?