Bronze guitar

[boeba]

Hi guys,

it's been 2 years since i posted anything on this forum. For those who want to know where it started, check this old post.

http://www.projectguitar.com/forums/topic/47824-ibanez-grg-170-dx-conversion-to-order-of-the-dracul/?page=2&tab=comments#comment-556763

for a long time i let this guitar unfinished and started to think what else i could come up with.
i have a background in modern art(sculpture), 3d printing, bronze/classic sculptures. 
From this point i started to search the internet for other people who experimented with 3d printed guitars.
To be honest, one of the first designs who caught my eye, was the "zoybar". It's an open source community where you can download 3d parts to build your own guitar. 

https://zoybar.net/

This concept got me fired to start designing my own 3d printed guitar => converted to bronze.

The first concept guitar i made was based on the zoybar, but with some extra shapes which would define the silhouet.

These first 2 images are computer renderings. Design sketches to see how things would work in 360°.

This image below is the next design where i worked with seperate pieces. The yellow would eventually become bronze mounted to an aluminium rail.

 

On this model ( the 3 images above) the center/core of the guitar was just a basic rail with some shapes attached.
This first concept was my starting point to build a bronze core where you could attach side wings.

Sooooo, i think this is enough for one post, but i still have a lot of pictures and progress made by now.For those of you who want to see where i am at right now, you can check my instagram page.

https://www.instagram.com/boebac/?hl=nl

But in a couple of days i intend to post more updates on this forum.

Greetings,

Boeba

 

 

[boeba]

Part 2

 

so after this first prototype i decided to take it a step further. Since my job involves casting bronze sculptures, i wanted to make the center/core of the guitar out of bronze.

Again, after a lot of 3d sketches, i came up with this design.

 

 

Don't mind the blue wings. Before i designed the silhouet, i first wanted to make the spine of the guitar, to see if bronze was a good material to make a electric guitar. So the next step was to 3d print this piece.

 

As you can see, i drew on the 3d print to show there was to much material which would affect the weight. So in my computermodel i immediately changed this for version 2.0.

 

 

 

That's it for part 2. In the next update i want to show you guys some images of the proces to cast this in bronze.

Greetings,

 

Boeba

 

 

[ScottR]

1 hour ago, boeba said:

In the next update i want to show you guys some images of the proces to cast this in bronze.

I'm looking forward to seeing that.

You've got some very artistic designs working here.

SR

[curtisa]

That's a pretty out-there design you have going. Reminds me a bit of Michael Spalt's work.

[boeba]

14 hours ago, ScottR said:

I'm looking forward to seeing that.

You've got some very artistic designs working here.

SR

 

4 hours ago, curtisa said:

That's a pretty out-there design you have going. Reminds me a bit of Michael Spalt's work.

I know his works and can only take it as a compliment..;). Such amazing designs, and use of different materials.

 I won't reinvent the wheel, since he already went this road, but still i can try to come up with something of my own.

B

[FINEFUZZ]

This is fantastic!  I like how you achieved such an organic form though your process.   It is so cool that bronze can be realized by marring age-old processes with modern technology.

 

The central form looks like something out of the Dark Crystal.  

[boeba]

Part 3: The 3d printed backbone of the guitar casting in bronze

 

 

I hope the picture explains itself.

I just added some gating in wax directly onto my model. These are just the fundamentals of bronzecasting,

The next step is to fully cover this model with a kind of plaster.

Everything is covered except the pouring cup and the air vents(green)

 

I don't have pictures of the next steps, because my hands are always dirty when i'm at work.But we do have a mold lying around in the foundry to explain the next step to customers. 

 

 

As you can see, it's another model we used, but the principle is the same. Keep in mind this is just one half of a mold.....:)   (just for demonstration purpose)

The next step is to put these molds in the kiln, oven, furnace..@ 600°C

 depending on the size, 1 day to 2 weeks for big molds 

To show you guys the difference in size.

the biggest mold here was about 2 ton. (converter says it should be 4400 lbs..)

Feel free to ask any questions about this proces or anything else.

In the next update i wil upload some casting video's.....;)

 

B

 

 

 

[boeba]

Hi Guys,

 

This is a typical casting day. The big molds probably weigh 500-1000 kg at average.

 

 

Blocks of bronze sunbathing.

 

 

 

This is a video of some bronze casting. I just noticed this happens to be the part where one of the molds breaks, so actually what you are seeing is a little bronzefail...

Greetings,

 

B

Edited August 3, 2018 by boeba

[FINEFUZZ]

How do you address porosity in the castings?  When you finish a piece for a customer is any porosity acceptable?

This issue is a struggle for me because I would like to eliminate every small defect, but maybe  a small degree is acceptable like small knots in wood.

I haven't encountered any voids that need filling on my guitar, but I have been peen hammering the small defects which becomes its own challenge for creating smooth surfaces.

 

Paul 

[boeba]

On 8/3/2018 at 6:52 PM, FINEFUZZ said:

How do you address porosity in the castings?  When you finish a piece for a customer is any porosity acceptable?

This issue is a struggle for me because I would like to eliminate every small defect, but maybe  a small degree is acceptable like small knots in wood.

I haven't encountered any voids that need filling on my guitar, but I have been peen hammering the small defects which becomes its own challenge for creating smooth surfaces.

 

Paul 

When we have porosity it gets cleaned up with welding or working with metaltools to get the artefefacts out of the bronze.

But like you say, it's a struggle to get every little piece out of the bronze.

[Prostheta]

Wow, so much yes in this one.

[boeba]

hi guys,

Next update:

 

So after the bronze was casted into the mold. I finally could take the casted piece out of the plaster, to see what the result was.

Feast your eyeeeezzzz...

 

 

 

 

As you can see this is a rough cast, and i just took the gating of the piece. I am always amazed to see your own plastic computer designed and 3d printed stuff take shape into solid metal. 

After this i cleaned it up, sanded the piece to get the dirt and little stuff off. And then we have this.....

 

 

The orange version was the first one printed, but had a wrong scale length, and to much excess shape/weight. 

 

 

 

 

 

And here she is. My bronze guitar. In this stadium, it's just the backbone of my future model i want to make. But first i wanted to try to make the basics, and put some strings on it, to see if it could be tuned.

The next step was to design some ergonomic nice shapes to define my guitar.

Stay tuned....

Owyeah, keep in mind that the neck you see is just a cheap neck i bought online. For the final guitar i will make something different.

Benoit

 

 

[Prostheta]

Damn cool, Benoit. Did bronze shrinkage factor in at all?

[Andyjr1515]

Gosh - that is something else.  Literally!  Very impressive.

You may have already said, but what weight is this piece, trimmed up like this?

[Prostheta]

I'd imagine it's like a boat anchor.

[boeba]

On 8/15/2018 at 9:09 PM, Prostheta said:

Damn cool, Benoit. Did bronze shrinkage factor in at all?

I would have to check it when i take the neck off again. But yess, it shrinks a couple % of a millimeter.

But not enough for me to have measurement issues or other technical problems. i made exact holes in the 3d model where the neck should go, and when i casted the pieces all the holes alligned for 99,1%. Something like that...:).

 

On 8/16/2018 at 10:22 AM, Andyjr1515 said:

Gosh - that is something else.  Literally!  Very impressive.

You may have already said, but what weight is this piece, trimmed up like this?

I remember i wrote it somewhere, but i can't find it back. When i take it apart again i will remember to weigh it.

Greetings,

 

Benoit

[boeba]

Next update: Pickups

Hi guys, so what is a electric guitar without pickups.....

 

 

Just a picture with the pickups thrown onto the bronze...:)

At this moment the pickups are just stock taken from my ibanez grg170dx.

 

I needed to make some kind of brackets to mount the pups onto.

 

 

And somekind of cavity for the controls.( at this point i didn't know what to do with them, but in the future updates you will see what i've come up with.

 

And voila, a bad picture of the pickups mounted on the bronze shape.

 

And here it is. A somewhat working electric guitar.

Don't mind the shabby playing and face...;)

At this point it wasn't easy for me to play this thing because i had no handsupport so my hand keeps " falling".

The bronze piece itself has no support to place it onto my leg or anything so it keeps rolling over as you can see.

But!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The next update will be a journey, a journey into shapes and forms. The quest for the ultimate design for this bronze beast.

Stay tuned.

 

Benoit

[boeba]

Hi guys,

Now the time has come to start designing the shapes around the bronze core. 

 

 

At this point these are just sketches, i want to find out what works, and what not.

If i see something i like, i take a closer look at it and start playing with the possibilities .

 

 

 

 

And this was my first batch of skecthes. In the next update you will see the shapes taking another turn.

Greetings,

Benoit

 

 

 

[Prostheta]

I like your mockup photo. It reminds me of a random genetic fitness test generator. "L" seems the most ergonomic, at least for a righty! Thigh rest, arm rest. I like it.

[Andyjr1515]

6 hours ago, Prostheta said:

I like your mockup photo. It reminds me of a random genetic fitness test generator. "L" seems the most ergonomic, at least for a righty! Thigh rest, arm rest. I like it.

Yeah - me too!

Could be stunning.  Another month for me to avoid entering anything when this goes up for Guitar Of The Month! 

[boeba]

Hi guys,

 

Ready for the next update??:)

 

 

I ended up with this choice because it felt the most appealing to me. And after i made the design in 3d i had to make it ready for 3d print.......

 

 

 

I don't know if you guys can see it but there are actually 4 parts. 2 small braces who connect with the bronze.....These are just 2 small pieces to be cast in bronze before i can mount the big wings onto the bronze core.

 

 

 

 

The 2 pics above are just the 2 pieces with gating attached, ready to go in a investement mold and be casted in bronze.

(don't mind the yellow pieces, it's from another customer)

 

Greetings, 

 

Benoit

 

 

 

 

 

[Prostheta]

I'm genuinely wondering what sort of contribution to the instrument's tone that bronze adds! Lightly-potted pickups would help make the structure sing more. At least, that's my first thought.

Stunning application of what you're versed in, Benoit.

[Guitar Goomba]

All I can say is, holy crap, that is amazing.

[boeba]

hi guys, ready for the next update?

With the last update you could see the 2 braces 3d printed and ready to be cast in bronze.

 

and here it is.....

 

 

 

And in the next pics you can see the braces welded onto the bronze core

 

I just love how this piece looks like some kind of modern sculpture. Reminds me somewhat of zaha hadid kind of shapes. On the other hand it looks a bit like a little creature/crab thing.

And now the complete piece with the neck mounted.....

At this point i need some solution for the controls. And seeing the complete guitar hanging on my wall, the first thing what comes in mind is that the bronze+wings looks to small compared to the neck, to small in length, and in width.

In the next pic you can see the guitar in human hands..:)

To me the big wing doesn't feel big enough compared to the person. So i think i will change my design in the computer and reprint some parts i think. This sounds like double work, but i had to see my first design in real life to make the right adjustments. Seeing a computerdesign on screen clearly isn't the same as irl.

 

Thnx,

B

 

 

[Andyjr1515]

This continues as one of the most fascinating threads...

Size and proportions against the 'player' actually looks OK to me.