monkey69962000 Posted June 28, 2005 Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 i was going to ask the same thing. Im waiting on a part 4 and 5 if there is a five. Those were great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jnewman Posted June 28, 2005 Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 (edited) Hi...quick question...is connecting the +ve and -ve terminals together (short circuiting) a "safe" way to turn off and on a circuit...I'm imagining the battery might not like it... I ask because I may be able to work out a way to ground the othe non used pickups and maybe even drain the circuit caps (to address the pop problem) if that's the case... Otherwise...have to come up with something else...any takers.... ← This is a Bad Idea. When you connect +ve and -ve together, you have the battery discharging through essentially impedance-free wires. The only impedance in the circuit is the battery's internal impedance - which for normal alkaline batteries is between 1 and 3 ohms. So, for the 9 volt battery you're using to power that bad boy, you'll get between 3 and 9 amps of current depending on where in the discharge cycle you are. This being the case, your average 9V alkaline battery only has around a 600mAh capacity - so you'll discharge the battery completely in, say, six minutes. If, that is, the battery survives - it will heat up enough from dissipating ALL the released energy internally that its guts may swell enough to rupture the case, covering your electronics and the insides of the guitar with poisonous, corrosive nasties. Please don't do that, that's a pretty guitar and you've put a lot of work into this . EDIT: Oh, by the way, just as an added bit of info... Energizer rates their standard alkaline 9V batteries for just 25mA of continuous drain - shorting the terminals gives, at a minimum, 100 times that. Edited June 28, 2005 by jnewman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Thanks for the response guys.... This is a Bad Idea. I thought so...just wanted to be sure...I wonder how this jack switch is supposed to work though...also I use rechargable batteries and they're too expensive to waste by exploding.... Please don't do that, that's a pretty guitar and you've put a lot of work into this . I'm not sure if everyone would think that it's pretty...it's really something just to try out ideas with...but it does have a soft spot with me I must admit...more of an ugly duckling I would have said... I'll have to come up with some other way to address the quirks and pops...hmmm hm...really late in the game to be asking such a stupid question - but just for clarification - how do you hook the driver up to the rest of the circuit? Can't be that stupid... i was going to ask the same thing. Ok...the sustainer is really quite simple in principle and in hookup but a full installation requires patching into the guitar...if we ignore the installation and how it interacts with the guitar...here's the basics... The bridge pickup is used to pickup the sound of the strings vibrating and is hooked up directly to the preamplifier...so pickup direct to preamp... The preamp is used to prevent the circuitry from loading down the pickups and badly effecting tone and output...it also provides a lot of a boost, so that the signal from the bridge pickup is now extra hot... In my circuit there is a gain control (volume control pot) between the preamp and the poweramp... Then comes the poweramp which amplifies this hot signal to a level enough to driver a speaker, or in this case our driver... The driver/speaker wires leave the poweramp and go to a DPDT switch that is set up to reverse (or exchange) the wires (ie the green becomes the blue, blue becomes green)...this is the harmonic switch... The wires leave the harmonic switch and go to the driver...each wire simply attaches to each end of the coil... So... Bridge PUp=>Preamp=>vol=>poweramp=>harmonic switch=>driver Now, to install it you need a switch that will connect power to the circuit and bypass all pickups except for the bridge pickup. So, the sustainer will only work with the bridge pickup sound I'm afraid as this is the furthest from the driver and this distance is important...otherwise the thing just squeels from the electromagnetic interferance... So...in my installation, I'm using a DPDT switch...one side simply connects the positive leads of the battery together...the other side disconnects the hot (ie not the ground) signals from the neck and middle pickups and connects the bridge pickup so that, no matter the position of the selector, the bridge pickup is always on and the others always off in operation. ZoSo Spencer also PM'ed me whether I could make some recordings...Last time they didn't work out too well but LK kindly hosted them for me...I certainly will give it another shot and I'm sure they'll work out better this time...I'm very proud of this thing, so stay tuned for some DIY Sustainer Sounds in the future... So, now it's back to playing the guitar.... psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDRockStar Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 thanks for the detailed reply psw - another Q - i remember the DPDT switch diagram that came up earlier was incorrect or something does anybody have the right version of it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Not really...yet...as everybodys guitar switching will be different... Basically, you want to have two outputs...one from the bridge and one from any other pickups from the selector to the sustainer switch. The switch then substitutes the bridge pickup for the neck pickup (and mid on a strat, say)...a line then goes from the switch to the volume controls and out to the guitar as normal. You also want a line from the selector bridge to the volume pot so that it can be used when the sustainer is off as normal, if selected... The other side of the switch is simply power on as described but not to ground when off...for the above warned reasons... I've not gone into a lot of detail on this yet as I don't have the answers yet to some of the problems I've encountered...switch poping, interferance from inactive pickups... It may be I'll need to use a 3PDT or even a 4PDT to address these problems lifting both the ground and hots of the pickups and possibly the battery...I'd rather not but it's a possible solution...digital switching would be another but that's more circuitry and wiring... One thing I'm thinking may also do something, is a buffer on the total guitar's output...so that some circuitry is always on...well it's a thought...the other problems are still a mystery but with two other people putting stuff together, Pekko and Tim, we may get a better idea of what's wrong and how to fix them. I think it's better to do this than put up information that misleads anyone and needs to be corrected later...meanwhile, I'm sure people would be happy to help nut out any particular installation queries but solutions are so far unknown... I'll eventually draw up the crazy wiring of my guitar to see if that helps too but it maybe a little confusing... Something else I noticed...the sustainer does not have to be plugged into an amp to experience these problems...Might also be some loose winding in the middle and or neck pickup causing some symptoms...It's a thought, though being disconnected to the outpu I'm not sure...the windings afterall are not magnetic... anyway strange things, still to be sorted but there will be a way... psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jnewman Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Please don't do that, that's a pretty guitar and you've put a lot of work into this . I'm not sure if everyone would think that it's pretty...it's really something just to try out ideas with...but it does have a soft spot with me I must admit...more of an ugly duckling I would have said... ← Well, I dunno. All I can tell you is, I like it . Then again, I've always liked wood-colored guitars and I think that's a cool f-hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkey69962000 Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 sorry i realized the answer after i posted. im really depressed lately with personal issues, so i may act a little stupid the next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 sorry i realized the answer after i posted. im really depressed lately with personal issues, so i may act a little stupid the next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onelastgoodbye Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Me too monkey, me too! ← Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 (edited) Hi Tim R.G. seemed to suggest that the U shaped fins bent to the underside of the magnet were not the way to go....non magnetised side pieces were in order...these would be easier to make, you could yse a blade on either side (no bending) to achieve the result. I'd really have a look at your windings too...how tight well potted are they...it's much easier to get a small tight coil with thinner wire (0.2mm) and have the potting (like PVA, though something harder...even epoxy soaking would be even better) fill the gaps. If you're getting that much squeel I'd be looking into a higher ohm driver (16 would respond a lot slower as more wire, The LM386 recomends 4 ohms only if powered by 6 volts or less)...I don't quite know of the importance of this "Zobel Network" but it is a filter to cut out a lot of these high frequency oscillations so it probably wouldn't hurt. The little gem is probably not the most effective...the Ruby, is a better implementation of the LM386, much as in the Data sheet...the Little Gem does however include the Zobel Network too...so if you're using this circuit you've already got one...as does the Ruby...and it's an easy mod... Little Gem Ruby I Imagine the Reostat on the output of the little Gem may cause some problems...the pot before the amp is a better way to control gain I would think and certainly makes more sense, is easier, cheaper and an easier part to find... Here are the kit's that I use down here and are fairly commonly available from a few suppliers... LM386 Poweramp Preamp At A$14 retail...it's been a lot easier than making perfboard more simple designs...I've modified the preamp for more gain and it's important to omit the resistor that powers electret microphone...I'll try to scan the circuit in to let people see if there could be some more improvement like more filtering... This Canadian company sells this, which looks like a LM386 amp with onboard preamp which would be ideal perhaps...especially at C$10.95...but they wont sell to us convicts overseas... Hobbytron Amplifier Kit (I might need someone to get some of there stuff by the way...) It would certainly be something worth trying... But let's not get carried away with the circuitry...the wire you're using (0.3mm) is 1/3rd thicker than mine, and from the look of your photos, has more gaps in the winding....even wound tight the larger round wire will by necessity cause more gaps than a thinner wire due to the way they overlap...if nothing else you get a bigger, wider coil as a result. These factors, plus the lower ohmage, will make a significant difference to the way the driver performs...I'm convinced that answers should be looked at in the construction of the driver rather than in any fancy circuitry... A good, reliable and efficient circuit is important, but the essence of the device is in the driver, I'm sure... I certainly seem to have a fine working driver here and I think that the interferance problems I'm having now are not related to any of that typical feedback squeel but some kind of high frequency noise arising from the interaction of the guitar's electronics upon installation... R.G.'s ideas are certainly valid...but...are they strictly necessary...it appears that you can get a driver to work without going to those precautions.... Here's a strange symptom from the test strat...maybe it's a clue.... Since adding a filter to the input (which does effect the guitars tone in sustainer mode BTW making it darker...but in a nice, but not ideal, way) I've eliminated the high frequency noise...however...there is one setting in harmonic mode where it really doesn't like (high frequency noise returns) the volume/blend of the mid pickup turned down...even though, in sustainer mode it's not connected, and only in reverse phase. I'm not entirely sure but I think this and other mid pickup effects only started to occur when I moved the drive wires to the trem cavity. This means the driver wires now run directly below the mid pickup, rather to one side....hmmmm.... psw Oh...and the on/off switch only pops when turning the thing off...not on...!? Edited June 29, 2005 by psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galaga_Mike Posted June 30, 2005 Report Share Posted June 30, 2005 Report: I finished my new driver. It looks almost exactly like the one in the tutorial, but this one has a ferrite core, exactly 8.0 ohms of 28 gauge wire, and rare earth magnets below. It works like a dream. As I said earlier, I had a driver made from the pickup of my test guitar in there for a while and got nothing on the higher strings. I thought this might be due to a weak magnet and a tall coil, so I made this new one. The new one gives me sustain on every fret of every string if I toy around with the preamp gain. This is the first time that I've had any sustain on the B and E strings, so I'm pretty excited. This once again shows how important the driver is, because I only changed the driver and it made a HUGE difference. PSW, you asked about the core: I took a ferrite rod about 1/2" in diamter and grinded down three sides so the cross section looks like a square with one side rounded. Then I just did the usual bobbin from plastic epoxied to the ferrite with the coil wrapped on it. The magnets are rectangular rare earth magnets from ebay, with one magnet on the bass side and two magnets on the treble side. This seems to work really well. PSW, good work on incorporating the circuit in that guitar. Your circuit is much smaller than mine. Mine barely fits in the cavity of my Ibanez, which is pretty big. Keep the research coming. Maybe I'll get some pictures of my driver up soon to try to inspire more people to join in. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkey69962000 Posted June 30, 2005 Report Share Posted June 30, 2005 im sorry if the question was asked before, why can't you use the neck pickup with the driver on it. Would the signal be lost or something overlapping the driver? Also, is it possible to put a driver on a humbucker then use the other coil as the "bridge pickup" to run the driver? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted June 30, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 30, 2005 Hey Mike...great work Report: It works like a dream..... This once again shows how important the driver is, because I only changed the driver and it made a HUGE difference.... ← Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galaga_Mike Posted July 1, 2005 Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 Hey PSW, That's funny, because I was just about to post that I have been really impressed with the battery life of my sustainer. Maybe I don't put as much playing time on it as you. I guess I should put in a freshly charged battery and let it run until it dies for a good test. Anyway, I played around with the sustainer last night, and I have another mystery for everyone to think about. As I said, my new ferrite/rare earth driver works very, very well. But that is "normal" mode, I hadn't tried harmonic until yesterday. And strangely, I get almost NOTHING in harmonic mode. It just kind of kills the note and certainly doesn't sustain the harmonic like my last tall coil did. I found this interesting. So in short, what I have is excellent for sustaining the root, but really horrible in harmonic mode. Bring on the crazy theories! My theory is that my sustainer has a really strong magnetic field. This means that it is very good at reinforcing the vibrating string when in phase. However, in harmonic mode my other drivers have had just enough strength to force a node in the vibrating string, thereby inducing harmonics. Maybe this new driver is so strong or the field is so spread out that it actually stops the string instead of just giving a nicely defined node (null). Just a theory. I don't know, but this thing is fun. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDRockStar Posted July 1, 2005 Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 psw - i use rechargeable batteries all the time in my mp3 player- and what i've found is that they usually last about 1/2 as long as normal batteries do for applications that take a lot of energy (as is the case with the sustainer, i'm guessing) hm, and as far as what we wanna hear...do you know how to play always w/ me, always w/ you, by a guy that goes by satriani? that'd be cool - you can do some parts with sustain, some parts w/ harmonics man, now i'm excited - i'm on vacation right now, but i think i'll start into this as soon as i get back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted July 1, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 That's funny, because I was just about to post that I have been really impressed with the battery life of my sustainer.← I alway's had been happy before, and I'm sure I've said so somewhere...maybe my rechargables just dont have the life in them they once did...and I'm starting to play more...and it's hard to turn the thing off.... ... my new ferrite/rare earth driver works very, very well. Congratulations...I'm not sure if it's the ferrite, it could be you just wound a better driver, but...it does fit in with the theory of using ferrite...that's why they use them in radio coils at RF speeds after all. So in short, what I have is excellent for sustaining the root, but really horrible in harmonic mode. Bring on the crazy theories! Here they come... My theory is that my sustainer has a really strong magnetic field. No, I don't think that's it...the magnets are their for their field...as I described in the previous post.... psw:...The magnets are there to provide some initial "grip" on the strings, I believe...too much and they'll actually pull the strings out of tune.... So, you'd know if the magnet's were too much...a little too much and the guitar would lose natural sustain with the sustainer off as the M-field would restrict the string's vibrations...wolf tones, etc... Maybe this new driver is so strong or the field is so spread out that it actually stops the string instead of just giving a nicely defined node (null). Just a theory. Now, this is a better theory...but I don't think it's the strength of the electro-magnet...afterall, you can control the amount of power it puts out by turning the amp down...! My first coil CP1 (used ferrite BTW) to drive a single string and had so much power (the whole coil and all the power was concentrated on one string...ebow-like) that the string vibrated so hard that it was bouncing off the frets... It's your phrase..."the field is so spread out" that's of importance...it sounds like you have a very wide core or blade...mine is only 3mm wide, the whole coil is less than 10mm including the core and 3mm deep, making for a very narrow concentrated field... The string's fundumental vibration mode is twice that of the next harmonic...the harmonic wave is physically small...so...with a wider "blade", you may be driving both sides of the harmonic (the +ve upswing and the -ve down swing) resulting in...well, nothing...as the drive cancells itself out and actively stops the string...that would account for it.... That's why I asked how it was that you were able to shape it...I have had no luck cutting it as it's very hard and very brittle...I've been eyeing off the thin ferrite sleeves they have for flat computer cables, myself... Anyway...you may have made the perfect driver style for fundumental mode as the wider "blade" would act on more of that mode....but suppress it and the lower harmonic modes when the phase is reversed... People familiar with the whole thread will have seen that a lot of work was previously, not just following the hex driver concept, but by necessity, miniturising the driver technology...the principles that I were working on there still hold true with these more "traditional" devices...smaller size, concentrates the power, reduces the EMI and provides more precision in it's performance...Of course, I may be just face saving for all those countless hours of experimenting with painfully small drivers but, the evidence does seem to favour my intuition on this point... I don't know, but this thing is fun. That's the essence of the thing...it's fun... It also quite changes the range of the instrument...not only really long notes but extremely high notes...in harmonic mode, I'm able to play strong clear notes on the upper frets (even on the high e) that are sounding well above the theoretical 40th fret... Why is that advantageous...well many players reach immediately for the upper frets to solo because it takes them "above" the frequencies of the rest of a band...with this device, notes played in open position sound at the 12th fret and beyond, opening up the whole fretboard to a higher range... On top of this you have a whole range of new expressions and techniques...backwards effects, auto swells, auto picking, trem picking, easier legato and tapping (the sustainer drives the strings, not just the force of your fingers), harmonics that grow naturally from lower tones... In short...it opens up, in a controlled way, all those things Hendrix hinted at with his use of feedback, without the volume or distortion required, or hit and miss body placement to achieve it. Perhaps only Vai has taken up Mr H's controlled use of feedback and harmonics as effectively, so it's interesting to see that he's also dabbling with sustainer technology. So, enough preaching...I hope to have some basic sounds to download very soon (just getting them hosted)...this should give people an idea of the state of performance we're up to with this DIY device and how quickly it's becoming a worthwhile and viable DIY project.... psw Is it me do you think, or does this thread just ask you to write long posts.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted July 1, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 psw - i use rechargeable batteries....and what i've found is that they usually last about 1/2 as long as normal batteries do for applications that take a lot of energy...← always w/ me, always w/ you Rat's...that would have been a good one...next time...I've recorded a Santana melody to demonstrate it a little to start with...but the Sustainer would really have suited that one... That tune has some nice long notes and the tapping section would be aided by the drive of the sustainer, similarly, satch's trademarked legato...and the clean sound is similar to this tune's original tone...next time...there's lots of Satch stuff that would suit the sustainer... man, now i'm excited - i'm on vacation right now, but i think i'll start into this as soon as i get back! Well, you'll get the support here.... psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted July 3, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 Me again...well even though the sustainer worked well...id did have a few quirks...and a "pop" when you turned it off... So I started to mess around with the wiring...to the extent of substituting a 4PDT switch to give me more options with the activation switch...however, you should never mess with a good thing (especially when it's complicated and has evolved into what it is....)...needless to say I've lost control of the sustainer...errr...slightly! Looks like a rewire is in order to solve the problem...I'll really need help checking this and suggestions so, here is the wiring (well the proposed new wiring) of the test strat... The guitar's vol, blend and tone controls are analog 250k's...perhaps the blend should be linear and a higher value? The active control pots are 10kA. The phase switches are DPDT. What I've attempted to do is lift the hot and ground when the sustainer is on from everything but the bridge pickup...the bridge pickup connects when the sustainer is selected, no matter the selector switch position... In my partial rewire both my neck and mid PUps are being effected by the mid volume...this wasn't happening before...This mid volume control is the only thing that seems to bring on the noise, only at certain phases in relation to the drive phase (harmonic switch) and only when the thing is anything less than max on... Any suggestions would be greatfully appreciated...the diagram is a complete rewire so perhaps this could work as is...it does not address the "pop" problem, I tried lifting both +/- battery terminals but the effect is the same...could I use my spare terminals to address the problem... Any Help, Anybody...greatly appreciated... psw / pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ansil Posted July 3, 2005 Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 hey psw.. what is the current draw of the sustainor. there is an article in which i belive someone posted here if i am correct. anyway about using a supercapacitor and a voltage regulator to get 9v and you can charge it in like 20seconds with a 9v1A power supply food for thought. it doesnt have a lot of current availabliity but perhaps with a little bit of tweaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted July 3, 2005 Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 The only way you're going to fix the power switching transient is to implement a "soft-start" power on/off switch. I suspect that a large cap (~220uF?) from the circuit's positive lead to ground might help, but power transients are tricky (at least for me), so I could easily be dead wrong about that. RG may well have a simple solution - he's quieted every other kind of switch noise I can think of! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted July 3, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 Thanks guys for your consideration... On the circuit...I'm now finding that the mid pickup volume control is working on both the neck and mid pickups...it wasn't before...should this occur with this scenario...? Also...After disconnecting a lot of grounds and pickups I think the noise is being generated by the neck pickup... Here's my theory...the neck pickup coil is acting as an "antenna" and producing a HF signal by interaction with the driver with which it shares it's magnetic field... The "flow" of this noise alternates with the pickup's or the driver's phase... Only one end of this pickup coil needs to be connected (as in a radio "antenna") to the guitar's circuitry to produce the effect. So, by disconnecting one end of the coil it works fine but then with the drive signal is reversed (by the "harmonic switch") so too must the pickup's phase to ensure the correct end is lifted... The solution seems to be to short out the pickup coil rather than to lift one connection...this is a bit more complicated to implement, especially as my switch is in a back cavity and the pickup is under the scratchplate at the other end of the guitar... With a 4PDT switch I could take both ends of the pickup coil to the switch to short them then return to the phase switching and the rest of the guitar's circuitry...the same for the mid (presumably, though I've not really seen if it may not actually function with the sustainer on...I doubt it...still) and then the bridge pickup also has to go to the switch to ensure that it is connected, in the event that it is de-selected by the selector switch... It should be noted that these problems are not caused by the fancy switching system...the result would have been the same, but I wouldn't have had such an easy way of studying the effects of phase reversal... They are not really a result of the Pickup/Driver combination...whether ontop of or next to, the interactions would still have occured...a single bridge pickup and neck driver(no pickup) would be probably the only scheme not to result in such effects. OK, on the "pop" question...Tim/onelastgoodbye PM'ed me a link to a booster preamp thing where it's suggested that... It would probably be a good idea to put a 1M resistor from each output to ground to prevent pops when the switch is activated. I have actually tried sticking caps and resistors around the switches to try to get such an effect...serendipedly(?)...but to no avail... Here's Tim's link though...Jack Orman Booster...near bottom of page...thanks Tim On the soft start...it's actually only when you turn the sustainer off (or switch the series/parralel switch) that you get the "pop" (and it's not a super loud pop or anything...but any pop is too loud!) On the sustainer installation diagram. They illustrate wiring of push/pull pots with just such a cap on it...they don't explain it's presence (lookin bac it's 22uF on the harmonic switch?)...and the switching "seems" to be a little too easy...they talk in their patent of digital switching, perhaps they do use this and the switch is simply a trigger...the real switching takes place on the circuit board... Here's a link to the many Sustainiac installation .pdf's... Sustainiac installation Page.... I've been looking at the Strat type set up stealth plus near the bottom of the page... There are 18 connections to the circuit board...so it's still very complicated....hmmmmm...it's possible that they are switching the incoming signals phase, rather than the outgoing driver leads, and this cap (22uF) is some kind of filter or pop prevention... So...for now it's looking like I need to send 3 (or perhaps 4) shielded wires to my back cavity (2 send and a return) to short out the pickups, for each pickup and a hot send and return for the bridge pickup (to feed the sustainer circuit and allow for a selector switch work around for when the bridge pickup is not selected...if it were in the same cavity it wouldn't be two bad, but having to run this many wires back and forth from on cavity to the other, and from the front to the back...and not have the guitar playable (cause of the scratchplate removal)...is a real PITA!! Installation is looking to be a much bigger issue than I had thought it would be...people should bear this in mind with the project that not only must there be room for all the circuit, batteries and other stuff, it needs to be accessable...and we need to have a clearer plan of exactly how to do the installation... The location of the switches are important too, for playability. My location is great because you dont need to lift your string damping hand (which is important) from the strings...yet something else to consider... Anyway...thanks again...still more questions than answers, but I'm sure the answers are there, I fear it's just a matter of trying everything....doh! pete / psw Oh..and LK...the poweramp section already has a 100uF cap between the power supply as it's first component, and possibly on the preamp too (?)...as the pop is on turning off, I had wondered if this was due to such caps discharging on disconnection of the power lead...switching both +&- didn't work but then, the _ve is still connected through the circuit to the signal ground, so that was a little pointless...still, you try these things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted July 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 Ok...so I've spent all day trying to nut out this rewire... The sustainer is working again...but some changes... This "pop" has got to go...the symptom is that it pops only when you turn it off...it's now wired so that there is a spare lug that could connect the circuit's +ve to something...I tryed the -ve terminal (note: this does not connect the battery terminals together) but it has no effect...still looking for clues... The series/parallel switch also pops in sustainer mode...hmmmm.... I've used a 4PDT switch...but I ran out of terminals...there must be a way I haven't thought of yet... Basically, I've taken both connections to separate terminals...sustainer on, they are connected only to themselves...sustainer off, they connect to the ground and hot of the selector... However, I couldn't connect the mid pickup to this switch...one connects the power and the other selects the bridge pickup, regardless of selector position... So if anyone has any ideas on how to better switch it... I'm also now suspecting the actual construction of these cheap pickups....If you turn down the mid pickup (I've now put in a 1M linear pot for it) it sounds an awlful lot like microphonic feedback...even with a little bit on it gives a grainy electronic texture to the tone... Otherwise...without the mid pickup, it works well and I've been able to roll back, and could probably remove, the circuit's input filter...the result is now much more the natural, straty natural type of sound of this guitar...the previous filtered sound was quite nice but I think you could dial in something similar with the tone control if desired... So the results of this mod is positive...in that I've got a more natural tone, but negative, as I've lost my mid pickup in any mode.... I may attempt to pot the mid pickup and see how that goes...otherwise, a filter for that pickup, even though it will make it darker, it's already a very bright guitar, might work...perhaps there is a way to wire it to the switch that I'm not aware of....for instance, I think I could wire the mid to the neck pickup "shorting" connections, but, as it stands, the mid would only work in combination with the neck, or neck and bridge in the centre position, not with the neck and mid alone (this is with the sustainer off) Anyway...It's insanely complicated but the guitar's a whole lot neater for the rewire...which is good.... so that's where it's at... psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viking666 Posted July 5, 2005 Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 Can somebody point me in the right direction( page number etc) of the schematics,photos, of a good working sustainer,the whole thing including clean boost circuit etc, I dont have the patience to look through 60 pages!! Or better still can somebody make me one?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDRockStar Posted July 5, 2005 Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 there's a tutorial here http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=16984 it'll help you get started...other than that...go back about...5-10 pgs or so from here to read some interesting/useful info i think it was only recently where two guys here built semi-working sustainers - you're not too far behind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted July 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 Welcome Viking666 to PG and the sustainer thread.... Can somebody point me in the right direction( page number etc) of the schematics,photos, of a good working sustainer,the whole thing including clean boost circuit etc, I think if you simply look at my posts above yours, the DIY sustainer is still very much a work in progress...it's not like a simple stompbox effect... As for someone building one... http://sustainiac.com/ http://www.fernandesguitars.com/ Both these companies make fully functional sustainers.... I've perhaps put more work into it than anyone and my DIY sustainer guitar does work well...when it wants to...but I wouldn't sell something that goes "pop" when you turn it on and couldn't be guarenteed to work with your actual guitar (installation is a large part of the current development)... Right now, if impatience and frustration is a problem....then steer clear of the DIY Sustainer...I've looked everywhere, and tried most things and from all this it would appear... #1 That so far no one seems to have developed and shown exactly how to build a glitch free DIY Sustainer (though many have claimed to have done it...this thread would be a lot shorter if they had been of assistance)... #2 This is about the most information about sustainers in general you'll find...you don't need to read 60 pages...check out the tutorial (though this is also still a work in progress...it hasn't really addressed the issues of installation, etc...), also about page 49 shows some pics of my pickup/driver being built...there are a range of circuits throughout... I do hope that I will have solved enough of the problems with the DIY Sustainer to do just that...give exact details as to how to do it...but if someone already knows...for goodness sake tell me so I can stop it with the soldering iron already!!! psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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