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Jem Decal- Where Do I Get It


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There are tutorials here on doing the monkey grip.....the lions claw routing.......Pyramid inlays, etc......all of which are copyrighted by Ibanez.

Anyone seen Brians JPM decals or the Gilbert F-Holes on ebay?

I aint saying its right but if the owner of the site is doing it?!?!?!?!

This isnt Brian bashing, but come on Perry, dont take that 'hollier than thou' attitude just because you make your own guitars. 

Its great that you have your own opinion, but so do others mate.

No holier than though edit here mate. Im just sick of seeing fakes all over the place.

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Sales is where it gets funky.
No, court is where it gets funky - it is not legal for you to put other people's registered and copyrighted logos on items they did not produce without a licensing agreement, ever, period! That is not an opinion, it's a matter of statute (at least in the US). The registered owner might have trouble being awarded damages in court unless he can prove intent to defraud, but in the era of file-sharing and the DMCA, judges are a lot more likely to rule on the letter of the law.

Intellectual property is just that, property, and you can't legally use someone else's property without their permission! This attitude that it's a matter of opinion is rubbish! It's a matter of black-letter law, and if you infringe, you can only hope that the owner doesn't think you're worth pursuing. Do whatever you can live with, but don't kid yourself - you're breaking the law, and could be held liable for it.

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It is legal for restoration and personal use. Sales is where it gets funky.

CORRECT

So you´re actually saying that what he´s doing up to the point of completing the guitar Is legal...So what´s actually your problem then if he's telling you he's not gonna sell it?? You can't really prosecute people because you think they're gonna commit a crime..

Its called intent. Just as much a crime.

Not really...

No, court is where it gets funky - it is not legal for you to put other people's registered and copyrighted logos on items they did not produce without a licensing agreement, ever, period!

Hey, what about stickers..they carry the companys logo...Are you not allowed to put them on anything then??

And as fo the toyota/Lamborghini... that´s not a very good comparison...It's more like building an exact replica of the shelby 427 ac cobra...a car wich is to most people unavailable (kinda like a lefty jem)..And some people go as far as making them a perfect replica with the same engine etc...What's really the big deal if they stick the shelby logos on it..?They wouldn't be able to sell it as an original anyway..

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Without sale, there is no alledged fraud.
Jeff, that's true so far as it goes, but fraud is a criminal complaint, while trademark infringement is a civil cause of action - you do understand the difference, right? And not only is the burden of proof reduced in civil court (...beyond a reasonable doubt... is relaxed to ...the preponderance of the evidence supports...), but they don't have to show intent - even inadvertent infringement is actionable.

SO while you can't go to jail (the result of a criminal prosecution) for infringement, you can end up owing the plaintiffs your next 30 years salary. Did you guys miss the whole Monster Cable campaign of terror - they shut down all kinds of people without even haviing a case!! How long are you going to last if Hoshino decides to make an example of you? Anybody fancy a quick trip out to California (at your own expense) to answer a complaint in civil court?

This is ludicrous - I don't care if you cheat on your taxes, lie to your girlfriend about leaving your wife, or steal from the collection plate, because that's your own karma, and none of my business, but the fact that something feels OK to you doesn't make it any less illegal. If you can get right wih it, go for it, but be aware that there could be consequences.

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Without sale, there is no alledged fraud.
Jeff, that's true so far as it goes, but fraud is a criminal complaint, while trademark infringement is a civil cause of action - you do understand the difference, right? And not only is the burden of proof reduced in civil court (...beyond a reasonable doubt... is relaxed to ...the preponderance of the evidence supports...), but they don't have to show intent - even inadvertent infringement is actionable.

SO while you can't go to jail (the result of a criminal prosecution) for infringement, you can end up owing the plaintiffs your next 30 years salary. Did you guys miss the whole Monster Cable campaign of terror - they shut down all kinds of people without even haviing a case!! How long are you going to last if Hoshino decides to make an example of you? Anybody fancy a quick trip out to California (at your own expense) to answer a complaint in civil court?

This is ludicrous - I don't care if you cheat on your taxes, lie to your girlfriend about leaving your wife, or steal from the collection plate, because that's your own karma, and none of my business, but the fact that something feels OK to you doesn't make it any less illegal. If you can get right wih it, go for it, but be aware that there could be consequences.

If you haven´t noticed...buckethead's from australia...I'm not sure about these specific laws...but you do know that american laws don't apply to the rest of the world right..?

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If you haven´t noticed...buckethead's from australia...I'm not sure about these specific laws...but you do know that american laws don't apply to the rest of the world right..?
There are international copyright and trademark agreements - how else do you think that brands like Coca-Cola, Toblerone, Lamborghini, Renault, Marshall, et al, protect their marks in foreign markets? After all, Ibanez is the Hoshino Corporation, based in Japan. Some of you are either remarkably thick, or you're going to great lengths to appear so in defense of this silliness! This is my final word on this - regardless of how you feel about this issue, it is illegal, and ill-advised. Do whatever you can live with. In 300 years, it won't matter to anyone. :D
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ok, i have had just about enough of threads like this, somebody asks for help and instead gets thrashed for wanting to do something with HIS/HER own guitar, now i can see both sides of the argument here, if he was going to sell it then i would definatly not agree with his idea, but he wants a lefty jem, they dont make them, so why not make one yourself? hell that was my logic when i started building my misfits guitar! so what am I doing something illegal by having a fiend skull on the headstock? Do I intend on selling this guitar ever? hell no! i wanted one and i started to make one, is that wrong? same applies with this guy, he said it himself he wants to keep it for himself, more power to ya!

what is so wrong about a guy wanting to have a guitar that looks like his idols?(only an assumption here, jems are awesome anyways) if ibanez made a lefty jem then this whole fiasco wouldnt have happened

i am sick of some of the "elites" of this website bashing the new guys who want to do something like this, or absolutly refusing to help them, we all got started somewhere guys! I know i sure as hell could have used some more help from the guys here then i got when i started building my rhoads V's, but in order for me to even be able to start building them i had to take a 300 mile trip to a guitar shop that carried jacksons because there was nobody that was willing to help with templates, body tracings or the likes! forum help indeed! i try to help anybody i can on there projects where i can

ok now that i probably pissed some people off im going to finish this by saying just one thing, if you really want a jem logo, the best piece of advice I can give you is this, go trace one or use photoshop and make your own(cause your prolly not going to get one here), i dont support it myself as i also think its wrong but thats my $.02

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There are international copyright and trademark agreements - how else do you think that brands like Coca-Cola, Toblerone, Lamborghini, Renault, Marshall, et al, protect their marks in foreign markets? After all, Ibanez is the Hoshino Corporation, based in Japan. Some of you are either remarkably thick, or you're going to great lengths to appear so in defense of this silliness! This is my final word on this - regardless of how you feel about this issue, it is illegal, and ill-advised. Do whatever you can live with. In 300 years, it won't matter to anyone.  :D

As for the international copyright laws...It was legal to download music from the internet where I live up until a couple of weeks ago...I don't think it was like that all over the world..

Edited by aidlook
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Goth, nothing Elitist here. I build replicas of famous guitars myself, for my pleasure, AND for sale. However, its not a trademarked, registered, or otherwise name brand that i put on them, but MY OWN name.

And if a replica needs a strat head, then its a pre-purchased licensed neck, not one ive built myself.

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I think this topic has been saturated enough with opinions. The same two arguments just keep coming up ad nauseum-

1) It's illegal

2) It's for personal use and doesn't affect anyone else

No-one is getting convinced in either direction away from their existing stance and the guy who started the debate doesn't even care any more, so how about just closing the thread.

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Just one last thing to add to those who refuse to come down from their high horse-

http://projectguitar.com/tut/phs.htm

I don't know if that's an original Jem or not in that tute but it sure as hell indicates to me that vinyl decals of the Ibanez and Jem logo are available and that their use isn't at all discouraged.

Buckethead if you still want to do that maybe try emailling the author of that tutorial to find out where they got their decals from.

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I never said being on the internet made it "ok/correct/truth/bla bla" as you so articulately put it, however you might want to give some consideration to the fact that it's HOSTED ON THE PROJECT GUITAR WEB SITE! Considering the subject matter at hand and where this is being discussed, surely it holds a bit more weight than simply "bla bla".

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Just because Brian has photos of it on his website, does not make it any more legal to do it. Why dont we start a thread about shooting up herion, or better still, shooting SOMEONE, and get Brian to put a picture on his site showing how its done!

For all you know, his decals were legally obtained from Hoshino themselves.

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