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Computer Recording


ultraman

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Ah, memories...

I set up my desktop about 2 years or more ago just for recording. It cost about 400 bucks for the whole deal. Athalon 1700+/512meg/80gig/SoundBlaster Audigy.

The most important things to focus on are a good sound card first. Do NOT use a motherboard with on board sound. You'll hear up to 1 second delays in what you play versus what you record. It's a real pain to correct that later. Buy a good sound card!

Second, get a harddrive with the fastest spin rate you can find. Faster spin usually accompanies fast data access times. This will come in handy later when you are over dubbing your guitar parts, bass parts, or whatever over the rest of the track. There's a lot of data that has to be pulled off the drive all the while you are putting more data onto it. A cheap harddrive can seriously limit the amount of tracks you can record.

Memory, yeah 512 should be a minimum. Although I started with MUCH less. My first computer recording box was a Pentuim 90/64meg/2gig/SoundBlaster clone. I could only squeeze on about 8 tracks before it would barf.

I should also mention that all my CD's have been produced on these two machines. There's no way I'll go back to those little portable 4-track or 8-track machines. There is one good point about them in that you can take them to a gig and record yourself live. I would NOT want to bring a computer to a gig for recording. It would be too tempting for someone to steal. Noone cares about a 4 track. :D

<edit>

Get to know a few good sources online for parts... My personal favorite is www.newegg.com, followed close behind by www.pricewatch.com

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How are you set up?

What connects your guitar and mics to your computer?

Would the mixer i suggested work for me?

Sorry, I forgot to mention that part. I route all the sound through an ancient Fostex X15 4 track. It allows me to set the level, pan, and basic EQ. The monitor output from there pumps into the Line In jack on the SoundBlaster.

A mixer will do the trick just fine. The 4 track that I have was just collecting dust and it fit the bill to act as a microphone preamp and simple mixer for me.

If you wanted to go cheap here, you could probably find a "parts" 4 track recorder on eBay. I've seen a few on there and they all have problems like "wont record" or "missing drive belt". Since you are going to record on the PC, you can just use the 4 track as that buffer between your guitar gear and your PC. :D Oh, and some of those "parts" 4 tracks have gone for like 99 cents!

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please dont go with dell.

select a dell model on their site, go to a site like tigerdirect.com or http://www.buydirectpc.com/index.jsp configure a model with the same exact specs as dell and you'll notice why. I usually find dell overcharges too much, and if you're from Canada you're screwed for technical support because in the manuel it says that for technical support you need to have fully paid for the computer, and live in the united states. At least that's what happened with my friend yesterday.

If you live in Canada, go for an MDG seriously. I have 2 in my house right now, one for my dad using the internet and one which is for everyone in the house. I've never had any problems with MDG unless i didn't have a virus scanner or spyware program installed lol. MDG is having a sale right now. Infact they're always having a sale.

for 800 bucks canadian right now you get

MICROSOFT® WINDOWS® XP HOME

Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor (~3 GHz, 1MB L2 Cache, 533MHz FSB)

1GB RAM

250 gb SATA hard drive

32 bit graphics (i think they use ATI)

17" LCD monitor

cd burner

crappy sound card

no speakers

corel productivity software

That's seriously not bad. I'm thinking of going for it and then get the external sound card (for me, firepod), and active monitors (rockit 5s) and then a shure sm58 and 57.

-Jamie

Edited by sepultura999
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That price breakdown seems about right. Instead of the software, though, get a proper soundcard (Audiophile 2496 or EMU0404 for example) which include software.

In theory, you CAN use the on-board sound these days. There are a couple of handy little programs around that give ASIO capability to on-board soundcards, which means low-latency monitoring, so you could start off with the on-board and add the 'proper' sound card later. I wouldn't recommend it, though, with a clear conscience. :D

It really depends on what you want to get out of it. Or, let me put it to you this way:

- You CAN get a system that will do everything the Tascam can do and more, for cheaper or the same price.

- HOWEVER, it is very easy to find yourself on a slippery slope for computer-based hardware, as well. You say, "well it's only $40 more to get an extra 256 MB of RAM" or "I should get this second hard drive that's been recommended" and end up with a pricey system.

SO,

At the end of the day, I'm really all about computer-based recording. It'll give you the flexibility and power to do studio-quality work. But I understand that to get there, you need to spend probably double the cost of the Tascam, just as a starting point. Since money is an issue for all of us, it's still worth considering. If you really believe that the Tascam will fit your needs, I say go for it. Factor in a way to get drum tracks into it before making your decision, though.

I used an old tape-based Tascam 4-track portastudio for years, and I had a hell of a lot of fun with it. The model you're looking at is already 100 times better than what I used.

Greg

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And you've already found out that you can't just plug in your guitar to the soundcard and expect magic to happen. You'll need to get either a good microphone and a mixer/4-track to boost it to line level, or get a POD or something of that ilk to get good tone.

I'd look into the GuitarPort or POD first. Everyone seeems to use those, although I still prefer my SansAmp. :D

Welcome to the world of GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome).

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A question, Im currently recording via a boom mic in to AcidPro, im getting really crappy results, but i dont expect great things from this set up. Ive tryed running the line out from my amp in top the mic socket in my PC, i get nothing. This method worked at my school, im doing nothing differant here. Should i be using a PC preamp to go through?

As you can probibly tell im a bit confused

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Yes.

The 2496 accepts "line level" input. The Behringer mixer (not the 502 which is their smallest-- the 502 does not have phantom power, you need at least the 802) provides power to the mic as well as bringing the signal up to line level. Even better, it outputs on RCA cable, which the 2496 accepts.

If you're in no particular rush, I have to take my computer apart in the next few days, so I'll take some pictures of how the setup works. I've actually added an other preamp to my setup now, so I can show you either what I do, or what I used to do with JUST the mixer and no additional pre-amp.

Also remember, there ARE audio devices also that come with their own phantom power and pre-amps. The cheapest one I saw was the M-Audio MobilePre which has a suprisingly low resolution (the same as the Tascam, CD-quality) at $149. That's only a wee bit less than the cost of a mixer + Audiophile 2496.

-----

A different question, and hopefully not one that's going to confuse:

What will the microphone be used on? A large diaphragm condenser mic is ideal for voice and acoustic guitar, but it's less than ideal for a cranked amp.

Greg

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I'd hesitate to use a large diaphragm condenser mic with a cranked amp. A live amp, sure, but not one that needs to be cranked to break into distortion. The physical force of the soundwaves hitting the diaphragm could damage it.

The classic amp mic of choice is the Shure SM57 (they make a budget version, too, the PG57), but that doesn't mean it's the only option.

Depending on just HOW loud it needs to be, you could take the middle ground and get a medium-diaphragm condenser mic instead.

Greg

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I thought the sm 58 dynamic mic would be better. From what I read the condenser mic is mostly used for acoustic instruments, such as acoustic guitar, acoustic bass, violin, etc. so i dunno if you wanna use that with the hi-gain.

There really is no need to go for a cheaper version. They're cheap as it is and many musicians swear by them, not to mention since they're so common you'll find a few on ebay or used stores. I almost bought one for 85 canadian used only for 6 months. Brand new in Toronto they range from 120 canadian to 160 canadian.

-Jamie

Edited by sepultura999
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You can find beat up 57s for a great price.. they are road worthy and take a beating..

I have a behringer 1204 or something like that.. the 12 channel mixer.. cost me 120 bucks i think. it's awesome. I also have the B-1. Used it a lot for acoustic recording and for voiceover work for multimedia projects.. Great setup.

newegg.com has the m-audio delta 44 for 150 bucks. seems like a pretty good deal, you get 4 ins and 4 outs for monitoring, which is great for a little home setup.

If anyone else records with a laptop, i have a dell and you can't record with the AC power in it.. You get a horrible buzzing sound. One sound guy told me it was just dells power supplies but i was skeptical. I read in some of the recording forums that several brands do this and it's a ground loop problem. You can 1) cut the ground plug off your ac adapter :D (not the best idea :D ) or 2) you can get a ground loop isolater from radio shack. I have no idea how much it costs but i don't think it's that expensive. Just an FYI for any laptop recorders out there frustrated by the line noise..

I do most of my stuff in acid pro btw.. i saw someone mention it. It's really handy because you can loop your own stuff. Doing soundtrack work and bg music for stuff, i dont' have time to do a hudnred takes.. so i can just get phrases right and build a loop library to set the bed for the song. It's a great workflow. I've never used any of the real packages though, PT or cubase.. maybe they have those features too.

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ultra, turning up real loud (well reasonably loud) in this case is actually a good thing (ya, tell that one to your MOM..lol)....it's true.

You will not only get more of a full sound recorded you will also be lowering the noise floor getting that fuller sound. Do a test. Record a track, something really simple at a low level and then try the same thing (record another track) with the amp loud. Then set the tracks to playback at the same volume and a/b between them, the loud recording will usually sound fuller unless ya screwed it up. :D

Edited by Gorecki
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Well actually i dont need to crank it.

I didnt really get what you meant.

I don't have to have it super loud. Its a hybrid amp so the distortion isnt bad at low volumes.

you still need to take the speakers up to volume to get the full sound from them.how loud depends on the speakers.

but the shure 57 is what you need

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You will likely get best results using two different mics. :D

It's not a cheap hobby. I have what's considered a very minimal setup and I've already spent several hundreds of dollars. :D

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there are ways around micing the amp.you could get a v-amp or a pod and run it direct into your mixer...you might be surprised at how good one of those things records.

BUT i have a shure 57 running into a mixer that i can mic my cab with,or i can run my line out directly into the mixer,or i can mic my acoustic guitar,or i can do several other top secret things to achieve a fuller sound,like this one

my link

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