krazyderek Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 I'm shaping the headstock on my neck thru guitar now and i can't decide weather to leave it as a flat fender style headstock and use a floyd style string retainer bar or glue a peice of wood to the back of the blank headstock and make a 13 degree angled headstock i can't really proceed with anything else till i make up my mind i'm also doing an fairly big wood inlay on the headstock so i was thinking fener style would make that easier cause i could inlay , then use my jointer to slim the headstock down.... grrrrrr can't decide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsera Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 13 degree angle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckguitarist Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 13 degree angle yea! 13degree angled pegheads rock! I don't really like that looks of flat pegheads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurt76 Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Hi!! What´s the diference between 13º Headstock and Flat Headstock?.. About the sound and intonation? ... Thanks! Bye!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 the 13 deg. headstock,aside from looking cool,helps lay the strings flat across a locking nut without the use of a string tree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsl602000 Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 angled headstocks are more prone to breaking. I like the look though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roli Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Flat headstocks are easier to produce, but they need string-trees for the sufficient string pressure on the nut (intonation), at least for the higher strings. (The lower strings naturally have the right angle, 'cause their tuners have smaller distance from the nut, therefore those strings won't run so flat as the higher ones.) I better like the look of flat headstocks, they're kinda smooth for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitarfrenzy Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 I guess it really doesn't matter, but I guess you can go by tradition in making your choice. This is just my observation... if a neck is angled then they usually angle the headstock, and if the neck is straight then so is the headstock. This is not always the case, but it might help you make your decision easier knowing what most manufactures do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Litchfield Custom Gutars Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I prefer angled headstocks, but if you have to glue wood on, scratch it, because glue isnt as resonant as wood. But in the end, it really matters what YOU want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I disagree, when using an angled head, a scarf joint is advisable. Since you already have glue between your fretboard and neck, each lamination of the neck and between the body and the neck, I don't belive that a scarfed head will in anyway compromise tone, and it will aid strength and stiffness in the headstock - which IMO will have more effect on tone than one tiny glue line. One piece necks with angled heads are significantly weaker than scarfed heads, due to the amount of shortgrain in the vulnerable head area, and despite what Ed Roman et al might say, their use is not some guarantee or tonal nirvana. This weakness is not only a problem if the guitar takes a tumble, it can also lead to tuning issues when the whole head flexes. They also waste significantly more wood than a scarfed neck, somethign which is worth consideration given the difficulty of sustaining supply of exotic timbers. I'm not saying one piece necks are bad, I just don't see enough advantages to use them in preference to a well fitted scarf joint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilkinsonguitars Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I have to agree that scarf joint angled necks are the best. I have built all my buitar with this and the strength is unsurpassable. Also it looks cool. Also if the glue joint is tight then any tone problems won't occur. Gary Wilkinson Wilkinson Guitars www.geocities.com/wilkinsonguitars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Litchfield Custom Gutars Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I do agree with the strength, and yes if the joint is good, minimal tone differences occur, but be absolutely sure to grain match if you do a scarf. I still prefer not to have one. If it works for you, do it. I just do it this way...but then I feel guilty about topwood waste...go figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I do agree with the strength, and yes if the joint is good, minimal tone differences occur, but be absolutely sure to grain match if you do a scarf. Do you recommend grain matching for cosmetics, or for structural reasons? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted October 8, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 actually i don't use scarf joints, i simply glue a an aditionaly peice of wood to the back of the existing peghead like this..(pic below) i'm not to worried about strength cause it's a 3 peice laminate quatersawn neck, and i think purple heart is a bit stronger then maple nes pas? it's just flat woud be easier to make cause it's less work, but it makes the headstock inlay really hard, but the angled heastock is more work but it makes the headstock inlay a bit easier.. lol so.... hmmm.. but most of you seem to think angled would be better.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveq Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I use the scarf joint technique whenever possible. For some reason, I don't mind seeing the line around the second fret but do mind seeing one on the peghead. I would be surprised if people could actually notice a difference in tone but it does make sense that this technique would result in a very strong joint. I'd be interested to hear what the grain matching was all about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 I would opt for a 13º Headstock on a tree-piece maple-"hard wood of your choice"-maple neck (no scarf joint, "one-piece" neck (constructed of three pieces, mind-warping, isn't it? )). mullmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Litchfield Custom Gutars Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 Grain matching is cool stuff for cosmetic reasons. If the grain is matched, the line will be nearly invisible. Also for structure, the glue will pennetrate better if the grain pores line up so to speak. It is a little hard to achieve this, so I prefer no to do it, but veneer the front & back of the headstock. But then again...to each his own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted October 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 lining things up is kind of important if you do a scarf joint where both peices have a different color laminate in there like ebony, it just makes sense to make sure they line up to make it look good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveq Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 lining things up is kind of important if you do a scarf joint where both peices have a different color laminate in there like ebony, it just makes sense to make sure they line up to make it look good Have you done one of these yet? I have stayed away from attempting this since it would be very, very difficult to get one lined up exactly and clamped with only one person. I'm very picky about these things and if it were off by the slightest amount, I would have to scrap it. Let me know if you have done one successfully, maybe there's a trick to it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 pretty easy to do - I used a scarfed headstock on the guitar below. I'll try to do a mockup of my gluing process soon so you can see it - it's a bitch to explain, but simple to do. You can see a faint line accross the back of the head, most of which is concealed by the tuners. The headstock also has ears glued on for width, which conceal the joint from the side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveq Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 I can already tell that yours might be easier than mine. Most of my pegheads are not symetrical and do not have ears glued on (I also don't cut much wood off - usually 12" long by 9" wide to be safe). I'd still like to see the process though when you have time to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StratDudeDan Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 if it's a "gibson-esque" body, angled. if it's a "fender-esque" body, flat. it would just flow more and be more recognizable, otherwise it would just look kinda weird and just not right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted October 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 lining things up is kind of important if you do a scarf joint where both peices have a different color laminate in there like ebony, it just makes sense to make sure they line up to make it look good Have you done one of these yet? I have stayed away from attempting this since it would be very, very difficult to get one lined up exactly and clamped with only one person. I'm very picky about these things and if it were off by the slightest amount, I would have to scrap it. Let me know if you have done one successfully, maybe there's a trick to it? well i left is flat cause... i just felt like it dave, the staple trick see the stew mac page for explination. setch is that how you lign them up ? stratdudedan, it's neither... a custom shape i designed... supposed to be a RG SG mix... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Litchfield Custom Gutars Posted October 10, 2003 Report Share Posted October 10, 2003 Grain matching is mainly cosmetic. If the grain is matched, the line will be nearly invisible. For stuctural and tonal reasons, too though. The grain poreswill line upcreating a better bond, and the tone will resonate betterwith grain match...however...the glue thing...I thought about that. You glue the fingerboard, neck,top, and sometimes other things...the tonal change IS minimal but it can add up. Plus the more joints you have, the more of a pain it is...I still prefer to do one piece and the veneer it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted October 10, 2003 Report Share Posted October 10, 2003 Front and back veneers look very smart, and really help the strength, they are also great of you want to hide a scarf joint How do you 'flow' your back-strapped veneer into the neck? Do you blend it out to a sharp point part way down to the first fret, or bend it over a volute? I've seen examples of both, and attempted the former, but I'd love to see some pics of your approach... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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