Guest Mavet Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 hi I noticed that many luthiers use titebond glue (white wood glue basicly), as almost all of the string instrument builders use hide or bone glue (preferably hot glue) for its hardness and sonic. is there any reson not to use hide glue? how will it affect the guitar's sound? cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 (edited) I noticed that many luthiers use titebond glue (white wood glue basicly), as almost all of the string instrument builders use hide or bone glue (preferably hot glue) for its hardness and sonic. I don't think your statement is wrong exactly, but may give the wrong impression. I and many use both HHG and Titebond, as well as CA, and Epoxy(all depending on application). Titebond has advantages in that it affords much longer open(working) times, is easy to use(ready out of the bottle) and is proven to last. It has the down side of having some creep(as all plastic glues have). This is not really a significant problem in most structural applications. HHG is a great glue that has definately stood the test of time. It has several positive features. It can be dimantled and re-assembled with minimal clean up(you can re-activate it), it is very easy to clean up, it dries very hard, it sets very fast(which can also be a downside depending on what you are doing), and does not have the creep issue that is found in plastics. It has the down side of needing to be made up in advance, and has to be kept hot up until application. For me I use 100% Titebond on electrics, and a mix on acoustics. I like to use HHG for bridges and bracing. I use Titebond for wood laminates, kerfing, wood binding, headstock veneers, fretboards, neck and tail blocks. I use CA and Epoxy for rosettes, inlay, and purfling. All good glues and do there job in the right application. Peace,Rich (edit); I have NO opinion on any percievable difference in sound. Edited March 8, 2007 by fryovanni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mavet Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 thanks for the reply I have slow setting hide glue, ready for use in room temperature (no heating needed). it has about 15 minuets open working time. Does it achieve the hardness of HHG? will dramatic changes in climate and moisture affect hide glues, or will sweat on an unfinnished laminated neck weaken the glue? Cheers, Binya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 (edited) thanks for the reply I have slow setting hide glue, ready for use in room temperature (no heating needed). it has about 15 minuets open working time. Does it achieve the hardness of HHG? will dramatic changes in climate and moisture affect hide glues, or will sweat on an unfinnished laminated neck weaken the glue? Cheers, Binya If you are talking about that pre-mixed liquid hide glue you can buy off the shelf. DON'T USE IT. It will never harden. The stuff is worthless for guitar building. If you have some other for of glue such as Fish glue(similar to HHG but takes longer to cure and is workable at room temp, open times are more like an hour or two) it will set up. After HHG is cured it is not going to be effected by normal changes in humidity. As with anything enough heat and moisture can break it down(but your guitar is going to be in bad shape after subjection to that kind of extream). Peace,Rich Edited March 8, 2007 by fryovanni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerDude Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 Titebond has advantages in that it affords much longer open(working) times, is easy to use(ready out of the bottle) and is proven to last. It has the down side of having some creep(as all plastic glues have). Sorry for the question: what do you mean by a "creep"? My English kind of sucks and I imagine that by "creep" you mean that the glue will cause the two joined surface to get dispalaced and move off center. Or does it have another meaning? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primal Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 You got it, DrummerDude. Basically, the joint will "slide." Like Rich said, however, any of this creep is negligable for guitars (else no one would use plastic glues!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 Titebond has advantages in that it affords much longer open(working) times, is easy to use(ready out of the bottle) and is proven to last. It has the down side of having some creep(as all plastic glues have). Sorry for the question: what do you mean by a "creep"? My English kind of sucks and I imagine that by "creep" you mean that the glue will cause the two joined surface to get dispalaced and move off center. Or does it have another meaning? Thanks Creep means the joint can move. The glue is plastic and thus has some degree of flexability. Keep this in perspective though. A well made joint will have very little space and glue between the bits of wood. In other words a well made joint will not have a lot of potential to move. It is a great glue. If there was to be an issue it would probably appear in an area more prone to vibration and significant movement such as bracing on an acoustic soundboard. That said it works perfectly fine for soundboards in just about all cases. It is a small issue, but I wanted to point it out as it is a difference. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerDude Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 Thanks guys, I know what it means now. I have noticed this on a headstock I made an year ago. headstocks are under pressure and the "wings" I glued to that headstock moved forward. I sued PVA glue. Damn, from now on I'm switching to epoxy. The neck on my Ibanez looks epoxied too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 Thanks guys, I know what it means now. I have noticed this on a headstock I made an year ago. headstocks are under pressure and the "wings" I glued to that headstock moved forward. I sued PVA glue. Damn, from now on I'm switching to epoxy. The neck on my Ibanez looks epoxied too. Wings on a headstock moving is NOT a PVA problem unless you made your joints improperly. PVA glue is used on almost every guitar out there, and simply put they are not falling apart. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soapbarstrat Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 I have noticed this on a headstock I made an year ago. headstocks are under pressure and the "wings" I glued to that headstock moved forward. I sued PVA glue. I'd give anything to see PVA glue walk into a court room, wearing a suit. How much did you sue him/it for ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted March 10, 2007 Report Share Posted March 10, 2007 I have noticed this on a headstock I made an year ago. headstocks are under pressure and the "wings" I glued to that headstock moved forward. I sued PVA glue. I'd give anything to see PVA glue walk into a court room, wearing a suit. How much did you sue him/it for ? He had to sue. He tried to have PVA arrested but the charges didn't stick. OMG I make bad yoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerDude Posted March 10, 2007 Report Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yeah, I sued its ass and my PVA is in jail now. And the guards are mean epoxy dudes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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