Jump to content

Making A Rails Pickup...have A Couple ?'s


dawnofzion

Recommended Posts

I am about to make a rails type humbucker pickup. I am looking to make something very similar to the dimebucker or the X2N pickup. My question is...Does the wire wrap directly around the steel rail pole piece? or is there something inbetween the wire the the rail like a regular bobbin has? Also, can I just use a regular piece of steel for the rail? Should I wrap with 43 awg or 42 awg? I am looking for pickup with alot of pinch harmonics.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please bear in mind that I have never done a rail type pickup. This is all based on my experience with more "traditional" type pickups.

I would strongly suggest that you wrap the steel with electrical tape or use some other insulation method. The steel are most likely going to cut through the wire insulation. I would think that most rail type pickups are done pretty muck like traditional fender pickups in all other aspects. That’s supposed to read out “top and bottom flange, held together by something conducting magnetic flux, or magnets them self and the wire wound directly around the metal part”. Regular steel should work out fine. Stay away from stainless steel as some high Q stainless doesn’t transfer the magnetic field (quick test: won’t stick to a magnet).

About the wire gauge: Are you trying to fit it in a standard HB rout? The reason to use AWG43 is primarily to fit more wire on the coil. It also affects (attenuate) the treble slightly. The reasons are many but maybe the most important is the skin effect or frequency dependable resistance ad I think it is actually called. Treble (high frequency AC currents) travels on the outside of a wire and bass (low frequency AC currents) in the core. A thin wire has a smaller outside/core ratio and thus doesn’t transfer treble as efficient. If possible I think that you should try to use as thick wire as possible for a better high frequency response. Also consider a powerful magnet like ALNICO6, ALNICO8 or a ceramic magnet. Higher magnet strength equals higher output and better treble response.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please bear in mind that I have never done a rail type pickup. This is all based on my experience with more "traditional" type pickups.

I would strongly suggest that you wrap the steel with electrical tape or use some other insulation method. The steel are most likely going to cut through the wire insulation. I would think that most rail type pickups are done pretty muck like traditional fender pickups in all other aspects. That’s supposed to read out “top and bottom flange, held together by something conducting magnetic flux, or magnets them self and the wire wound directly around the metal part”. Regular steel should work out fine. Stay away from stainless steel as some high Q stainless doesn’t transfer the magnetic field (quick test: won’t stick to a magnet).

About the wire gauge: Are you trying to fit it in a standard HB rout? The reason to use AWG43 is primarily to fit more wire on the coil. It also affects (attenuate) the treble slightly. The reasons are many but maybe the most important is the skin effect or frequency dependable resistance ad I think it is actually called. Treble (high frequency AC currents) travels on the outside of a wire and bass (low frequency AC currents) in the core. A thin wire has a smaller outside/core ratio and thus doesn’t transfer treble as efficient. If possible I think that you should try to use as thick wire as possible for a better high frequency response. Also consider a powerful magnet like ALNICO6, ALNICO8 or a ceramic magnet. Higher magnet strength equals higher output and better treble response.

I was wanting to use a ceramic magnet. I am hoping to build a pickup that will be a nice heave metal pickup. I am wanting it to be pretty good with pinch harmonics as well as be really fat sounding on low tuned chords. So I should just use the 42 awg wire or should I go thicker? Where would be the best place to get a ceramic magnet for what I'm wanting to do?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was looking into the construction of rail pickups as the new generation of sustainer drivers are based on this idea. I needed to know if the coil was wrapped around a bobbin with the poles within it, or "built" like a fender with the coil around the core itself.

It would seem that they are made of bobbins with the core within them, possibly inserted after winding.

I couldn't find anyone who has made these style of pickup at the pickup maker's forum, though it would appear that the person who advised me rewound one.

The problem with these pickups for the DIY is that the bobbins are very small and thin, quite difficult to make and generally need thin wire to accomodate the number of turns required to make it successful. Also, since no one makes them, data on DIY versions and the outcome is pretty thin on the ground to non-existant...

It is very hard to know what the end result will be, particularly with this style of pickup, but with any DIY pickup project, that if you are looking for something specific in performance, you may be best to simply buy something that suits (perahps on ebay)

If you truely wish to make one, best results would probably be gained from rewinding a cheap rail pickup...at least you get all the parts and magnets required, and take it from there. You could also experiment with the rewinding of just one of the coils...disimilar coils could give interesting results and would be half the work...

I would be interested to see how you go...good luck... pete

Link to comment
Share on other sites

• Daw: I started to read up on the pickups you mentioned (dimebucker and X2N). These are some seriously over wound pickups. DC resistance in the range of 16 Kohms! That would be a hard task to fit in a normal HB rout using AWG42. And the dimebucker “Comes with four-conductor hookup cable and its own form-fitting mounting ring”. That means the Duncan version doesn’t really fit in standard HB mounting ring. Having a look at the dimebucker also suggests that it is shielded at the bottom and sides like some Lawrence pickups. Having a look at he two pickups makes me wonder if they have much in common sound wise. The DiMarzio seems to be a more standard over wound pickups with bobbins near standard HB bobbins in size. The Duncan’s have thinner steel blades and a possibly a thinner coil core. And the Duncan coils are highly possible wider than standard HB bobbins. And also possibly shielded. That sums up to the possibility that *maybe* the Duncan type can be wound with AWG42 but the DiMarzio is highly unlikely to be able to be wound with AWG42. More like AWG43 or 44. Are those pickups to be fitted in an existing guitar or in a custom made one? If the later you can do what ever you like but in the first alternative I think that you might need to go the Duncan rout.

www.guitarjonesusa.com carries standard ceramic bar magnets as well as thinner bar magnets to add to the outside of the pole piece row opposing the standard magnet placement) to add even more output. But they don’t have the pickup wire.

http://www.schattendesign.com/ sells the (harder to wind) AWG43 and 44 together with standard AWG42

Steven Kersting used to sell ceramic magnets and wire but I don’t really know any more. I sent him a mail recently asking for a quote on some stuff but have not got any response yet. But you can try www.skguitar.com and shoot him a mail. He is usually wery nice and helpful and maybe he just is too busy right now.

Now for some thoughts. Why necessarily a railpickup. I can understand if you whant exactly the sounf of another player, but then you should go and buy the pickup that guy uses. You will still not sound like him but you get the pickure… If this is your first pickup wind (I get that impression) you should start with something that is commonly available with part that do not need tweaking to work with your ideas. I would suggest a standard HB with AWG 43 (for higher output and DC resistance) wound to maybe 7-8000 turns each and a ceramic magnet. Then you add one or two outer magnets (like the ones carried by Guitar Jones) and see what happens. If you insist on blade pickups you will have to make the bobbins your self. In this case that means finding suitable steel stock, cutting it and shaping it, getting forbon or other suitable sheet material, cutting four thin strait slot in it to accommodate the blade pole, cutting out the top and bottom flanges, gluing them to the pole pieces (getting everything straight and square!!!), insulating the steel core to avoid short outs and if I’m not mistaken it is now time to put thousands of turns of wire on the coil without breaking the wire. It is a good idea to get a set of stuff from guitar Jones or somewhere else and start with that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am looking to build a pickup that is really high output and has nice harmonics. Since the rails seem to be a task most are unsure of....should I go ahead and make a traditional humbucker with regular pole pieces? Does it matter if I use the screws like a regular PAF or not? also, I noticed that the seymor JB uses 44 awg wire. Would I benefit from using taht gauge, or should I just use 42 awg?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...