Replacing A Fretboard

[gibsonsg26]

hi guys i had a quick question for you all. I removed the fretboard from a yamaha pacifica neck that i had scalloped after realizing it was a pretty bad job. now im getting ready to get a new fretboard for it and practice fretting and inlaying. (i got the neck for $40 when i didnt know about checking necks for quality) should i glue the board on in rough dimensions then trim and sand or should i cut it very close to the right dimemnsions then clean it up a bit. Thanks in advance.

George

Edited July 11, 2007 by gibsonsg26

[Acousticraft]

It is better to get it fitting perfectly before you glue it on. Mark a centre line on the finger board and on the neck so you can line the two up perfectly. Mark down each side of the neck on the back of the fingerboard with a scriber to get an accurate shape.

Then you can cut off the excess waste and plane down to your scribed line until you have a neat fit. You can do your inlays next and work your spacing off the centreline and sand smooth with a radius block.

What I do is clamp the fingerboard down so it fits perfectly and use 4 brass thumb tacks with the heads snipped off with side cutters for locating pins. Put one of the thumb tacks in a drill and drill 2 holes each, in the first fret slot and up at the 20th fret about 10mm from each edge.

Drill through the fingerboard into the neck and you have accurate locating for you fingerboard when you glue it.

Take off the fingerboard and drive the thumb tacks into the neck with the points upwards. Check that they are deep enough so they are below the level of the fret slot.

Apply glue thinly to both surfaces and spread it with your finger so it is all thinly covered. Then align the fingerboard with the pins and push it on by hand and check the fit. If all is aligned properly lightly clamp until you see squeeze out at the edges.

I have a clamping jig made up the shape of the fingerboard and with a thin strip of timber the length of the fingerboard down each edge so the clamping pressure is at each edge and not in the middle of the fingerboard. Use 5-6 clamps down the fingerboard. Use cardboard under the clamps on the neck so it doesn't mark it.

You can drill and fit your side markers once the glue is dry.

Edited July 11, 2007 by Acousticraft

[gibsonsg26]

thanks for the help

[Mickguard]

It is better to get it fitting perfectly before you glue it on. .

I don't quite agree with this. (Even makes me want to come out of hiding to post this)

I think it's much easier to get a good (i.e., invisible) glue line if you leave a bit of excess fretboard. Not a whole lot mind you, but enough where you'll have to sand down the edges to the wood of the neck.

It's also extremely difficult to match up a shaped fretboard to a neck --there are always minor variations, but on a fretboard, minor becomes major very quickly. If you leave a bit of overhang, you can match the taper of the fretboard to the neck exactly.

My feeling is that allowing the fretboard to overhang the taper --I'm talking a millimeter or two--lets the clamps grip better, permitting a more regular glue line.

The rest of Acousticraft's tips are great. ESPECIALLY the center line. I use a laser sight for getting that.

Since you removed the original fretboard, you'll want to check the neck to make sure it's still level. And you'll want to remove every last bit of glue. It's hard to believe how much just an ultra-thin spot of leftover glue can mess up your new glue joint.

As for the set pins--yes, they're helpful, but I've found (from hard experience) that a fretboard can and will drift anyway if you don't place the clamps properly. You have to keep checking them and rechecking them as the wood absorbs the glue.

[jmrentis]

I would imagine a little overhang is a good idea just for the small amount of sanding clean up and to ensure you don't undercut the fboard. I'd imagine acousticraft assumed there would ever so little overhang which would sand off in a couple swipes. I'm not sure but what I think he was saying is that it was better to shape and taper the board before glueup than trying to glue a very general rough cut onto an already shaped neck. The question was asking which would be better either a rough cut fboard or a close trim with a tiny bit of clean up and I think acousticraft was speaking in regards to the latter where the more specific dimensions are cut, which included the little extra for final squaring that you spoke of same as the initial poster, just how I read the thread anyhow, could be wrong. I just think the quote was not meant in the exact context it reads as.

Anyhow those are some great tips from both you guys, very helpful and informative! It got me thinking about how perfect fboard glueups must be for anyone, especially pre-slotted boards. In a pre-slotted your glue up cannot have movement at all because if it does more than likely your fret slots would no longer be perpendicular to centerline(unless you run into some dumb luck in which case your entire board slides evenly off to one side, yeah right, lol).

I have been thinking about another idea someone had mentioned to prevent movement completely. This idea is done basically by drilling a small hole in either the neck or bottom side of fretboard, safer with holes in neck. Then you make a small circle or use a cut off from a dowel and glue this to the underside of the fretboard, so that when the fboard is in place the glued on circle sits in the hole perfectly. This should prevent any movement at all, I believe. Someone had mentioned something like this before and I thought it sounded like a much more secure way and would prevent any type of movement what so ever, but is more difficult and more of a pain in the arse than other way. I will say though if you are having problems, this might be better or if you love the fboard and want to be certain. Anyway, I'm sure most people think that is going overboard, but seeing how many people run into problems here, makes it seem more reasonable, at least IMO. It would actually go quickly if you bought a tiny dowel and matched up a drill bit. Thoughts? J

Edited July 12, 2007 by jmrentis

[Mickguard]

I'd imagine acousticraft assumed there would ever so little overhang

Well, he used the word 'perfect' so I read it that way.

As for the slipping thing...the only time I really have a problem with that is when I use a long radius block on top of the fretboard (which is already radiused). Of course this provides some nice even pressure, but the problem I run into is that I can't actually see what is going on with the fretboard anymore. Which is why when things slip, I don't notice until it's too late.

Which is what happened to me the other day--I forgot I didn't like the radius block method, used it anyway, and the board slipped. Luckily I was able to correct that.

I find that by clamping down directly onto the fretboard, I can keep the slippage under control--I learned to use a slower-setting glue, which gives me more time to get things adjusted right. I clamp the ends first, then work from the middle, checking the ends as I go along. I use center lines drawn on the fboard and on the neck, plus a couple of other witness lines, to make sure things are where I want them. This way isn't perfect either, because of the radius. But I have a lot of clamps, that helps.

Oh yeah, I'm speaking here about clamping a fretboard to an uncarved neck. What I just did the other day was clamp a fretboard to a carved neck--much more difficult!

I just re-read Acousicraft's post, the part about the clamping jig he uses --that seems like a great solution, IF you go for a perfectly trimmed fboard.

[jmrentis]

I'd imagine acousticraft assumed there would ever so little overhang

Well, he used the word 'perfect' so I read it that way.

I gotcha and I read it the same way. It wasn't until later when I read it again I thought maybe when using perfect just meant being cut to size instead of rough cut, but I could totally be wrong and he means cut exactly to size with little or no sanding takes place.

Anyhow, I hadn't thought about that difficulty you mentioned with the radius block, thats a good point. If the top of the raidus block isn't perfectly flat it could also end up causing the clamps to put sideways pressure on the fboard, same thing if the block didn't match centerline. I just hadn't thought of the possible problems in using a radius block for glue up. You also mentioned using witness lines aside from centerline, thats something I don't hear mentioned all that much, but is something I tend to do on everything I glue, minus some laminates because the have their own witness lines built in, lol. I agree also that the jig acousticraft mentioned sounds like a great idea and something I hadn't heard before.

I have been thinking of different ways to do things in regard to the neck and fboard recently because I had read of few people that mentioned that applying binding to the fboard before gluing to the neck is best, which would obviously require an exactly shaped and taper fretboard. Cool thing is though you can leave extra binding overhanging which can be scraped, but given the thickness of most bindings this is so very little that the basic shape must be pretty close to dead on. Along with that I'll inlay before gluing up as well. Those are the main reasons that I was looking at that other idea to prevent slippage, because with all that work already done including slotting, binding, and inlays, I sure as hell don't want to scrap the board if it slips, ya know. Anyhow, thanks for the response. I can't imagine how much more difficult it is to put a new board on an old neck, tough task for sure. J

Edited July 12, 2007 by jmrentis

[gibsonsg26]

thanks guys ive never done neck work so im relly glad for all the good advice hopefully i dont screw it up lol.