guitarchuck Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 I was wondering what benifit (if any) a 20" radius is on a fretboard i have a strat and a ibanez and i mean i can definatley tell the diffrence between them and ive played on a few les pauls i like the feel of the jackson,ibanez(wizard)type neck more than anythign ive played on and i got a new body (same as dimebag darells hamer (no not the washburn the hamer) but no neck i figure i can use the hamer body and build soemthing cool (im a lefty) because i would be able to reach 24 frets if it had that many ... right now it dosent have anythign just a painted hunk of wood so i was thinking i could build my own neck with 24 frets ebony fretboard and such i like playing i geuss "speed guitar" heh, i suck but thats not the point lol i want it to have 24 frets,locking tremolo etc warmoth has the lefty tremolo for cheap enough really i guess what i need to know is would i have to move the tremolo (its allready routed for a floyd rose) or just fiddle with the fretboard position ? and what radius would be best it looks like 14-16 or like 12-16 compound might work out decent i know some are 10-16 and some are just 16 radius i would like to see what you all think fret wire is another question.. i like the feel of lower wide frets like the old gibsons have low action would of course be a requirment uhmm anything else you guys know or can think of ... i would really apprecite ive read most of the neck building tutorials just wondering what your opinions are thanks edit : im wondering about radius cuz i was gonna order some sanding blocks and such whene i order a neckblank and yes i know 24 frets i would have to move the neck pickup.. im not worried about that really just making shure 24 frets woudl work on it is my real concern and what radius would be the best all around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 depends weather or not the neck pocket/ neck pickup were placed to allow for 24 frets, i think the 24th fret would be 6.375" from the scale mark on the guitar... to find the scale mark on the body measure back from the center of post holes (can't remember how much so i'll guess 3/8" based on a quick measurment from the guitar at hand) that should tell you fairly quickly if you can put 24 frets on the guitar or not radius is a matter of taste, what tools do you have to work with?? compound raduis requires a good straight edge as the final leveling of the frets, should you choose to do so after pressing, cannot be done with a long radius block like on a constant radius fretboard. The straight edge would also (and obviously) be required before fretting to ensure the fingerboard it's self is straight after you've sanded the 2 radius's together. unless you're going to swing approach, in which case wait for rhoads to comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bingo328 Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 Finally another Lefty!! Anyway, I'm pretty sure Ibanez Wizard and Jackson necks both use a 16" radius so if you like that go with it. With 24 fret necks the extra frets go towards the bridge, so the biggest problem would be the neck pickup placement. Hope this helps. Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarchuck Posted November 6, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 yeah i know the neck pickup would be covered by a 24 fret fingerboard i can move it (the neck pickup) not a big deal as im planning on a material finish so filling in the exsiting hole would not showup, as far as tools i have (well my dad has) every tool i think i would need except a planer ...i got all types of saws,hammers,drills and drill press, router everything you could imagine i have pretty much ..every power tool and hand tool ive seen or read about in the tutorials section i have 24/7 acess to except a electric planer i have hand planes though .. the thing i dont really understand is would the bridge have to be moved and if so why? ( any one got any thing i can read about this ..a link perhaps) i am planning on building my own neck as i said and i can move the neckpickup by filling in the hole with a block of wood and sanding it smooth then rerouting a new hole wherever the fingerboard ends (if this is wrong let me know..) i dont see how it would realy afect the sound that much though and yeah its good to see another lefty were a rare breed it seems and i figure i will probly go with a 16" radius after i did some reading it seems all my fav guitars jackson/ibanez etc use this radius ... also i assume i could put any shape on the back of the neck ? something narrow as possible and shallow is what im after kinda like the backside of a old skinny les paul neck i know ill have to be limited to i think its 1&5/8 nut with for a floyd locking nut ... but that should be about perfect for what i see in my head like i said i got the tools and 2 other guitars this is just somethign i wanna do for fun ... i really really appreciate the answers and help ive gotten on my few questions so far thank you all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bingo328 Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 Your bridge should be fine where it is since the relationship between it and the guitar nut won't move. With the neck profile just make sure you let enogh thickness so it will be stable and the truss rod doesn't poke through or anything crazy like that. Go to the www.warmoth.com and www.usacustomguitars.com and check their neck section. You can find neck profiles of many common necks including the wizard. These could be prbably be used as templates if you scale them correctly. Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarchuck Posted November 6, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 yeah scott actually i have the neck profile i want to copy sitting in my closet in its case ive never had a problem with its stability its mahogany with a rosewood fretboard and plays wondrfully to me and afterall its all what feels good i figure i can use acrlyic and make a template with the scribe/washer method and do it up it was really just the bridge that was buggin me after all i guess thanks for the reply chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 Oh right you're using a floyd, that means your kinda locked into 10" or 15" radius..(pick one) cause i beleive that's what they come in. ibanez necks are actually 1 11/16 at the nut if you're going for the whole ibanez feel As far as tools, sound like you have everything and you're on the right track, but there are a couple of specialty tools you'll need unless you're going to buy your fretboard presloted, in which case if you have enough time you could do it with a brass hammer (can't remember the exact name) or no load hammer... something like that, a good straight edge, and somefiles/sandpaper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveq Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 The floyd bridges do usually come in two radii - 10" for original and 14" for most others (such as Schaller). It doesn't really matter if you want to go with a higher radius though - just shim the saddles. If you decide to do this and can't find the shims, let me know (I think AllParts sells them). You can also make them yourself from feeler guages. It's a common thing to do from what I have been told. I'm doing this with a couple of them now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 i've always been kinda... well lazy about shimming.. idealy i would think it's better to make the guitar correct, since shims are made for mistakes or mismatching parts.... lol that said (derek the hypocrite) i have guitar that's 10" with a 15" bridge..(got the bridge after i rebuilt the neck) so how much are the shims? i'd need 4 right? for the a-d-g-b strings right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbkim Posted November 6, 2003 Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 The floyd bridges do usually come in two radii - 10" for original and 14" for most others (such as Schaller). It doesn't really matter if you want to go with a higher radius though - just shim the saddles. If you decide to do this and can't find the shims, let me know (I think AllParts sells them). You can also make them yourself from feeler guages. It's a common thing to do from what I have been told. I'm doing this with a couple of them now. Shimming is the cheapest solution it seems. I haven't done the math but I wondered about replacing the two low saddles (1st and 6th string) with an extra pair of medium saddles (2nd and 5th) and what radius it would result in. Using allparts prices, it'd be around $30 plus s+h. If someone has done the calculations, it'd be cool if they could post a shim size table for converting radii... something like: 10" | 14" | 15" | 16" | 17" | 18" | 19" | 20" | 2/5 shim | | | | | | | | 1/6 shim | | | | | | | | 14" | 15" | 16" | 17" | 18" | 19" | 20" | 2/5 shim | | | | | | | 1/6 shim | | | | | | | Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarchuck Posted November 6, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2003 i need a book so what book for setting up floyd type tremolos and figuring out the neck radius and all would you guys recommend cuz all that ^ is beyond what i understand ... i just want somethign that screams heavy metal guitar ) grr lol i dont know how to explain it.. i want that sound .. you know that full on shred sound screaming harmonics ..a whammy bar i can go nuts with and not have to retune after wild bar dropping antics and 24 frets ! ! ! (yes i know how to do pinch harmoics and such .. its just my crap 200.00 ibanez compared to a $1000.00 jackson makes a world of diffence lol) i know i could buy what i want for like $700.00 bucks.. but that kinda defeats the point of doing it myself .. also ive been pondering pickup selection (even though its far off from now) anyone used the emg hz pickups yet ? been thinking about those or possibly a 81bridge 85 neck and a single coil in the middle position if i can fit it all heh i really am dead set on emg's , of course if someone can convince me otherwise.. any way sorry to bable on so much im just new trying to figure all this out and fretboards and radius and scale lenght and all is making my head hurt so again if anyone can recommend some books with alot of neck,fretting,radius,locking tremolo explanation i would appreciate it ... i just want a full on here i am born to shred guitar thats what i want to build and dont know how to explain it any diffrently. and yea i have deadblow hammers and brass faced hammers and such also lots of leather mallets a caul looks usefull but a hammer would work i suppose... thanks everyone chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveq Posted November 7, 2003 Report Share Posted November 7, 2003 I don't know of any books that cover floyd bridge installation. In fact, that's been one of my biggest gripes with the Hiscock and Kotch books. Neither of them talk about the things you need to be aware of when building a guitar with one of these. They mention that they exist, but don't talk about issues concerning the locking nut, and things to watch for when routing/installing the bridge. As far as the shims go, I would really recommend looking into it unless you don't care about the action being higher than it needs to be. For most lead guitarists (and metal guys) this is important. By shimming, you can get the strings down as low as possible. I think someone mentioned above that shims are only for mistakes or something like that. In the case of installing floyd bridges, they are standard and it is the right thing to do if you want lower action. I think there is a video available for setting up floyd bridges available from stewmac if you have tons of extra cash. Please be warned that I have not gotten much out of those Erlewine videos. They make them look great in the ads but I haven't personally found enough content to justify the price tag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted November 7, 2003 Report Share Posted November 7, 2003 the boxed floyds come with little booklets what walk you thru the installation of the bridge, including tools you need, how to install the hut, where to install the bridge in reference to a fender tremolo, but it also mentions the scale point of the bridge in relation to the center of the post...and provides actual size routing templates you can cut out and trace onto som plexi glass or plywood.. yada yada... i can't find it right now, but most boxed sets include it i see your point about the shims Davek, i'm just saying it might be easier to build the neck for 15"(or14" depending on the bridge), then just throw the bridge on, rather then build the neck for 16", put the bridge on then tinker with shims till it's 16" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarchuck Posted November 8, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 8, 2003 yeah guys i think im gonna order a floyd and see about putting it on my strat first then i wont mess up my other body im planning on building up i mean i could loose the strat and it wouldnt break my heart.. also thinking about learning how to veneer on the strat it really really needs a refinish anyway just think it would be good to practice on something i dont mind messing up then i should have no problem doing it on the guitar im building myself (i hope) i really do appreciate all of your feedback and comments this is like the best guitar forum and coolest website ive found :D i think i might stay a while chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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