Drak Posted January 30, 2008 Report Share Posted January 30, 2008 You're still at bat with a few pitches left to swing at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 We do not need you to play 'Defender of the Tragically Oppressed'. What does this mean??A guy gave a way to do veneer and you shot it down for whatever reason and now calling him (Tragically Oppressed' ) ,AND WHO IS WE ?? Far as I see,it is only you.You did not like him for giving a answer and you have a problem with me for not giving a answer.What's it going to be ??You did not even give a response as to the guitar posted,is the veneer good enough for you.If not who cares then.Again this is a forum,and I will Defend the Tragically Oppressed ,I guess,soon as I find out what that means.It is only my second veneer job,so mite not meet standards.As I have stated in other post I do not do things the way alot of people do,I just do it my way and if it works it works.And I don't want someone to think I have the answers,because there is more ways to do too many things.I will say that for being my second build ,I have had some pretty knowing guys say I have done a good job.At the end of the day that's all that matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Dean? You out there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 So let me get this straight then...see if I have the story right... 1. Your post was really never intended to help anyone learn how to veneer. 2. You don't even know that much about veneering. 3. When openly given the chance to explain your veneer methods twice, (so maybe you might actually help someone) ...you completely avoid the subject alltogether without a single word about it. Hmmmmmm........what are you trying so hard to avoid here? So Dean, for a third time now, since you've got everyone's attention, would you like to explain your methods and techniques, the tools you used, etc., to do your veneer job in detail? Why can't you tell us how you did it Dean? What's the big deal with trying to help someone out? Dean? You out there? Who the hell put you in charge....I'll answer your questions as soon as you answer mine...or can you read.Why would I post a how to ,just to get your crap back if you don't agree with it.This is not about attention ,it is about you.Just because your the ED ROMAN of this forum,does not make you the only answer.The guy asked you,and you answered ,done deal.If he ask me I'll do the same ,but I will not shoot someone down for their effort in answering the question.This is not the who is better then who forum.I'am not unsure about anything,when it comes to you!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 NO SOUP FOR YOU DEAN! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Hey Drek how about you show me some of your veneering......is it detailed or just tops of tele's....cause that is some really hard stuff to do,NOT.I would like your resume as to guitar building,I'am sure you went to school for it.Anybody can read a book and recite processes.As for me having to prove anything to you ,it will not happen.Your not worth my time.I agree let the forum members read this crap and see what they think. This is a invite for anyone to post about me or Drek.....as far as I am concerened anything goes when it comes to me.Say what you think.Let it rip.This is your chance.Does Drek give good info ,I think so .Is Drek a I'am better then you pain,yes.Drek goes off topic more then anyone to futher his point of view,and acts as if he is someone everyone needs to lisen to.Then he trys to bait you into a stupid prove it contest.No one has to prove anything to him.He still has not answered my questions,but I'am suppost to give him my resume ,because why....now he implies that the veneer I showed him is not done by me.....Do I care ,NO...He is just another guitar want to be,with some knowlege.Thang about computers is you really don't know who you talking to.He thinks I'am an old man that has not done to much in life as well as guitars.This could not be futher from the truth.I am a old guy,but I have done alot in my life.Your last post is real cute,what was it's point ,tring to piss me off.It just makes you look stupid,again.Can't suck me in to your crap is killing you.Keep laughing ....I would really love to meet you sometime,then we would both have something to laugh about, and the only thing you could eat would be soup.So post your next stupid post.If you were a real man you would answer my questions,but then you would look like a bigger jurk.Talk about writing something and not backing it up,step up and explain yourself.We do not need you to play 'Defender of the Tragically Oppressed'.Were you refering to Chris, or not and if not who?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyManAndy Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 (edited) Dean, I understand and agree with Drak's opinion, though I think he jumped on Chris when he shouldn't have. Drak never said there weren't other ways to veneer or that all other methods are wrong. He just wants to keep the non-useful info to a minimum. A few sentences summarizing one's method of veneering is virtually useless to the complete newb who has never even attempted it before, and may only serve to confuse him. I sympathize, because I know what it's like to search through wads of vague, non-helpful information to find that one "gold nugget" post. In reference to Chris' original post, he was only suggesting that Denis look for some books on a particular method, and I have no issue with that. CMA Edited January 31, 2008 by CrazyManAndy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Go ahead Dean, what else ya got in there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avengers63 Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Drak: Normally, I really enjoy your posts, and I have great respect for your knowledge. In this instance, however, you're really being a putz. I understand your original intentions, and I get it. But... you've gone so far off the point that you're just arguing for the sake of it. Whether you mean to or not, you're being extremely confrontational and demeaning. I'm not defending anyone's work, knowledge, or lack thereof. I'm not taking sides (really). I'm just urging you to stop acting line the King Of The Hill. Let it go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 I see no reason to let it go (yet ) Have a nice day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneMonkey Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 I am Gandolf. Everyone thinks I'm hard, but I only show up at the end of fights to take the glory. Ahhh, now the glory is mine, I'll be off. Send medals in post. Ta ta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Drek ,again you got it wrong...you took it off thread.I just told a guy his way was ok for him,and you go off.Why, because I did not answer the way you think I should,Again WHO ARE YOU? Like you said if you don't like something ,you can turn your computer off,but not you ,everyone else.Show me your work and resume,I would like to know who the great Drek is,so I can tell all my friends that I know you.Where did you go to guitar school,and what master did you work for.You don't answer any question about yourself. why should anyone do the same for you.I see that you have read many books or forums about guitars and like to be the answer man.Most real guitar builders don't have as much time to be on forums as you or I.The good ones are all about the music and the tone of the guitar.There is alot more to it then a few words on a forum.I learn by seeing, how do you address that in here.NO MATTER WHAT SOMEONE POST, does not matter ,you either use it or don't.The true masters of building are always improving their skill ,even if thier stuff looks the best of the best.Anyone that builds for a living ,says their best work is to come.You just go after people you don't agree with.Even with your knowledge ,your just a small person.I don't respect you at all, and anyone that looks to you as the info master needs to do more research.And to anyone wanting a forum that is all useful info,it is not going to happen,buy a book.My reply to Chris ,was to Chris...did you read Drek anywhere in it.People don't respond to you because they know you will not address their questions,you will just go off on some stupid rant that is all about you.Hey , while I think about it ,why don't you tell me how to build a neck and do a fret job.The little work you have shown has wormoth necks on them.It's ok you can let your real idenity known ,Ed Roman how you doing man ,I've always want to meet you.Your the best,I'am all choked up inside now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denis Posted January 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Flippin' Ada, as some folks say this side of the pond, All I wanted was some help with a veneer and I seem to have started WWIII! In the process, I have got some really useful advice. Thanks Before I retired (hurt) I was a qualified Counsellor. If anyone feels lthe need to explore their anger or other issues with me, please do it by PM. Denis (- shortly before retiring to his nuclear bunker to get on with trying to build a guitar) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Denis, you didn't do anything to start this. Don't sweat it, it just happens around this place occasionally, it's no big deal really. Best of luck with the guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Flippin' Ada, as some folks say this side of the pond, All I wanted was some help with a veneer and I seem to have started WWIII! In the process, I have got some really useful advice. Thanks Before I retired (hurt) I was a qualified Counsellor. If anyone feels lthe need to explore their anger or other issues with me, please do it by PM. Denis (- shortly before retiring to his nuclear bunker to get on with trying to build a guitar) I retired hurt ,too....all I can say to you is I am truly sorry for my part in this,as you can tell I do have issues with Drek.I forgot about you and that was wrong.I am done with this post, and for you hope it gets back on track.I will post my way for you,hope it helps. 1. Make the veneer surface flat, router,plane,drimmel,etc. light sand with 250 grit then light sand with 400 grit 2. I then clean the area with Naptha, don't soak it 3. Let it dry, should not take long 4. Have a cup of water,clean rag, small files, scrapers, a damp rag, a block of hard flat wood with a 45 cut on one end about 3 inches long by 1 1/2 wide by 1 inch or so high with good square side,quick clamp,razzor blade...all handy 5. If your doing a flat surface put some position marks on the wood to go by 6. Have your water handy ,and damp cloth 7. I use titebond original wood glue, apply the glue to the wood area to be veneered ,I put it on and spread it with my finger. 8. Apply glue to back side of veneer, spread with finger ,this is where the cup of water comes in to clean your finger off before touching wood,also you have time to clean off glue bottle, make sure the glue is spread even and as thin as you can. 9. Apply veneer to body useing markers , it is going to slide around , use quick clamp to help hold it in place ,take your wood block and apply pressure, working from the middle out ,if it is a big piece of veneer press the veneer between two boards with wax paper between the veneer and board....flat boards ,no hole,scratchs,flat on the veneer side,clamp it good and make sure the veneer does not move, let it set about a half hour.Take the clamps off and start working the veneer with the block,also clean off excess glue with bamp rag, work the block like sanding you will feel the glue setting up.Press hard it will not hurt the veneer,work the edges,clead off glue as it comes out. 10. You will feel it setup , when it is good and tight ,start trimming the excess wood ,be carful when using the razzor to remove excess veneer the follow the grain as not to pull it off the area just veneered.if need be just use sand paper 80 grit to remove bigger areas,as you rub with the block you can sand some too when it is down tight.If you have veneer with holes in it you can sand with 250 or 400 grit , fill the holes with dust and hit it with super glue to hold it in place ,wait a little while and sand it ,hole filled ,same thing if you get a little off and have a small gap bretween veneer and body.if you have a big gap ,cut a pice of matching veneer , sand the area and glue it in using the wood block to work it ,then sand as needed. I may have left something out as I am doing this on the fly.....but that is about it....do not do this unless you have time,you have to stay with it till done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 All's well that ends well. Trust me it has not ended.....I am far from through with you.... Denis, you didn't do anything to start this. No kidding.....It was all you ,you moron.....I know you will not answer my questions ,because you will have to show the real you.You just read and make solid body guitars, how about a arch top guitar master.I figure with all your skill and info you can do anything.I'll settle for a one piece neck from scratch out of you.Till you do anything original, your just a talker not a doer.Anybody that has made one guitar ,knows there is alot of ways to do something.Again I have no respect for you,alls well that ends well.....Tell that to the people you demeaned in the open forum..... Man up and tell them your sorry for being .....you.You need to go join Britney Spears ,your a head case ,too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 OK Drak and Dean, first warning. Dean - That posts was *nothing* but a personal attack, with a threat thrown in for good measure. I see another like it, and you're on a suspension. Drak - I understand your position on this matters, but there are ways and means which don't include insulting the posters. Quit with the grandstanding or I'll be sending you on vacation too. This thread has been toeing the line for a while, but that was a firm step over that line. Personal dissagreements between forum members are NOT to be played out in public. Keep it productive, and keep it civil or you'll be warned, then suspended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenspoke Posted February 29, 2008 Report Share Posted February 29, 2008 (edited) I guess back on topic for all you fighters out there I just read a FWW tip about applying veneer and I was surprised at the technique. 1 spray the top of your veneer with a misting of water 2. create a notched putty knife with 1/8" notches 1/4" apart (buy one of those plastic ones and use a small saw or bandsaw for the notch) then lay down a coating of Titebond II on the both the backside of the veneer and the body (where you will attach the veneer) the article was not clear on the technique here so experiment. 3. Wait 1hr for it to dry, Yeah let it dry. I would not wait more than 1 hr but if its still wet wait longer (just dry to the touch) 4. Put the two pieces together and use a clothes iron on a medium setting to reactivate the glue and bond the two pieces together. Start in the middle and work your way out to the edges to flatten the veneer. I would keep the steam setting off for this one. I didn't make this up so don't blame me if it does not work but it sure looks like an alternate cheap method of doing the work and getting the veneer flat. I also take no responsibility of what your wife, girlfriend, etc. will do to you if you mess up her/his iron. Buy a copy of fine woodworking issue 197 and check page #15 if you want a slightly more detailed reading or look at it in the store and save $8 US. April 2008 issue Edited February 29, 2008 by Woodenspoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denis Posted February 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 29, 2008 I guess back on topic for all you fighters out there I just read a FWW tip about applying veneer and I was surprised at the technique. 1 spray the top of your veneer with a misting of water 2. create a notched putty knife with 1/8" notches 1/4" apart (buy one of those plastic ones and use a small saw or bandsaw for the notch) then lay down a coating of Titebond II on the both the backside of the veneer and the body (where you will attach the veneer) the article was not clear on the technique here so experiment. 3. Wait 1hr for it to dry, Yeah let it dry. I would not wait more than 1 hr but if its still wet wait longer (just dry to the touch) 4. Put the two pieces together and use a clothes iron on a medium setting to reactivate the glue and bond the two pieces together. Start in the middle and work your way out to the edges to flatten the veneer. I would keep the steam setting off for this one. I didn't make this up so don't blame me if it does not work but it sure looks like an alternate cheap method of doing the work and getting the veneer flat. I also take no responsibility of what your wife, girlfriend, etc. will do to you if you mess up her/his iron. Buy a copy of fine woodworking issue 197 and check page #15 if you want a slightly more detailed reading or look at it in the store and save $8 US. April 2008 issue Thanks for that, Woodenspoke. Hmmmmm! If I take that point by point, then... I assume 1 - misting the surface is to counteract the effect of the adhesive on the back to curl the veneer. Makes sense. I don't understand the use of the notches. The problems had with my very first attempt using the tutorial on veneer that used a bag of sand failed miserably because,among other reasons, I believe that I didn't have an even spread of adhesive over either the body or the veneer. So, using a notched spreader, I wouldn't have an even glue surface either?!?!? The waiting an hour and then using a hot iron fits what I read in a book I bought on veneering. All in all, that sounds like someting to try. I think I did say in an earlier post theat I had chickened out of using a veneer on this project and got a drop top instead, But I am determined to do bird's eye maple veneered body eventually, so I'll add this to the other couple of suggestions I have had. BTW I can't reliably get FWW this side of the pond. If anyone could get a copy of the article to me in some form, I'd really appreciate it. Denis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.