Neck Scales

[Astro2k]

Hi I a newbie I put together a guitar with parts I had and parts I bought. well being I don't know anything bout building a guitar it turns out I have a 22 fret neck on a body that was made for 24 fret neck. i'm about an octave high @ 12th fret. how do I measure shouldn't it be from nut to 12th fret the same distance as bridge to 12th fret? or could I get any 24 fret neck and make it work? also I changed tremolos on the guitar from Floyd to Kahler it fit in the same stud holes thanks for you help.

[joshvegas]

Hi,

Someone more knowledgable will be along shortly. But what do you mean by its almost an octave high at the 12 fret? do you mean the intonation is almost right or that it's an octave higher than it should be?

The distance from the 12th fret to the bridge will be slightly longer than the distance from the 12th fret to the nut to compensate for pressing the string down onto the fret making the vibrating section of the string ever so slightly longer than half the length of the unfretted string.

The experts will provide guidance but it's the weekend so you may have to be patient.

Edited March 9, 2008 by joshvegas

[low end fuzz]

when placing your bridge, you should be the same distance from nut to 12, and 12 to bridge;

from this point you fine tune for intonation;

the scale length is more impt, than number of frets; it could be a 20 fret neck, as long as the scale is correct; but im assuming that you prolly dont have a tenon (ala fender) and stuck it plunk where the 24 (no tenon) was living;

which would give you a problem, so all you could do is bolt it where its supposed to go and put up with a gap under the neck, or fit it right in the pocket and move your bridge acordingly (better option)

[joshvegas]

I was factoring in the intonation sorry!

[Astro2k]

yeah I was at my guitar lesson yesterday we got our guitars in tune and when we both played in the area of the 12th fret I was about an octave higher but the guitars were in tune with one other. I had the repair guy take a quick look at it, he made a couple measurements and asked if I had put the guitar together myself. He said the body was made for a 24 fret neck and I had a 22 on it. he said it was off by about 5/8in. and I'd be better off buying a new Guitar (he owns the Music store) but I would like to fix this one I put alot of good parts on it. Thanks for your help guys your the best

[Astro2k]

when placing your bridge, you should be the same distance from nut to 12, and 12 to bridge;

from this point you fine tune for intonation;

the scale length is more impt, than number of frets; it could be a 20 fret neck, as long as the scale is correct; but im assuming that you prolly dont have a tenon (ala fender) and stuck it plunk where the 24 (no tenon) was living;

which would give you a problem, so all you could do is bolt it where its supposed to go and put up with a gap under the neck, or fit it right in the pocket and move your bridge acordingly (better option)

when you measure from bridge to 12th fret is it the point where the string makes contact to the bridge?

[Astro2k]

when placing your bridge, you should be the same distance from nut to 12, and 12 to bridge;

from this point you fine tune for intonation;

the scale length is more impt, than number of frets; it could be a 20 fret neck, as long as the scale is correct; but im assuming that you prolly dont have a tenon (ala fender) and stuck it plunk where the 24 (no tenon) was living;

which would give you a problem, so all you could do is bolt it where its supposed to go and put up with a gap under the neck, or fit it right in the pocket and move your bridge acordingly (better option)

Yeah I put the Kahler bridge useing the same stud hole as the F/R was mounted, but wouldn't 24 fret neck be a bit longer then 22? thus making distance from bridge to fret longer?

[low end fuzz]

when placing your bridge, you should be the same distance from nut to 12, and 12 to bridge;

from this point you fine tune for intonation;

the scale length is more impt, than number of frets; it could be a 20 fret neck, as long as the scale is correct; but im assuming that you prolly dont have a tenon (ala fender) and stuck it plunk where the 24 (no tenon) was living;

which would give you a problem, so all you could do is bolt it where its supposed to go and put up with a gap under the neck, or fit it right in the pocket and move your bridge acordingly (better option)

Yeah I put the Kahler bridge useing the same stud hole as the F/R was mounted, but wouldn't 24 fret neck be a bit longer then 22? thus making distance from bridge to fret longer?

your confusing my words; which is easy cause i cont write my thoughts too well!

if you have two necks, 1 is 22 frets and the other is 24, but they are both the same scale, the nut to bridge measurement (and to 12th for that matter) is the same, if both necks heel end at the last fret (+) on both is where your problem is, because of a pre-existing neck pocket;

if the 24 fret had fingerboard overhang of the fret and a half, butting the 22 fret to the end should be in adjusting range for your bridge to make it work;

but if neither had an overhang is where your only option is to but the end of the fingerboard/heel right to the end of the pocket you have to get back the 3/4" (or whatever) from your bridge placement, which would be pushing it back to the base of the body;

imo anybody that looks at an everyday retrofit and tells you to get a new guitar as opose to having a few holes to fill/live with,should not call himself a 'repair guy';

and especially if hes trying to peddle his store merchandise, i wouldnt give him my business,

keep doing what your doing, but get informed on what your about to do, measure and checkout everything you do before any permenant changes, and if anyting is going to be completly replaced, make it a new neck with 24 frets or one with a tenon with extra girth to shape in the pocket for a tight fit, cut to register with the bridge placement;

you have soo many options,

[Mattia]

when placing your bridge, you should be the same distance from nut to 12, and 12 to bridge;

from this point you fine tune for intonation;

the scale length is more impt, than number of frets; it could be a 20 fret neck, as long as the scale is correct; but im assuming that you prolly dont have a tenon (ala fender) and stuck it plunk where the 24 (no tenon) was living;

which would give you a problem, so all you could do is bolt it where its supposed to go and put up with a gap under the neck, or fit it right in the pocket and move your bridge acordingly (better option)

Yeah I put the Kahler bridge useing the same stud hole as the F/R was mounted, but wouldn't 24 fret neck be a bit longer then 22? thus making distance from bridge to fret longer?

No. The number of frets has exactly nothing to do with scale length.

[Mickguard]

Astro...take a deep breath. Let it out. Take another. Let it out. Okay, ready?

Now, you need a long ruler. You need to give us two measurements:

1. Measure from the edge of the nut (side closest the bridge) to the 12th fret (the actual metal fret).

2. Measure from the edge of the nut to the saddle (where the string leaves it).

Both measurements are for the High E string.

Once we have this information, we'll be able to tell you more.

[joshvegas]

Even with the wrong neck the 12th fret wouldn't be out by an octave. are the strings hitting a fret further up the neck or possibly hitting a pickup. I'd check this while you're doing what Mickgaurd suggested.

Edited because Mickguard actually gave better advice!

Edited March 9, 2008 by joshvegas

[Astro2k]

Ok all relaxed now from nut to 12th fret 12 and 5/8 from nut to bridge saddle where the sting ends rest on tremolo its 24 3/4. i'm getting no string hum strings clear frets fine It my not be a full octave high but its noticeable difference. when you play along with someone else the same thing up around the 12th and above its higher. fine from fret 1 to you get around the 12th fret then it starts going higher. thanks again guys.

[Astro2k]

ok I plugged into tuner tuned right on then pressed 12th fret hit string every string is one higher E is F A is B.....shouldn't they be the same?

[Mickguard]

ok I plugged into tuner tuned right on then pressed 12th fret hit string every string is one higher E is F A is B.....shouldn't they be the same?

Yep, it's the wrong neck for this body. You could fix it by moving the bridge (back by 3/4 inch or so), but it probably isn't worth it. Your better bet would be replace it with the proper neck --24 frets as you guessed. Save this neck for the next project.

[GregP]

For those who haven't noticed yet-- he means the note is one TONE higher, not one octave. Just using incorrect terminology.

Other than that... I think Mickguard has all the bases covered on this one.

[Mickguard]

Other than that... I think Mickguard has all the bases covered on this one.

Well, almost...I'm assuming the body was built for a 25.5" scale 24 fret neck...but any possibility it could be for a 24.75" scale? Hard for me to wrap my head around those kind of math problems...

[joshvegas]

For those who haven't noticed yet-- he means the note is one TONE higher, not one octave.

I can see that now!

Bummer about the neck astro but atleast you have an awesome excuse for building number 2!

[JohnRossitter]

Yeah my brain was scrambling to understand what Astro was talking about.

What kind of body do you have?

Find the beck that was designed for it.

Or build one

[Astro2k]

Yeah my brain was scrambling to understand what Astro was talking about.

What kind of body do you have?

Find the beck that was designed for it.

Or build one

Sorry for the lack of liego Its an older washburn body can't find the correct neck for it thansk for all the help

[JohnRossitter]

Yeah my brain was scrambling to understand what Astro was talking about.

What kind of body do you have?

Find the beck that was designed for it.

Or build one

Sorry for the lack of liego Its an older washburn body can't find the correct neck for it thansk for all the help

Tried Ebay?

[Astro2k]

Yeah my brain was scrambling to understand what Astro was talking about.

What kind of body do you have?

Find the beck that was designed for it.

Or build one

Sorry for the lack of liego Its an older washburn body can't find the correct neck for it thansk for all the help

Tried Ebay?

yup everyday found a LTD neck that would sweet on it

[fryovanni]

Nice work cool hand Mick!