soapbarstrat Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Anyway...titebond is great...but I see no reason you would ever have to steam apart a body blank down the center line... I *think* it was the centerline being glued, when I watched a DVD of a small (but well respected) Luthier building a guitar, and he was using Gorilla glue for at least part of the job. I was surprised to see him using Gorilla glue, but he was quite innovative with his whole operation, so I guess that says something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 I believe Woodenspoke's point is, why complicate things? Stick with tried and true methods. I've always used Titebond I for everything, but I plan on using Titebond Polyurethane glue for setting the necks of my current builds due to the superior gap filling capability of poly glues. Uh, while polyurethane glue may well fill gaps, all that foam has exactly NO sturctural strength whatsoever. If you can't machine accurately enough to get perfect, gap-free joints - required for hot hide, CA, titebond and poly, actually more so with poly, which requires a bit of moisture to really catalyze and more clamping power as the expanding foam will try to 'force' the joint apart a little - use epoxy. That has cohesive and adhesive stregth, and can fill your gaps an provide strength. So, yeah, nice that it fills gaps. But it won't do your neck stregnth any good. I do use polys for laminating things like end blocks for acoustics - anywhere where I might convievably want to steam/heat off a section of the guitar without wanting said section to delaminate while I'm doing the steaming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattharris75 Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 Since I seem to be catching flack for my earlier post, here is one of the joints in question. There is nothing inferior about it. It fits tightly and the bass can be handled by the neck and manipulated in any direction with no movement. A bass builder on another site, whose work I respect, uses Titebond poly for his neck joints. The only gap in this neck joint can be seen at the end of the tenon where there is about a 3/32" gap between the end of the tenon and the neck pocket route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenspoke Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 Since I seem to be catching flack for my earlier post, here is one of the joints in question. There is nothing inferior about it. It fits tightly and the bass can be handled by the neck and manipulated in any direction with no movement. A bass builder on another site, whose work I respect, uses Titebond poly for his neck joints. The only gap in this neck joint can be seen at the end of the tenon where there is about a 3/32" gap between the end of the tenon and the neck pocket route. Filling gaps with any type of glue does not make it look better. Make a shim from the darker body wood and add that during the glue up. That will hide the gap as well as any other method. Also given the length of the pocket any gap under this fix should not be an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattharris75 Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 The gap will be covered by a pickup anyway, so ultimately it doesn't matter. I just figured since I knew someone who does really nice work that had used the poly glue in this application, I might as well use it to fill up this gap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 I have nothing to add to these glue wars, but I wanted to recommend two excellent YouTube videos on different adhesives that I'm not some here have not yet seen. -Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 Hey Dave, Those were worth watching. Thanks for posting the links. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotYou Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 (edited) I never considered putting cocaine in my epoxy Those were worth watching, thanks. Edited February 18, 2009 by NotYou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VesQ Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 Is that silica powder the guy is using for epoxy filler in the video ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotYou Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 (edited) Is that silica powder the guy is using for epoxy filler in the video ? It's c-c-c-cocaine! :D Edited February 18, 2009 by NotYou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenspoke Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 Is that silica powder the guy is using for epoxy filler in the video ? Yes, thats the standard epoxy filler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 All his videos are worth watching. I subscribe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
postal Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) On another guitar building forum, they say that origional titebond (1) dries harder than all the others. This prevents creep which happens over a LONG period of time. Elmers carpenter glue is very good, but titebond is better. So- 1 titebond origional 2 elmers "carpenter" glue 3 epoxy/hide/gorilla for special uses. Oily woods like cocobolo, gluing fretboards so water doesnt back bow a neck, etc. There is no place for titebond II or III in guitarbuilding. Elmers white glue submerged in water for a few minutes will release. Whoever claims white/yellow glue submerged for 2 days still holds... I dont believe it for a second.You want your instrument to last the long haul- spend a dollar extra and get the RIGHT glue for the job which will hold up over time. Now, if you're in a foreign country, and cant get a certain brand, things are different I understand, but still get the best materials available to you. Edited February 25, 2009 by postal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Elmers white glue submerged in water for a few minutes will release. Whoever claims white/yellow glue submerged for 2 days still holds... I dont believe it for a second.You want your instrument to last the long haul- spend a dollar extra and get the RIGHT glue for the job which will hold up over time. Well, Elmer's white glue is made to disolve fast so you can wash it off the pre-schoolers who get it all over themselves. Carpenter's glue is different. Still, you won't believe it until you try it, so try it. Glue a couple of 4x4" scraps of hardwood together, let it dry a week or so, and then put them in a bucket of water. As to titebond III suffering from creep, I haven't seen it, and while I have seen a lot of people claim it creeps, none of them seem to have any experience with it doing so. I do know people who have seen it with TBII. TBI is an aliphatic resin, I think TBII dark might be as well. TBII AND III are PVA's. In theory, they'll all creep some under stress, and while aliphatic resins may creep a touch less in theory, III is very tough stuff. I'd guess the reason people say it creeps is because it's a PVA. Of course, so is that Elmers you saw recommended . . . Regards, Todd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 As to this bucket of water thing, I'm gonna weight in and say I don't really care personally. I think the lesson to be learned here is that you should never let a guitar sit in a bucket of water for two days. -Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenspoke Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 As to this bucket of water thing, I'm gonna weight in and say I don't really care personally. But if you were a Singing guitar playing Gondola operator it may make a difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I tend to agree with you Dave. But these guys care: http://wearcam.org/icmc2007/immersed_conce..._imgp8076pq.jpg And more importantly, she: http://pro.corbis.com/images/42-16181089.j...6E8165A41A32%7D might too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) and I think this guy will care if that Orca doesn't like his playing http://www.uiah.fi/virtu/measure/wp-conten...r-with-orca.jpg But this guy CLEARLY cares the most! http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/200..._uZKyy_5965.jpg Do you think he's one of the Borrowers? Edited February 25, 2009 by ToddW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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