Headstock Angle

[RestorationAD]

I am considering reducing my headstock angles again. Years ago I moved from 14 degrees to 12 degrees for some reasons I have forgot.... I think it was to reduce the break angle of the strings against the nut. After finishing up my first telecaster and having to install string trees I am wondering how shallow I can go without them. I recently worked on a Carvin that had an 8.25 degree angle and i thought... man I could save some wood in my neck blanks with that shallow an angle.

I think that the locking tuners I use have shorter posts so that helps in the process. I also like to recess my tuners so that helps as well.

Anyone have any caveats, input, or voodoo comments on headstock angles?

Lets here them.

[verhoevenc]

I was talking with some folks about Bigsby's the other day and someone said that if you go shallower than 8 degrees break angle over the bridge the the Bigsby you start losing sustain, tuning stability, etc. etc. I imagine this would then hold true for nut break angles as well? Also, if 8 degrees is enough down-pressure on the bridge (where you're STRUMMING) I'm sure it's enough to keep the the strings in nut slots far away from the input of energy by your pick. So I say why not give it a try? I say build a bolt on and two identical necks, one with 12-14 degrees, and one with 8. Swap 'um back and forth and see what ya think.

Chris

[RestorationAD]

I was talking with some folks about Bigsby's the other day and someone said that if you go shallower than 8 degrees break angle over the bridge the the Bigsby you start losing sustain, tuning stability, etc. etc. I imagine this would then hold true for nut break angles as well? Also, if 8 degrees is enough down-pressure on the bridge (where you're STRUMMING) I'm sure it's enough to keep the the strings in nut slots far away from the input of energy by your pick. So I say why not give it a try? I say build a bolt on and two identical necks, one with 12-14 degrees, and one with 8. Swap 'um back and forth and see what ya think.

Chris

Not a bad idea.... I might go that route. Maybe that is why Carvin uses 8.25 as well.

[ScottR]

What is the actual string angle, or range of angles on the tele headstock? The shallowest angle (G-string?) might shed some light....

SR

[verhoevenc]

That is an important point. Headstock angle does not necessarily equal string angle.

Chris

[RestorationAD]

That is an important point. Headstock angle does not necessarily equal string angle.

Chris

Yes. On aesthetically pleasing instruments it is close though! I think Chris is right, going below 8.25 isn't what I am after. Parker has no angle on their headstocks, they use graduated sperzels to get the proper break angle.

I am looking into caveats and gotchas. The scarf angle changes significantly or my blanks have to be longer, but they can be thinner. I do not like to waste wood. And my scrap bins are sparse and I want to keep it that way. If I could get a neck with no scarf out of a single blank that is the same size I have been using it would be exciting.

Sonically I doubt there is a difference. I would think that tuning would be improved with the 8.25 over the 14 do to reduced friction on the break point. Structurally there would be less runout on one piece necks therefore improving the strength.

I need to look into the trussrod access route though... I would probably still like to have a volute.

I wanted some input on experiments others have tried before I go experimenting myself (time is such an issue).

[verhoevenc]

Or do scarf joints....

Chris

[Musiclogic]

the general rule of thumb is that angles of 10 degrees to 15 degreees maximum provide the best balance of string to nut tension for sustain without over bending at the fulcrum. Below 10 degrees the nut slot angle should be greater as not to get poor intonation and string bind. I think 8 degrees or better should be fine for you, and scarf joints are a fine substitute to save wood.

[Woodenspoke]

You can get various string angles with a straight HS by varing the drop from the nut. But you also increase the size of the blank from a standard fender 1" to maybe 1 1/4" thick. String trees are really the solution here if you think about it. But with trees the drop from the nut to the top of the HS is important not the HS angle. So the drop and posistion of the trees determines the break angle on the nut.

Your best bet is to draw it out and see what you get, play with the blank size, HS angle if any, the string tree location and the drop. Then make us a graph so we dont have to do it..

Hopefully this makes sense.

[RestorationAD]

You can get various string angles with a straight HS by varing the drop from the nut. But you also increase the size of the blank from a standard fender 1" to maybe 1 1/4" thick. String trees are really the solution here if you think about it. But with trees the drop from the nut to the top of the HS is important not the HS angle. So the drop and posistion of the trees determines the break angle on the nut.

Your best bet is to draw it out and see what you get, play with the blank size, HS angle if any, the string tree location and the drop. Then make us a graph so we dont have to do it..

Hopefully this makes sense.

Yes... I am boycotting string trees. But I get what you are saying and I guess I can conclude that no one else has done any experimenting or will share with this.

I will do some drawing this week and post what I figure out here.

Should have some info on Blank Size/Degree etc....