mullmuzzler Posted January 19, 2004 Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 Can anybody suggest a way to do a transparent stained finish (multicolored) in a graphic way such as RG-ART, JPM 90th HAM, those Linkin Park PRS and Ibanez guitars...? How can it be controled (the spilling of) the stain on the wood over the edge of the lines in graphic? Confusing, ha? If you have pics ov the above mentioned guitars, you know what I'm talking about. If not, here are the pics (some of). mulmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basey Posted January 19, 2004 Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 I'm not sure if this helps or not but you can seal the maple with shellac and spray on a transperant toner. I've done that with cabinets before. and it had the same effect. BTW those guitars are cool, where did you find the pics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted January 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 The RG-ART is from some guy's collection site. I think that he sold that one. As far as the JPM 90th HAM goes, it is from the Rich Harris's site ibanezrules.com Hey, Drak, do you have any suggestions, bro? mullmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snork Posted January 19, 2004 Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 however they did it is awesome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 19, 2004 Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 mask off all but the section you want to shade,then spray the transparent color you desire on it...then let dry and remask for the next section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted January 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 That's one way to do it. I was thinking of cutting the graphic on a CAD/CAMM cutter and do like you suggested, Wes. The RG-ART was done by hand. The lines were etched by pencil and then stainded by brush. I dunno if the guy who did it made templates out of the PVC adhesive film. I'll be using the 3M. Thanx, guys! mullmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Rosenberger Posted January 19, 2004 Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 You can do it with masking. you just can't have a saturated stain pad. it has to be relatively dry so the stain/dye doesn't get a chance to run under the masking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted January 19, 2004 Report Share Posted January 19, 2004 i'm pretty sure you'd want to seal each colour with a layer of sealer or clear, gives you room to sand back if you don't like how the colour looks at first. And just use some of that tax paper, 3m stuff... or tape, whatever they were talking about in that other thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAI6 Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 I'm pretty sure those guitars are done with tinted clears, and not stained... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SprocketBoy Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 Yeah this is a pretty hard thing to do, I tried a while back with a piece of wood taped off in sections and had my stained dried alittle so it wouldn't run under the taped area but it still ran...i guess the grain of the wood had lots of tiny pits which made it look like streaks....shoulda sealed it first i guess lol. But i love the JPM90th its got to be by far my fav. guitar and would love to own one...even better i'd love to get the technique down on how to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted January 21, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2004 This is quote from the jemsite.com - players reviews page regarding RG-ART: Reviewed by: Kevan Geier Guitars Owned: JEM77FP, UV777BK, Belshe Custom Telecaster, TUNE fretless bass. Rig: 1968 Fender Bassman Head, ZOOM 3000S Effects Unit, Shure Wireless, Marshall 4x10 Cabinet. This is my fourth Ibanez guitar. Even though it took me a little over 2 years to find one and purchase it, I can not explain how happy I am with this guitar. I'll try though... The Look- All of the J-Custom line that Ibanez showed off at Summer NAMM 1997 brought the crowds to the booth. I wasn't physically there, but I was on the Ibanez website drooling over the RG-ART (If you were at that NAMM show you saw *this* guitar- no kidding; same one). It wasn't as kooky as the "geared" top on the RG-GEAR, or "asphalt textured" like the RG-METAL, and wasn't an S-body like all the other J-Custom's. It's geometric shapes and thick flame maple top attracted me the most. Upon closer inspection (my eye about .5" from the body), I can see that the top is hand-etched (patterns drawn); there's no way a machine could make SLIGHT errors like the ones I found...it just makes the guitar more human. Does that make sense? :-) Each of the individual shapes in the pattern are hand-stained. I can tell this by the SLIGHT "spill-over" from one shape into the other. From 3 inches away, you can't even see it. The one shape that struck me when I saw it for the first time in person, was the "right angle" that comes into the "full circle" just above the trem and bridge p/u- in all the pictures I've seen (total: one), it looked dark orange. Today it's VERY red! It's the one contrast that tells you this wasn't a finish thought up by a computer. The blue stain is much like that on the Prestige RG-3120, and the dark brown is close to the color stain I've seen on the RG520QSTK's. The yellow satin is a little closer to light orange and is on a few of the other Ibanez guitars. I think the guys who stained these, went around to all the other benches in the shop and grabbed a jar of stain from each person staining guitars. :-) Fabulous color scheme. Think of it as the analytical brother of the swirls. The Feel- Having owned an RG550DSY for a long time, going back to the Wizard neck was NO PROBLEM at all! I had forgotten how fast these necks are! It's BARELY thinner than my JEM neck, but I have no problem switching between the the two. The Wizard's headstock joint has been updated (un-noticable when playing) with a contoured thick head-to-neck joint to prevent the truss rod from popping out the back of the neck- I'll show ya a pic of my 550 where this happened (oops! LOL). Kudos to Ibanez for solidifying that part of the neck AND making it comfortable! The lack of inlays is kind of kooky and took me about 30 seconds to get used to. :-) The body is basically the same as my JEM and Universe, so there's no problems there. I'm super-comfy with it in any playing position (standing, sitting, rolling around on the floor, etc.) The Sound- Well, here's where it's definatley different than my JEM or UV- the Tone Dept. Now, when I first got the UV777BK, I wanted it to sound just like my JEM, but upon playing it for several (ok- MANY!) hours, I realized that it's NOT a JEM and shouldn't sound just like one. Now I really like the tone on the UV. I think it takes some time for your ears to get used to the sound. Same thing with the RG-ART- it's different than my JEM and different than the UV. Actually, now that I think about it, it's kind of a combination of the two- the availability of high end of my JEM, and the low air-pushing tones of the UV. I like it. If you've played the JPM, you've basically heard this guitar. The RG-ART's have the same pickups (Tone Zone & Air Norton) in the same configuration, body mounted. The only difference is the wiring: The RG-ART has 5-way wiring where as the JPM has the 3-way toggle. Switching the pickups is more of a "noticable" change as opposed to a "drastic" change. The sustain is great...not LesPaul-type, but then again, I'm not playing a LesPaul. :-) With an original list price of $2499.99 (includes J-Custom case), this guitar was not really designed for the "masses". It was designed for those with discriminating tastes...and guys like me. :-P It's as much a work of art as it is a beautifuly playing/sounding guitar. Don't be afraid to show it off to your friends. I sure as hell do! --------------------- Body Material: Basswood with 1/4" (7mm) flame maple top. Body Shape: RG Color: Custom graphic; hand-etched and each section is individually stained. Neck: Original Wizard (with updated headstock heel); 3-piece. Headstock: Flame Maple top with abalone Ibanez logo. Note: missing the "check mark" under the logo. Inlays: J-Custom-12th Fret only: circular part is dark purple mirror; rectangular part is light purple mirror. Top Dots- black. Fretboard: Maple Fret 21-24 Scalloped: No Fret Wire: Dunlop 6100 Neck Joint: AANJ Hardware: Cosmo Black Pickups: Neck- DiMarzio "Tone Zone"; Bridge- DiMarzio "Air Norton" Black; body mounted. Pickguard: None Knobs: Cosmo Black- (1) Volume, (1) Tone 5-way Tip: Black, plastic Tremolo: LoPro Edge Years: 1997 only Quantity: Unknown by Hoshino, U.S.A. My guess: Less than a dozen worldwide. Note: Visually stunning and a super player. VERY limited numbers make them difficult to find. ALL J-Custom guitars (should) come with a J-Custom case which is included in the price. Consider charging admission for friends to play this one! Read the Look section carefully. mullmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 21, 2004 Report Share Posted January 21, 2004 so that guitar belongs to kevan?or it is reviewed by kevan? i don't remember that from his collection he showed us a while back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEdwardJones Posted January 21, 2004 Report Share Posted January 21, 2004 so that guitar belongs to kevan?or it is reviewed by kevan? i don't remember that from his collection he showed us a while back Kevan owns one. Ironically, the RG550DY that he "owned for a long time." is in the closet in my office right now. It's no longer yellow, tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Litchfield Custom Gutars Posted January 22, 2004 Report Share Posted January 22, 2004 I figure you could use the JPM decals Brian sells over the top and have a similar effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decalshopmike Posted January 22, 2004 Report Share Posted January 22, 2004 I did a similar job on a LP a while ago ( havent got the pics any more though sorry ! ). I first clear lacquered the maple to seal it, and then applied the design one colour at a time using tinted lacquers with an airbrush, I aimed to get as many colours of the design on one layer as possible, but where different colours touch each other they have to be on seperate layers to keep the edges sharp. Once you're happy with the design, light clear coats to seal it all in and then you can finish lacquer as normal. Isnt any harder really than spraying any guitar but the effect does look good - you could attempt to stain it onto the maple, but I think no matter how dry you apply the stain you're not going to get the edges sharp as you do putting it on in layers. There is a similar technique where you build up the design using seperate pieces of veneer / shell etc... but this works better for small designs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StratDudeDan Posted January 23, 2004 Report Share Posted January 23, 2004 i did something along those lines to my strat. it had an ebony flame coming along the side of the body and onto the front/back as it "licked" its way along the wood. i had one hell of a time during my practicing getting that thing not to bleed at all, so i finally gave up and just put a 1/4 outline of black paint around it. please, let me know if you figure anything out to stop the bleeding... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decalshopmike Posted January 23, 2004 Report Share Posted January 23, 2004 The only way you can stop the bleeding is to apply the design as tinted lacquer rather than stain - because the stain has to be liquid based, it will raise the grain of the maple when you apply it. If you've ever stained maple with water based stain, you'll know this as the wood feels very rough after staining and often needs lightly sanding again between applications. When the grain raises it will suck in more stain, and if you've already got one colour on the wood, the new colour will re-activate the old one and they will bleed. It is more work to do the design with lacquers, but with just stain you'll never get proper sharp definition between the colours. Because you seal the maple with clear lacquer first, the next colour layers wont run when you apply them. If I get any other customers who want a similar job doing I'll try and remember to take pictures as I do it to put together a tutorial of some sort - or if anyone has a body they want doing, drop me an e-mail and I can let you have a price depending on the design etc... mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted January 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 so that guitar belongs to kevan?or it is reviewed by kevan? This is my fourth Ibanez guitar. Even though it took me a little over 2 years to find one and purchase it, I can not explain how happy I am with this guitar. I'll try though... I believe it does belong to him. mullmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Rosenberger Posted January 27, 2004 Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 If you read the first paragraph in Kevans review, it tells you how they dyed it without bleed. the shapes are "etched" first so the dyes can't bleed from one shape to another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted January 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 Etched how? With what? mullmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 27, 2004 Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 my guess would be a carving tool of some type...then the stain would collect in the etch and not spread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Rosenberger Posted January 27, 2004 Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 my guess would be a carving tool of some type...then the stain would collect in the etch and not spread Exactly!!. I'd guess an exacto knife or other razor so the grooves wouldn't be too hard to fill with clear when finishing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEdwardJones Posted January 27, 2004 Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 Exactly!!. I'd guess an exacto knife or other razor so the grooves wouldn't be too hard to fill with clear when finishing Go to a furniture store sometimes. Coffee tables with stained graphics are all the rage these days. On most of these if you look closely you can see that the wood is slightly scored around the design itself. It's easier to hunt one of these down for referance, than an RG-Art (cheaper to buy, too.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StratDudeDan Posted January 27, 2004 Report Share Posted January 27, 2004 how did i not think of that? that makes so much sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullmuzzler Posted January 28, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2004 But then the stain will fill the lines thus making the wood more stained. I think the lines will have to be very very carefully traced. mulmuzzler | OSSMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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