tele for a cop...

[mistermikev]

3 hours ago, Drak said:

I decided to read through the whole thread.

Unless I missed it (did I?), I didn't see any mention of pickups or electronics.

Yet, I see what looks pretty clearly like a battery housing in the back.

I started out building active systems, all my first builds all have front-end passive pickups from my favorite winders with back-end EMG active electronics.

So just curious about that end of things.

Also, I've sprayed many Tele bridges in the past, usually black, but I've sprayed all kinds of hardware all kinds of colors over the years.

So on some of my builds where you see a black Tele bridge, its usually a Glendale bridge, sprayed black.

They've all held up fine, no problems, all lacquer, usually airbrushed to keep it thin.

I leave a spot on the bottom bare so I can get a ground connection going and the saddles dig into the metal to complete the ground path.

Anytime I saw a Glendale bridge for sale used, I'd snap those bastids up, so I got a lot of them for easy money years ago.

Just letting you know, your options are only limited by your imagination.

thanks for the reply drak!

awe snap... you are gonna get me started!  I like to roll my own.  There are really two builds that are going to come out of this and one is going to get a "switchBLADE" preamp based on a schem from a popular german preamp from the 90s, the other - I'm not sure yet but probably another pictured below.  I built the pcb to mount on a push pull so I can truly bypass the active electronics - not just switch to a buffer like the emg and other popular preamps do.  the prob with the buffer vs true bypass... if you use a fuzz/wah... it prevents the interaction between the pickups and the front end of the fuzz/wah.  With tru bypass... I'm back to a hardwired complete bypass of the circuit ie straight passive wiring.  The preamp itself... I wire up to the push pull as a master gain, and generally put a master vol on a trimmer pot so it can be dialed to suit.  

 

the actual wireup is below... the guitar for kevin is going to utilize seymour stacked tele.  I use a rotary switch to change how the 3-way toggle works.  The rotary has 5 modes... essentially pos 1 will be a stock single coil tele via the 3-way with just the top coil from each stack. pos2 with be each top coil matched with the opposite bottom coil ie neck top with bridge bottom and visa versa.  This will give slightly higher output as the secondary coil won't be canceling freq as much since they are separated... slightly more hum.  pos 3 with be each stack wired in parallel = bridge vs neck, pos4 will be just like pos2 but in series, and pos5 just like pos3 but in series.  

then simply a master volume with a treble bleed.  the mid booster can then be used as a hi/low cut by cranking it up... but lowering the vol.   

 

 

afa hardware... well might be a bit boring there but all gold is the theme on kevin's build - evo gold frets, etc.  all pickups will have matching wood/turquoise covers.  

my test build... think I'm going to do an all birdseye neck... all nickel hardware... similar matching pickup covers.

 

 

btw - sorry for belated response - that big fire in phoenix... yeah, that was the building next to my work.  been a crazy day!!

[Drak]

52 minutes ago, mistermikev said:

one is going to get a "switchBLADE" preamp based on a schem from a popular german preamp from the 90s,

You wouldn't be referring to Gary Levinson and his Blade guitars, would you?

Many years ago I owned one of his Tele's with the built-in pre-amp in it, f'ing loved that guitar.

I couldn't believe the value and playability of that guitar, it smoked any Fender into the dust.

That was probably the very last guitar I actually bought off-the-shelf, $500.00 American.

What a deal, and what an awesome guitar that was.

 

I will tell you a thing about my building ethic.

As I mentioned, my first builds were all active, and active circuits tend to pick up and amplify Any stray noise.

Especially (some) single coils, and I really detest noisy guitars, can't stand 'em.

So from my earliest days, I've been a 100% full-shielding fanatic.

I've fully shielded every guitar I've ever built, and that comes from building with active circuits from the beginning.

Its just a habit that stayed with me, whether they're active or not, I still do a 100% shield job on everything I build.

AAMOF, I was just shielding Angkor Wat and the Dead Machine earlier this evening.

[Drak]

56 minutes ago, mistermikev said:

not just switch to a buffer like the emg and other popular preamps do.  the prob with the buffer vs true bypass... if you use a fuzz/wah... it prevents the interaction between the pickups and the front end of the fuzz/wah.  With tru bypass... I'm back to a hardwired complete bypass of the circuit ie straight passive wiring.

Yeah, I've been fully aware of that for a long time, and I build all my own pedalboards too and an occasional rack rig.

I dig the fact that you can bypass your circuit, but I learned my own tricks to get around that issue when I needed to, but I get it.

[mistermikev]

26 minutes ago, Drak said:

You wouldn't be referring to Gary Levinson and his Blade guitars, would you?

Many years ago I owned one of his Tele's with the built-in pre-amp in it, f'ing loved that guitar.

I couldn't believe the value and playability of that guitar, it smoked any Fender into the dust.

That was probably the very last guitar I actually bought off-the-shelf, $500.00 American.

What a deal, and what an awesome guitar that was.

 

I will tell you a thing about my building ethic.

As I mentioned, my first builds were all active, and active circuits tend to pick up and amplify Any stray noise.

Especially (some) single coils, and I really detest noisy guitars, can't stand 'em.

So from my earliest days, I've been a 100% full-shielding fanatic.

I've fully shielded every guitar I've ever built, and that comes from building with active circuits from the beginning.

Its just a habit that stayed with me, whether they're active or not, I still do a 100% shield job on everything I build.

AAMOF, I was just shielding Angkor Wat and the Dead Machine earlier this evening.

well... shielding is one of those things... if you shield a pickup too much... the shielding can act like a capacitor bleeding off highs... shield it not enough and you get noise. 

That said, I still shield all my guitars fairly well.  

with any preamp... like a pedal... there are things that can keep them quiet beyond shielding... like keeping power lines away from the signal path on the pcb, and keeping them away from the signal path in the cavity as well, keeping the paths to the gain knob very short, as well as all paths really. 

Clean wiring is def best.  Easy when you've got just to pickups and a toggle... but with great functionality comes great responsibility.  

[mistermikev]

19 minutes ago, Drak said:

Yeah, I've been fully aware of that for a long time, and I build all my own pedalboards too and an occasional rack rig.

I dig the fact that you can bypass your circuit, but I learned my own tricks to get around that issue when I needed to, but I get it.

I'm a pedal nut... or at least was for a minute.  build my own dimension c, electric mistriss, ce2, memory man... all with original bucket brigade chips.  at one point had about 50 pedals wired up on two boards.  bunch of loop management boxes designed to swap order and all.  like anything else i get the bug and then go away from it for a while.  right now I'm really into the axe fx... but sooner or later the bug will bite again and I'll be back building fuzz's with obscure germanium transistors!

[Drak]

You didn't say whether that was a Levinson Blade pre-amp or not, I'm curious since I had one.

I never got into building pedals, but building pedalboards, whole different story, spent years doing that.

Currently have 4 and I refuse to build another one, tho I have the excess pedals to make another.

Tho, I'm completely, totally  satisfied with where all that sits and haven't bought a pedal in years.

They're exactly where I want them, they do what I want, don't want or need anything else I don't already have.

 

Shielding...total hornet's nest and I stay as far away as possible from all those guitar forum debates.

I do what I do, I've never changed the recipe, and my guitars always sound clean and quiet, that's my barometer.

And I let everyone else do as they please as it makes them happy, no problem.

 

[mistermikev]

6 hours ago, Drak said:

You didn't say whether that was a Levinson Blade pre-amp or not, I'm curious since I had one.

I never got into building pedals, but building pedalboards, whole different story, spent years doing that.

Currently have 4 and I refuse to build another one, tho I have the excess pedals to make another.

Tho, I'm completely, totally  satisfied with where all that sits and haven't bought a pedal in years.

They're exactly where I want them, they do what I want, don't want or need anything else I don't already have.

 

Shielding...total hornet's nest and I stay as far away as possible from all those guitar forum debates.

I do what I do, I've never changed the recipe, and my guitars always sound clean and quiet, that's my barometer.

And I let everyone else do as they please as it makes them happy, no problem.

 

-based on a popular schematic/reverse of the blade vsc.

some nice looking boards there.  

as you may have guessed... I am an analog nut.  love anything with mn3005, mn3007 bbd.  on your board there... there are a number of old DOD.  those are real sleepers IMO.  Not all that attractive, not all that popular or valuable... but really great stuff.  I had a collection of a number of them.  I was really keen on the DOD performer series.  18v "high end" version of the dod stuff.  I would put the performer chorus and delay up against a ce2 or dm2... possibly even better as the higher voltage in theory would allow for higher headroom.  

On my boards I had a bunch of old stuff... ross flanger, h&k rotosphere, dm2, memory man, ce2 silver screw, orig japan ds1... anything I could find with a bbd, but at some point I sold all the valuable stuff and just kept my homemade stuff.  board is in a pretty sad state right now... not even wired up... and covered in a thick layer of dust:

[Drak]

Is that Memory Man one you made? If so, well done on the graphics job.

The enclosure doesn't look like an EHX, tho I'm not an expert on them.

 

[mistermikev]

4 hours ago, Drak said:

Is that Memory Man one you made? If so, well done on the graphics job.

The enclosure doesn't look like an EHX, tho I'm not an expert on them.

 

 Those are all ones that I did, the memory man and the dimension C and the clone theory were all PCB boards that I bought but all the rest of them I did the PCB and everything myself ridding myself

[mistermikev]

"guys.... I've got like this great idea" - neal * young ones

so had an epiphony thinking about how I'd do natural binding around the f holes.  this part I thought would be really challenging to get consistent results with tape, and they'd be much more noticeable if off. 

So was thinking... I have lots of experience with waterslide... and along the way have encountered vinyl decal stock.  Now I've read of people using lacquer thinner to clean vinyl upholstery... I am not 100% sure nitro lacquer won't melt vinyl decal stock... but I would think light coats should be fine. 

would love your thoughts if you happen to have experience with vinyl and spray lacquer.  I know for the waterslide stock I/we/they tend to use acrylic clear base coat and lacquer over that is no prob... so I COULD do some acrylic... but am not sure.  Am planning to brush on tru oil first and perhaps tru oil will protect the vinyl enough.

 

printed out the design 1/8" bigger first time... had to massage the design a bit due to deformation on the radius... made some changes and bought a good detail scissors...I guarantee this is a lot better than I would have done with tape. 

I'm half tempted to do the binding the sm way... but I suspect it will be harder since the design won't guide me to the edge... perhaps tape is just best there.  but this saved an awful lot of trouble doing the f holes with tape... and both sides should be easy to get very consistent.

 

incidentally, having thoughts about a clear waterslide w black line accent using sm pattern.  at the least would be a nice fallback point if my line isn't crisp enough.  

[Drak]

For some reason I can't picture in my head taking a vinyl decal, submersing it in lacquer thinner, and it dissolving.

I would think you're safe with that.

Awesome work on the cutout, I would never have the patience to do that, they'd be pulling parts of me off the walls.

 

I haven't seen a Young Ones episode in probably over 20 years, used to watch that shit all the time.

[mistermikev]

7 hours ago, Drak said:

For some reason I can't picture in my head taking a vinyl decal, submersing it in lacquer thinner, and it dissolving.

I would think you're safe with that.

Awesome work on the cutout, I would never have the patience to do that, they'd be pulling parts of me off the walls.

 

I haven't seen a Young Ones episode in probably over 20 years, used to watch that shit all the time.

thanks for the reply drak.  young ones... hehe, that show was hilarious.  not sure why that just popped in my head.

i guess what I should do is test some lacquer on a piece of vinyl just to see.  my gut says it should be fine too.

thanks again for weighing in.

[ADFinlayson]

To do the thicker looking natural binding I think you're gonna have to tape off the inside of the top and seal the edge before staining. If I remember correctly, that's what @Lumberjack was doing for his natural binding. I can't be bothered with all that, I just stain the top being careful at the edges, seal it and roll over the edges with 120, praying that the end grain is going to be merciful. with the f hole on mine, I sealed it by brushing on slightly thinned sealer (few coats) on all the edges prior to glue up and that works well for me.

[mistermikev]

5 minutes ago, ADFinlayson said:

To do the thicker looking natural binding I think you're gonna have to tape off the inside of the top and seal the edge before staining. If I remember correctly, that's what @Lumberjack was doing for his natural binding. I can't be bothered with all that, I just stain the top being careful at the edges, seal it and roll over the edges with 120, praying that the end grain is going to be merciful. with the f hole on mine, I sealed it by brushing on slightly thinned sealer (few coats) on all the edges prior to glue up and that works well for me.

thanks for the reply AD.

idk about thicker, but the plan all along was to do some kind of tape at the edge... then tru oil, then lacquer(when I say lacquer I mean seal coat then lacquer coats).  I think I'll shoot for a hair more reveal than I have on the f holes but not much. 

I've actually seen some threads where they only use tru oil and then dye for nat binding... but lacquer seems a safer option since the whole guitar will get lacquer anyway.  

well prior to glue up was not an option here as the dimensions distort as you bend over the radius.  Would be a good idea to hang on to for a flat top so I'll store that.  

 

[ADFinlayson]

9 minutes ago, mistermikev said:

thanks for the reply AD.

idk about thicker, but the plan all along was to do some kind of tape at the edge... then tru oil, then lacquer(when I say lacquer I mean seal coat then lacquer coats).  I think I'll shoot for a hair more reveal than I have on the f holes but not much. 

I've actually seen some threads where they only use tru oil and then dye for nat binding... but lacquer seems a safer option since the whole guitar will get lacquer anyway.  

well prior to glue up was not an option here as the dimensions distort as you bend over the radius.  Would be a good idea to hang on to for a flat top so I'll store that.  

 

I only sealed the edges of the fhole with cellulose sealer prior to glue up, I doubt you'd have any issues with that with your crazy top radius. 

Also, I haven't tried it because I haven't got any but I've heard good things about teak oil as a sealer for stain because it's soaks in well. Some acoustic builders wipe it round the edge of their soundboards prior to routing the binding channel to prevent tearout. Def going to try that on my next finish

 

[mistermikev]

2 hours ago, ADFinlayson said:

I only sealed the edges of the fhole with cellulose sealer prior to glue up, I doubt you'd have any issues with that with your crazy top radius. 

Also, I haven't tried it because I haven't got any but I've heard good things about teak oil as a sealer for stain because it's soaks in well. Some acoustic builders wipe it round the edge of their soundboards prior to routing the binding channel to prevent tearout. Def going to try that on my next finish

 

ah, yes, right... could def done that for the f holes.  that said there are a lot of little sharp details there...

teak oil... interesting, did not realize there was such a thing.  My local spot (speaking of teak) has some flamed teak that is redic cool... but you have to buy the whole board and it's pretty spendy stuff - rest of the board is just plain teak. 

afa oil... my one concern is that it does soak in and I could see it leaving a fuzzy line... but I'm going to use it really just to bring out the flame at the edges and match the neck... then lacquer over.  I think the dye will still soak in with only one or two coats of tru oil. I would guess that if you use either of those to do nat binding... you have to do a LOT of coats.  def let us know how that goes for you!

[MiKro]

I would have done a 30* Vcarve for the f-holes, then used a reverse vcarve inlay. Then done the actual f-hole cutout leaving some of the contrasting inlay as the border line

That's just the way I would have approached it. LOL

Looking good Mike!!!

MK

[ScottR]

17 hours ago, mistermikev said:

would love your thoughts if you happen to have experience with vinyl and spray lacquer.

The company I work for goes through several million $ of that each year.....we often clean ink from it with 97% alcohol and that doesn't dissolve it. I'd be happen to test some lacquer sitting on it and likewise lacquer thinner this weekend if that would help, and wouldn't be too long to wait.

SR

[mistermikev]

7 minutes ago, ScottR said:

The company I work for goes through several million $ of that each year.....we often clean ink from it with 97% alcohol and that doesn't dissolve it. I'd be happen to test some lacquer sitting on it and likewise lacquer thinner this weekend if that would help, and wouldn't be too long to wait.

SR

thanks for the reply scott!!

awesome... that is a good test 97% alcohol won't melt it I'd wager that lacquer won't either but if it's not too much trouble - yes I'd really appreciate that.  I still need to sand the back side, tape off the binding area, and finish the neck itself before I can even start dying the body so... gonna be at least two weekends b4 that happens.  

[mistermikev]

2 hours ago, MiKro said:

I would have done a 30* Vcarve for the f-holes, then used a reverse vcarve inlay. Then done the actual f-hole cutout leaving some of the contrasting inlay as the border line

That's just the way I would have approached it. LOL

Looking good Mike!!!

MK

thanks for the reply mike!  that is a good call... having cut the top on the flat that would have worked well too.  storing that for later!  that said... and thinking more about it... I might end up putting gold/waterslide to do a border.  think that would look really nice... and won't be difficult.  the one issue would be wear... I'd bury it in lacquer but lacquer wears so easy... couple years and it'd be bare there... so still thinking about it.  

[ScottR]

19 hours ago, mistermikev said:

thanks for the reply scott!!

awesome... that is a good test 97% alcohol won't melt it I'd wager that lacquer won't either but if it's not too much trouble - yes I'd really appreciate that.  I still need to sand the back side, tape off the binding area, and finish the neck itself before I can even start dying the body so... gonna be at least two weekends b4 that happens.  

I had some old vinyl at home so I did a quick test last night.

I wiped a spot with acetone and the left a puddle to evaporate. I did the same with lacquer thinner. and in a third spot I dipped my gloved finger into nitro and left a pretty heavy glop (technical term) on the vinyl.

After the acetone had evaporated the vinyl was somewhat softer in that area, and the same with the lacquer thinner only to a lesser degree. A couple of hours later the vinyl seemed to be back to normal.

The heavy glop of nitro took longer to dry and actually raised wrinkles in the vinyl like your fingertips get from soaking in warm water for a decent amount of time. By morning that vinyl appeared to be back to normal again as well.

The nitro was sort of a worse case scenario, way more in one spot than normal spraying would leave.....but similar to what would be there with a run. I think with normal spraying and starting with a couple of dust coats it would probably be okay.

I'll try to remember to take a scrap of fresh vinyl home and do a more reasonable test this weekend.

SR

[mistermikev]

2 hours ago, ScottR said:

I had some old vinyl at home so I did a quick test last night.

I wiped a spot with acetone and the left a puddle to evaporate. I did the same with lacquer thinner. and in a third spot I dipped my gloved finger into nitro and left a pretty heavy glop (technical term) on the vinyl.

After the acetone had evaporated the vinyl was somewhat softer in that area, and the same with the lacquer thinner only to a lesser degree. A couple of hours later the vinyl seemed to be back to normal.

The heavy glop of nitro took longer to dry and actually raised wrinkles in the vinyl like your fingertips get from soaking in warm water for a decent amount of time. By morning that vinyl appeared to be back to normal again as well.

The nitro was sort of a worse case scenario, way more in one spot than normal spraying would leave.....but similar to what would be there with a run. I think with normal spraying and starting with a couple of dust coats it would probably be okay.

I'll try to remember to take a scrap of fresh vinyl home and do a more reasonable test this weekend.

SR

 For some reason right now I can't like from my phone but I will go back and like and thanks that post for sure. Thank you so much very much appreciate it. Yeah I kind of knew that nature of you spread it on real thick just like with decal stock it's probably gonna bunch up and give you wrinkles but I would think like he said with a couple of light Coats I'd be great so thank you for that excellent excellent post

[mistermikev]

so... got her all taped off and learned a few things along the way... next time I'll start with a dark tape if light wood and visa versa... and 1/8" tape works best for sharp curves...

no time like the present for a little finishing so... dove in with just some light coats of tru oil.

 

and the other side...

[ScottR]

That Tru-oil is making the faux binding happy!

SR

[mistermikev]

8 hours ago, ScottR said:

That Tru-oil is making the faux binding happy!

SR

ty - pops pretty good at the right angle.