JimF Posted June 6 Report Share Posted June 6 Hi all. Basically I know how to do an oil finish, I know how to do all the stages of a paint finish, with grain filling and sanding sealer etc etc, but the next project is having a finish that's confusing me slightly. Pics first would help: So basically I have an ash body, with suitable figuring, and I want to achieve: 1) A satin top where you can feel/see the grain of the wood to a certain extent (no need for sand blasting or wire brushing) 2) The top being satin black, with a 1/8-1/4" masked overlap to give the impression of binding. 3) Natural back and sides in the same satin finish. 4) The finish to not go shiny in a day (although I accept it won't be the most durable finish) My first instinct was to draw on previous experience, and paint the top satin black, leaving the sides & rear natural and simply do an oil finish. But I'm not sure how an oil finish takes to a painted top. Would the paint seal the wood leaving the oil to simply pool on the surface? Then I spotted clear & tinted nitro lacquers, thinking I could get some flat black nitro paint, and use satin nitro lacquers over the black and rear of the guitar, but would this look/feel a bit too amateur? My other thought was to paint the top of the guitar satin black, then grain fill the sides & rear, and then cover the whole instrument in satin lacquer, but am I just adding unnecessary stages? I don't want a glass-like finish on this one. If I wasn't painting the top I'd simply oil it. I've done oil finishes on other projects before with good results. Am I overthinking this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizman62 Posted June 6 Report Share Posted June 6 Just thinking out loud: Dye? And then an oil finish. For a deeper black you should even be able to mix solvent based dye to oil. The biggest issue I can see with dye is to get a crisp edge on the sides. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF Posted June 7 Author Report Share Posted June 7 To be honest I think I'm going to forsake the natural back and sides for ease. If I dye it all black I should be good. Are there any oil finishes that give a satin give a true matt/satin finish? I know Danish oil does build up a bit of a sheen, which is cool in some instances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF Posted June 7 Author Report Share Posted June 7 This looks to be a decent option! Just might have to do the full guitar rather than natural back and sides... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizman62 Posted June 7 Report Share Posted June 7 2 hours ago, JimF said: Are there any oil finishes that give a satin give a true matt/satin finish? True matt is difficult to achieve with oils or waxes. So far I've used Osmo clear wax-oil, Crimson Guitar Finishing oil and a self made mix of BLO, poly and turpentine (which is basically the same as Crimson or TruOil and close to Danish). The Osmo seems to be the dullest despite having been applied a number of coats similarly to the others. Speaking about Osmo, I first learned about it for our floors some 30 years ago. Guess it was the 1101 which gives a satin finish and the leftovers was what I used on a guitar. But they now also have the Polyx-Oil series with four levels of gloss/satin/matte. They also have stained products but in my opinion they look like coloured chalk mixed to the oil. The pigment is very coarse. Thus using dye for colouring and clear oil is a better option. For a solid black India Ink is an option as well. Steel wool diluted in vinegar to iron acetate will result brown for ash unless you figure out a way to add the tannin content of the wood and the result may still be blotchy. When staining only the top of the wood you should always work from inside out with a semi-dry rag or other similar tool. Coming in from the edge will grab the tool and squeeze the dye to run on the side whereas swooshing from the center to the edge with a slight raise at the end will spread any sprinkles away from the guitar. I said in my previous post that a crisp edge is difficult to achieve. By that I meant the 5 mm rim on the side that would make the body look like the top is a separate piece of wood. Which actually seems to be the case on the lower photo and potentially on the top one too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asdrael Posted June 8 Report Share Posted June 8 On 6/7/2024 at 1:22 PM, JimF said: To be honest I think I'm going to forsake the natural back and sides for ease. If I dye it all black I should be good. Are there any oil finishes that give a satin give a true matt/satin finish? I know Danish oil does build up a bit of a sheen, which is cool in some instances. Hey @JimFI didn't realize you were here as well! What I tried on some Ash scrap was several layers of Tru Oil and then knock it down with steel wool. Easy to apply, and turned out very satin. Also I will be running some tests with Polyx-Oil in the coming week(s) on roasted swamp ash. I think I have some samples of Satin and Gloss, as I don't really like Matt in general. I think they give out samples for free you should check it out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF Posted June 10 Author Report Share Posted June 10 Great help both thank you! And yes, I'm here, I'm most places! Lurking and making bad decisions lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADFinlayson Posted June 10 Report Share Posted June 10 That just looks like an open-grain satin finish to me. If I was approaching that, I would put some clear primer down, then some black and then satin clear coats. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottR Posted June 17 Report Share Posted June 17 @komodo created a masterpiece in this finish: I admit, I did not re-read the whole thread, but if memory serves correctly, he tried several finishes and was unsatisfied. And then used flat spray paint, to resounding success. As far as matte or satin oil finishes, Rubio Monocoat is gaining some notice for guitar bodies. I've ordered s small amount and am testing on various off-cuts and so for am pretty impressed. https://www.rubiomonocoatusa.com/blogs/gallery SR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF Posted June 18 Author Report Share Posted June 18 Will read that build thread - Love a good read like that! To be honest I've spotted the Rubio also, and wondered about using it on a guitar. I've seen it used with good results on furniture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottR Posted June 18 Report Share Posted June 18 2 hours ago, JimF said: To be honest I've spotted the Rubio also, and wondered about using it on a guitar. I've seen it used with good results on furniture. I'm mentally planning a build with it.... SR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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