SJP

(1) when you stepped down through the grits, you didn't remove all the scratches from the previous grits. When you step down in grit size, you need to polish down through the bottoms of the large scratches left by the previous grit. This will leave a few large-ish scratches that persist through the fine grits...i.e. you can recognize the same scratches still there after each buffing stage.

(2) you didn't clean off the body well enough between grits (esp. inside neck & pickup routs, screw holes, etc), and you have a few boulders of the previous grit(s) getting pushed around by the next-finer sized grit. Will also leave a few large-ish scratches.

(3) you're using the same buffing cloth for your two different buffing compounds. Each of these various compounds actually have different sizes of uber-fine grit (like, microns in size) and if you use the same buffing pad for both, you're actually trying to buff with a mixture of different grit sizes. You want to dedicate a separate pad for each buffing compound, and never cross-contaminate them. This will generally give you what looks like a nice mirror surface with lots of very fine scratches all over...like, thinner-than-hair scratches.

Depending on what your scratches look like, all 3 of these things could be going on at the same time. The key here is to be super **** about cleaning off the body between grit sizes, and doing a really close inspection with light bouncing off the surface to make sure you have a nice uniformly matte surface, before moving to the next finer grit.

If none of those three is your problem, you may just need to spend a little more time on the buff-out. I find that it looks about 90% good after just a few minutes, but to get to 100% takes a bit longer.

Thanks for the great reply "Erikbojerik". Well I can say confidently that your first and third suggestions probably aren't the problem, because I made sure to work each and every grit VERY thoroughly, and I DID use a different buffing pad for each compound. The second suggestion about making sure to clean off the body between grits was something that I never did. So it seems maybe that could be the problem. But you say that forgeting to do this would leave " large-ish" scratches, and the scratches that are in my finish seem to be even, continuous, and very fine; as if I still have a finer compound to go through. So that brings me back to the original question. Is there a compound out there that gets out very, very fine scratches, scratches ALMOST invisible? When I say almost invisible I mean that you must hold the guitar in a certain light to see them, but once you see them you would notice they are all over the body. Thanks again guys for helping me.

SJP

Hi all, I am just wondering what polish to use on my freshly painted guitar to remove the finest of the fine scratches. I used 3M Finesse-it ll after sanding to 12,000 grit, and then tried to use Meguairs Scratch X: fine scratch and swirl remover to get the rest of the scratches out... but it didnt't quite get all of them out. As in, theres scratches all over it! As far as I can tell they are from the last polish I used. The guitar is very, very shinny now, but still not quite there.

So what polish should I use next? At my local paint store they have 3M Perfect:2000, 3M Perfect:3000, and 3M Perfect:Final Cut. I've read about these polishes and heard they worked good, but I couldn't figure out which I should use last! So if anyone can help me out that would be great. This is the last thing on my list until I can say I have officially completed my first electric guitar!

Thanks in advance,

SJP

I used duplicolor filler primer on my guitar, before the color coats, and it worked fine. Just make sure you sand it a little rough so your color sticks well. 240 or something. I'm new to finishing though, and I have only used the primer once.

SJP

Well I'm glad that all you guys pionted out our mistakes and all that, the advice will go to work on our next guitars. That duplicolor paint was horrible, it took forever to dry and was just a pain to work with all together. We were very new to finishing when we started this project, and still are, and I can't count on my hands how many things we would do differently.

SJP

I'm glad you sorted out your problems. Finish can be very frustrating at times.

Duplicolor ? Oh no... I hope you didn't use their clear and if you did, you used very little.

On my Rhoads V, I used DupliColor clear and I drove me crazy. It took forever to cure and to do this day, 1.5 years later, the clear still isn't hard. When I play the guitar sitting on my lap, I get imprints from my pant's fabric on the guitar's finish. If in another year, there's still no improvement, I will strip it and paint it all over again

I used 12-14 coats of duplicolor clear. I called their customer service and they said that it would eventually harden.

Their solid colors seems to harden better but I will never, ever use duplicolor again.

NOOOOOO, we definately did no tuse their clear. Not after what we went through! I think I actually read one of your posts that talked about how it still leaves an imprint. We actaully used Stew Mac's nitro. Worked GREAT!

SJP

Well I'm glad that all you guys pionted out our mistakes and all that, the advice will go to work on our next guitars. That duplicolor paint was horrible, it took forever to dry and was just a pain to work with all together. We were very new to finishing when we started this project, and still are, and I can't count on my hands how many things we would do differently.

But we realized today what caused the chip, it wasn't just the masking. We made a jig that attatched to the neck bolt holes so that we could rotate the guitar and spray our front and back flat (we read this was the best way to do it). When we took off the jig, paint was gluing the jig in and a whole chunk poppep out with it. So we'll have to revise our spraying methods next time.

But is doesnt really matter because we have filled the chip already and once we paint over it you won't be able to see or feel it. But next time will be better....

I'll post some pictures later tonight, or tomarrow.

SJP

I used Duplicolor primer/sandsealer and Duplicolor paint on top. So there shouldn't have been a problem with the two, but now that I think back I probably sanded the primer coat higher than 220, so it was too smooth. I can see why that was a mistake now.

HI there,

We sprayed our final coat of clear 4 days ago, and let the guitar sit. And today we decided to take off the masking tape before the paint hardened it in too much. Well in the proces of pealing it off a very large chunk of paint broke off (pictured below). We still have part of the chip that came out, and it fits back in rather nicely, but there is still quite a large gap as you can see to the right of the chip. Could this be because we only waited 4 days? The grey underneath is primer by the way. We are thinking we should apoxy the chip back in and then fill the rest with either more apoxy and then paint over it, or drop fill the rest with black paint until its high enough to sand level again. Does that sound good? Or is there a better way to do this? Thanks.

SJP

Alright, thanks for all the help guys. I think we've got it now!

take care

SPG

Hi there,

We are in the process of spraying the clear coat (stew-mac nitro). I was curious to know what is considered alot of orange peal. What I mean is, is it necesary to sand out orange peal between clear coats unless it is really bad orange peal?

For example, we spayed 3 coats (3 passes per coat) of clear on the body before doing our first flat sand. Then we spayed our 4th coat yesterday. As this is our first guitar we have built, we aren't sure how bad our orange peal is or isn't. Here are some pics I just took today...

http://dollyology.com/guitar/guitarop2.jpg

http://dollyology.com/guitar/guitarop3.jpg

any suggestios?tips? feel free to tell me Im being too picky.

SPG

has anyone ever heard of a Manzanita fret board? I love the color of that wood, and I believe it's hard enough...

It does help the cure if you let it breath between coats, as if you spray a lot on top of each other, the vapors from the first coats have to make their way out thru all the coats on top of them, so what you did is a good idea, but 6 weeks is plenty time to wait, feel free to proceed ahead.

I'm sort of surprised you're still smelling solvent 6 weeks later tho.

Thanks for the feedback guys, I'm sure it's ready now too.

Take care.

hi all,

my first guitar has been drying for 6 weeks.(dupilcolor cans)my question is.do i have to wait for the smell of laquer to go away before i clear with nitro? the reason i am asking is , i read in melvin hiscock's book to wait until you no longer can smell the clear coat laquer before you buff and polish.should i wait until the smell goes away before shooting the clear coat?

Hey all,

What is the recomended drying time for dupli-color paint, before it's ready for the clear laquer. I am probably going with Stewart MacDonald's laquer kit. any suggestions would be helpful, thanks.

does anyone know if this can be used prior to clear.i have heard some products like this contain silicone with could cause the clear coat to not adhere. i have meguiar's scratch X fine scratch and swirl remover.the tube has no information about ingredients.thanks

cheers

yes i am spraying flat.i built a jig that attaches in the neck pocket and rotates as well as spins. so if the paint is drying before reaching the surface then one might assume the temp is too high. i sprayed at 80 f.or am i too far away.8-10 in.rattle cans are challenging i know.i also know not to run the cans too low.thanks for the feedback. great forum!!

hello,

i am spraying duplicolor .i am having a time of it trying to avoid orange peel.i have never sprayed acrylic laquer before.my experience has been with the nitro clear finishes.it has been alot of years ago.anyway my question is.do i have to wait longer with acrylic between light misty coats?any helpful hints would be great.

cheers

Yes, i saw that Antiques show too. to bad it was all scratched up tho...neat find.

Very true, Titebond original has proven to be better than their other products for luthier work. Another thing that could give your problems, as I have heard of it happening before, was if you cleaned and lubricated the jointer feed tables with something that left residue on each edge. That would cause you major headaches like your describing, but I'm not saying that's your issue though.

basically, i dont think the wood joint was really prepared AT ALL. factory edge to factory edge is wat it was.(to aswer "mammoth guitars"). thanx for the advice about the glue tho, nothing we can do about it on this guitar, but on our next im sure we'll go with a different glue. thanx for the help everyone, very mch appreciated.

Is there a version for a double cutaway? Im thinkin tv yellow and double cutaway just like Johnny thunders.

Also how difficult is it to do a set neck, and where is a good place to buy quality necks?

warmoth.com--thats an awesome place to buy custom necks. you can choose the inlay and wood, fret #. all that stuff. we got our neck from them for the guitar were workin on now. also, allparts.com is the best site for every part you need when making a guitar.

seth

yes, as a matter of a fact, we did use a laquer sealer/primer!! hopw bad is this?? we also put down some primer coats with a filler primer, and a regualer primer as well. all kinda at different times. are we goin to have to strip the paint and start over??

Does the line appear as a depression or as a different color?

no its raised, and its the black color.

Primer first, then paint.

we used "Tight Bond #2". yes we sanded the body level before we painted, and yes we primed first then sprayed our laquer. which is when the line appeared.we dont know wat to do

We've sprayed our back face with primer and laquer, and now the glue line on the back is starting to appear. we've sanded it out and repainted the back already, but the line just came back again. any suggested on wats happening and how to fix it???

People always say tightbond original is better than 2 and 3, which apparantly can creep.

Yours sounds like it may be doing just that

well if that is the case.any idea on how long it may continue to creep.my plan is to sand down the ridge and spray it again?? if anyone has a sugguestion i'm all ears. thanks

Personally I'd do the entire back first then black burst , and then washcoat the front with the blue stain. That way you have less masking to do.

The amount of clear lacquer you use really depends on your spraying/flatting/polishing skills. If its your first time with a spray gun you might just apply dust coats rather than wet coats which will actually give proper build.

hello,

As of last night we layed down our third coat of black paint on the back of our body, and ever since the coat had started to cure we have seen our line, where we glued our two pieces of wood together, more and more clearly as time goes by. in our last two coats it was starting to kinda show, but now from top to bottom it is a clear line. could that be because our laquer paint is dissolving the glue we used? because durring primmer we saw it a tiny bit in 1 little spot, so we filled it and that was the end of it. the glue we used was "Tight Bond #2". please, any suggestions????

thanx, Seth