Building JS-7 copy

[RGGR]

I think on RG type instrument, you hardly would need any bondo. There is so much flat area, that a simple planing job wood do the trick. Good filler/primer should be enough.

The JS body shape is a bit more complex, and to get the shape nice and smooth, I suspect I need a bit more help, and filler or bondo might do the trick to get it really smooth.

Today I've gotten access to a bandsaw. Yippppeeekayaaa!! Will make taking the rough neck shape out of the wood a little easier.

[GuitarMaestro]

I guess you want to finish the body in a solid color then?

[RGGR]

Yep, that's right.........I am thinking along the lines of the House of Kolor Candy Apple red. The HOK Kandy's are transparent and must be sprayed over uniform base color.

I was thinking using Orion Silver base coat, applying a coat of clear with Silver Flake mixed into it. This will leave bumpy surface so this needs to be smoothed out with multiple layers of clear. Then a layer of Kandy Apple Red, finishing up with layer of clear. Similar procedure was used in this guitar.

Kandy Apple Red

I suspect Ibanez having applied a similar procedure for their JS1200CA. Although they may have used a Silver Flake clear on top of the Candy Apple. These Metal Flakes can be used in the base coat, color coat, or clear top or all 3 for special effects. Over a dark base they exhibit, intense pearlescent color matching their reflection color. Only a small amount is needed. HOK recommends spraying a sample to see how much pearl/flake you have mixed and to see the color you are getting. When using in the clear coat you mostly use it in first coat only, followed by 2 or 3 coats of plain clear.

I will test these procedures to see what gives best results. Aiming for sparkly rich deep Candy Apple red like JS1200CA. Best is to paint empty Dr pepper cans for samples, than toss out when you get what you want.

Edited October 15, 2004 by RGGR

[RGGR]

Talking about finish, I'm not sure yet what to do with the neck. From what I understand (not sure if this is correct) that Ibanez is using some sort of Tung Oil to finish up their neck woods.

I was thinking using a similar procedure, but this way I won't be able to fill the grains in my Wenge laminate. I have seen people use a clear coat on their neck, and then sand it almost all the way back again. This could be solution to fill the pores/grain of the Wenge, but I'm not sure if I can use Tung Oil after clear coat (having sanded this back almost completely)

I haven't been able to find any good info to tackle this problem yet.

[GuitarMaestro]

Hmm....you can never be 100% sure but I would bet alot that there is no Ibanez Guitar with a tung oil finish on the neck. They shoot poly, polyurethane and other real paints on their necks. Usually a satin finish. I never saw an Ibanez with a tung oil finish. The only big company selling necks that are not finished with paint but with oils is Music Man.

[RGGR]

So that information of Ibanez using Tung Oil was incorrect. What would be best then??

You spray clear coat over neck and sand it down till almost no clear is left??

How did you do this Marcel?

[javacody]

Doh! I missed the T & A! Nice guitar work so far though!

[GuitarMaestro]

I finished my neck with several layers of satin two component polyurethane. It feels nearly the same as my gunstock oil finished necks. If it still doesn't feel woody enough I make it a little rougher with fine grit steel wool.

[RGGR]

Doh! I missed the T & A!

I miss the T & A too, java. ;-)

Nice guitar work so far though!

Thanks and then to think the fun part is actually starting now, routing and shaping the body & neck. That's what will make or brake this build.

Edited September 22, 2004 by RGGR

[GuitarMaestro]

News + pics please....

[javacody]

For the record, Tung Oil can be used to fill pores. I ran across how to do so on a rifle stock finishing site. I'll see if I can dig up the article if anyone is interested.

For what its worth, Wenge doesn't need to be finsihed at all, if I remember correctly.

[RGGR]

This is quote from higgingshardwood site:

Wenge is a coarse textured and fibrous wood. When the veneer is sliced, it takes expertise to keep the pores closed with no open, rough edges. It takes time to bring wenge up to its best color; when sliced it is creamy beige, although in time the wood turns a dark brown. Experts say it takes a lot of work to obtain an acceptable finish and the edges can be particularly hard to sand.

I have a similar experience, with the Wenge laminates in my neck. In the Wenge there are these long lined pores. To get a smooth neck surface these somehow need to be filled in. Not sure how I'm gonna attack neck finish yet. Maybe layer of clear and sand it back, maybe tung oil.

Not sure yet.

Javacody, I would be interested in that rifle article.

I'm currently waiting arrival of the router bits I ordered. I have marked out two necks in my neck blank and will use bandsaw to cut them out. When router bits arrive I will futher route the body and one of the necks. Pics will follow.

Need to order some other hardware and electronics so I won't have to wait for them as built goes along.

Edited September 27, 2004 by RGGR

[javacody]

http://riflestocks.tripod.com/fgrain.html

Ask and ye shall receive.

Also, I would be prepared with extra bits/blades for cutting wenge. It's some hard stuff.

[RGGR]

The stock will be sanded with fine grit wet-or-dry paper wetted with oil. ... The object is to sand wood dust into the oil. When the oil becomes thick with wood dust sanding stops and the oily sludge is gently wiped across the grain causing the grain to be filled with its own oily dust.

That's a great little article - Javacody.

Edited September 26, 2004 by RGGR

[skibum5545]

Yeah, wenge can be seriously difficult.

I used an 1/8" thick piece as a backplate on my bass, and it kept chipping and cracking when we tried to cut it. We ended up sandwiching it between two pieces of 1/4" plywood so it wouldn't crack, and that worked well.

As for finishing it, we tried tung oil. It looks absolutely GORGEOUS, really dark, deep, and rich, but it doesn't do jack poo in the way of pore-filling, even when wetsanding with 600 and tung oil. Then again, I didn't sand it with the intention of filling the pores, so maybe it would make a bit of a difference if you really worked at it.

Good luck!

[javacody]

You may have better luck pore filling with the polymerized tung oil or a product like waterlox (tung oil/phenolic resin based varnish).

[RGGR]

You may have better luck pore filling with the polymerized tung oil or a product like waterlox (tung oil/phenolic resin based varnish).

I was thinking along these lines too. Might give me benefit of both, AND filling power, AND Tung oil to bring out the beauty of the wood.

Edited September 27, 2004 by RGGR

[RGGR]

Just had little snag ordering the 7 String pick-up rings from Fretsonthenet.com

Dave had promised to make me some polished aluminum 7 string pickup rings, but informed me the wait would be 1-2 months or so.

Fine with me, as I'm still waiting for my router bits to arrive. (they will be in by the end of this week). Dave informed me yesterday that my rings were ready, but he wasn't able to receive CC payments and couldn't process payments through Paypal as International customers don't have a "confirmed" address. (A security measure set by seller not necesarily with Paypal.) See:

Paypal details

Other options open would be International Money order or Bank check. With rediculus fees banks charge for these services ($15-20) for $50 transaction......this didn't make much sense to me.

I like to do business with small companies that make good quality products, but when they make it almost impossible to do business with them, I guess I have to go look for another supplier.

Darn thing is that I don't know who else sells these chrome/polished aluminium 7 string pickup rings.

;-(

Edited October 15, 2004 by RGGR

[darren wilson]

I'm Canadian and i'm pretty sure i have a confirmed address with PayPal.

Where are you?

[RGGR]

Where are you?

The Netherlands. With Paypal all European (international) addresses are unconfirmed. (except UK). I'm not sure why exactly.

And it's not so much an issue with Paypal, more security concern with vendor. He just wants to off load all transcation risks to the buyer. I just think as small business you shouldn't make your business any smaller by excluding new customers.

Just my $0.02.

Edited September 30, 2004 by RGGR

[darren wilson]

Given the amount of international fraud with eBay and PayPal, i think it's well within Dave's rights (and quite reasonable) to limit his exposure to risk. The key to a safe transaction is being able to verify everything before the sale is completed. If he doesn't feel safe handling international orders, you can't really fault him for it.

Can TPG Post not do postal money orders in foreign currencies? In my experience, postal money orders are much more cost effective than going through a bank.

[RGGR]

Given the amount of (international) fraud with eBay and PayPal, i think it's well within Dave's rights (and quite reasonable) to limit his exposure to risk.

It's within everybody right to set up whatever kinda security measures they think are necessary. But I think it's rather unprofessional not having any decent CC or Paypal payment facilities. (If you're as small business owner not happy with CC fees, just charge 'm back to your customers, like so many small vendors do)

And even within Paypal the vendor is perfectly protected under the Seller Protection Policy EVEN when buyer has no confirmed (international) address. Paypal can't confirm any international addresses. It's not so much a problem of not having the the right confirmed address.....it's a matter of Paypal not having the facilities/ability to confirm international addresses like they can with American/Canadian/UK addresses.

(Paypal isn't even exactly legal under European banking law, but that's a concern for buyer not seller.)

In my case my the transaction address (on transaction detail page) would be the same as the shipment address, and therefor the Seller Protection would be still applicable. Even for UNCONFIRMED international address.

Meaning registered billing address would be the same as shipment address.

(Something that with CC can be issue sometimes if both address are not the same. But luckily in US you can add confirmed shipment address to CC address information, if shipping address is not the same as billing address.)

Next to that it's possible to set Payment type to "Service" and this way the buyer can't revoke his/her payment when seller is not delivering as promised. This would be the same as sending bank or personal check. Again, all risk with buyer not with seller.

In addition to all this I have normal bank account in US. (lived and worked in US for many years) but Dave would NOT let me tranfer money from my account in his account or make out a personal check. I don't see what risk is involved in this? Or someone must be on the run!!!

International Money orders through TPG Post/Western Union or GWK are rather expensive too. $12 service fees added to $48 order.

An other option would be using www.bidpay.com (with exception of Mastercard holders) that has very reasonable transaction fees. But vendor must be willing to participate.

Other option would be direct money transfer from foreign bank account into American bank account but you need IBAN code from foreign bank. Something easily done, but also expensive option.

Last resort could be sending real money to US, but that is high risk option.

There is a point I give up. You like my business or you don't.

Edited September 30, 2004 by RGGR

[RGGR]

As I'm slowly getting to shaping my JS body, I read with great interest this thread on jemsite.com:

Jemsite thread

I knew there was a destinct difference between the JS and the Radius shape, but I didn't expect there to be small differences in the Radius shape itself. You would expect Ibanez' CNC CAD/CAM equipment to take care of these slight differences.

Gives me some comfort shaping my own JS/R shape. ;-)

Edited October 15, 2004 by RGGR

[RGGR]

With all these great JSssss popping up on this site, I guess more and more people get inspired. So for people wanting to build their own copy here is link to original plans:

Radius plans

There have been some people asking what dimension are on the bottom of the drawing where it says 1'0 9/16". They were trying to figure out what size wood blank to buy.

For us Europeans all these inches and feet can be pretty confusing. The 1'0 9/16" stands for 1' foot and 9/16" inches. With 1' foot being 12" inches.

So the width of the body would come to 12 9/16". And with 1" inch being 25.4mm this would come down to about 319mm.

I think the total length of the body is not mentioned on the plans, but sould come close to 18". Buying a 13"x18" wood blank would be the absolute min needed. I got mine out of a 15"x19" limba blank. Thickness needed is 1 3/4" or about 45mm.

Good luck!!

Edited October 15, 2004 by RGGR

[Fresh_Blood]

Thanks, now everything is clear! Soon, I will start my Ibanez style project and your post will be helpfull for sure... I'm going to start my own tread when I will have wood already in my house, but there will be no pictures