psw

Some interesting facts about Rui Luis have come to light... He is known to this forum as ruyzalim and made six posts only all in september. His thread on the other forum started after mine. No offense Madguitar, but is there anyreason for you providing absolutely no information about yourself, email, country and your 2 posts on this thread are the only two. Mr Luis had a similar M.O. 6 posts after my thread then disappears and turns up in portugal soon after with this claim but with no details. I suspect something untoward as, if you we into sustainers you could hardly miss this thread as it's been consistantly on the front page of the electronics forum. If you had made such a device, wouldn't you warn me off for potentially gazumping your idea. It's all a bit strange. No offence, and I mean it, 'cause I did invite more contributions, but...are you Ruis Mr Madguitar? I hope you appreciate, I have to ask. If your not it's a very valuable contribution, if you are, well...they warned me about people like Rui. psw

I'll have to get some verification on the above...meanwhile... onelastgoodbye has offered to do another amazing drawing of my new box idea. I appreciate people wanting to install the thing inside and it would always be an option, but there is a lot of stuff to get in there which also means quite a bit of wiring. The box may eliminate the need for a bit of that so the signal connection inside the guitar would be about the only thing required. I can see having the control behind the bridge actually being the best place for it. If Tim's drawing comes out like these, perhaps you'd find it more appealing. The secret will be to make it not look like a box stuck onto the instrument. I've given him some dimensions and what I was thinking so let's see how it looks. Hope my Portugese rival hasn't come up with exactly the same thing...that would be too much. Even I can't make it for $19.95 and throw in some steak knives! psw I'll try the translator but from what I can make out there are no details on how it was done or anything...thanks SV...you posted while I posted !

Madguitar has posted a really interesting link. Unfortunately it's in portuguese. As far as I can make out he's got something similar to my idea. But I don't speak spanish. He may have 7000 plus hits but I got twice as many pages! Seriously though, he may have worked something out. I'll try to email him to see what's up...perhaps someone who can understand it could let me in. I don't think you'd be able to power much with 3 volts! Even the Ebow requires 9. There's 15 pages but almost all of it is dedicated to naming it, etc. None of the links seem to go anywhere either. He may just be protecting the idea but I can't even work that out...if someone could translate that would be cool.

Fantastic stuff guys...I'm just brainstorming ideas and it helps to bounce ideas around. I wasn't about to actually make the tailpiece...just a thought. It sounds like you guys are now in support of external mounting in some kind of box. That's kind of the way I'm thinking...at least to show it around. Yeah, I'd really like someone to pick this up and run with it...perhaps some of those "guests" are looking right now! (I answer all email's if your out there). Otherwise, I'll do something myself...this has cost a lot more to develop than I had imagined and has grown more and more into a product. If it were just for me I'd have carved up my guitar already. I've rebuilt my current circuit, making it neater and smaller but using conventional components (not SMD's) so it's bigger than I'd like. No more bits hanging off all over the place although I've had to mount some stuff on the back of the boards (using both sides). Now, for the box what i'm going to make is the behind the bridge thing. The controls would be just behind the bridge pointing towards the strings. On top (closest to the player) would be the sensitivity control. This makes it within easy reach. Pushing down on the control will momentarily activate the system. Next will be the harmonic switch so you can alternate it while using the control knob. Then at the bottom, the on/off control. This is so it won't accidentally be turned off while fiddling for the control knob. i'd have a LED on there somewhere too. The controls will be angled up at 45 degrees. The idea is that you can use the controls with the heel of your hand and maintain string damping. String damping technique is crucial to stopping all the strings sustaining away by themselves. In this aspect, this placement of controls is superior to in-built installations. I'm thinking a silver box with rounded edges higher, behind the controls where the battery is then sloping down to about 8mm towards the back of the guitar. With the current circuit, the board is quite large but low profile. I think it better to keep the low profile even if the thing is longer as it looks less box like. The effect may be a little like a trapeze tailpiece but not quite go to the very back of the guitar or the bridge. Tim, yeah post that pic. It's actually easier to make it silver. Basically I press an exoskeleton, mount everything inside, fill it with goo to pot it, sand and polish it. Puting lights that shine out below would be ok to do but they would only shine out from one side, otherwise I'd have to add to the size to fit lights. Driver lights are a bit of a self indulgence though. More wiring and a little more power. Under driver lights would not be obvious enough for the player to replace an indicator on the box and I'm not sure what the audience would see of it either. Perhaps the line of five 3mm or smaller dot lights between the strings that I tried making before is the go...it looked real cool lit up! Got any idea for color? Tim, email me if you want to try and make a pic of this concept and need anymore details or a bit of a sketch. I can't do 3d graphics and somethings are just more confusing if I draw up a plan. Anyway, I'll get something together and take a photo when I can. psw

I'm still impressed by those graphics...I'll have to get you to do some publicity for me when I get this off the ground...nice one, onlastgoodbye! Now, since the pictures are out I'd be interested to know what people really think of the box idea. One way to make it look a little less stuck on is to make it into a feature "tailpiece" type of thing attaching at the strap button and extending up to just behind the bridge. Forconvieniance sake, you can't really beat the box, in a lot of ways...of course internal mounting would always be an option and I think the box is good as long as the guts can be taken out and mounted where you will (and if you've got the room! Now I've made a few more developments, working in a slightly different angle that I'll discuss later. I have got it to work so it's definately an interesting new twist on things. But, I'd be real interested to know how much the idea of the "glow strip" means to people. It seems to have captureeed some people's imagination clearly. It's definitely do-able...I've just got to work how best to do-able it. It may be something that needs to be encapsulated in clear epoxy for the light section. How committed do people feel about the alloy shell. Would a black or white thing be just as good. Again epoxy moulding may work well and protect the inner secrets even better (know you can't see a clear one!). Potting of the drivers are essential as any internal vibration...well... frankly stuffs them up completely. Once potted, I've not had a problem. In fact I've only ever destroyed them (and I've destroyed quite a few) in constructing them! I can epoxy mold things, as it happens, but it's a commitment in making models etc and I'm not keen to go down that track till the design is pretty certain. If peple still want lights in the driver, I can light up the ends...that way the top one would face the player and from the front pepole would see a glow from each end lighting up the guitar top. Of course no lights are even easier. Just put an indicator on the box or wherever. The light means two extra leads so now there are 4-5 leads going to the driver. Also, be aware that at least one (possibly 4 core) shielded cable will need to come out of the control cavity to the box...this could be 4mm round unless someone shows me where I can get really thin shielded cable from, (preferably down here!) Anyway, after another day of disappointment with my "obsession", a little more progress is made afterall. I really thought that I'd get further by now, this time around. It would be good to get it together, just so I can move on for a while. psw

Fantastic Stuff onelastgoodbye! Have you stolen my plans or something. That's a great help I'm sure to those who don't see my vision.... Actually I almost had a stroke...I thought some how you'd actually made it from lurking in the shadows! Speaking of which...have I lost my No#1 fan somewhere... Bio, how could you. Advantages over other systems... 1 get to keep all your pickups 2 get to use all your pickups 3 minimum modification 4 half the cost (no coil winding with my CPx technology) 5 small size 6 good looks (got to love the LED's) 7 unique sound and effects (from pickup selection, induction drive, etc.) I know there's more but I forget... As far as recharging goes...you probably wouldn't want to play it while your recharging. Think of it like a mobile phone, plug it in overnight and you've got another couple of day's worth of power. I'm not sure what I'd need to do to allow you to recharge the battery while still connected to the battery...but...I have had it running ok on a standard 8.4v NiMH battery. Now the box idea...given up on the idea...no, far from it...though I'd like it to look a bit better than the black box I'm using now which is similar to the illustration. I've designed a really cool looking alternative Strat Jackplate. Same oval shape and size but with the knob on top at a 45 degree angle facing the player. Push down on this and you have momentary activation. The switches are down the side, also at 45 degrees (stops the switches sticking out of the guitar higher than the other controls). Inside is also the output jack of the guitar but coming straight out parrallel to the guitar's top. It's kind of curvy and pressed out of aluminium, similar to the driver. Looks a bit like a half sixe computer mouse. The battery is housed in the jackplate hole and the wiring comes through to the control cavity. This means only two screws to get access to the battery. I even thought I could incorporate fake side vents so that the trimmers could be adjusted through them with a little phillips head screwdriver. Think 1950's hot-rod in keeping with the '50's guitar. For a stud tailpiece guitar, similar thing but replacing the tailpiece with a box and having the strings attach to it. If you look at a Les Paul, there's quite a bit of depth there (because of the arched top) behind the tunamatic bridge. I'm sure the circuits would fit there somehow and the wiring perhaps go in to the bridge pickup cavity by carving a little from underneath the mounting ring. Personally, the single pickup guitar limits the advantages of being able to use multiple pickup options with my system, but it should work ok. Meanwhile, Extraordinary frustrating, this electronics caper when you only know half of what your doing...still not got my new preamp to work as I'd hoped and spent half a day making the tiny power amp block only to have the IC pack out on me on the last connection. Teach me to try point to point wiring on a surface mount IC. Perhaps I'm just a bit too overenthusiastic with the miniturization idea...a normal DIL 8 pin chip is small enough. By the way, if I or a company were to make this thing in any quantity, I wouldn't be doing this stuff myself. It would be all SMD and flow soldered in a factory somewhere. I'd just be constructing the drivers and connecting the switches and stuff. You'd never get anywhere if it took you all day to construct the thing. Ok, so I think I better give it a rest for a little bit as I'm just chasing my tail a little. Thanks for those great graphics...I hope others appreciate them as much as I do. I take it you wouldn't go to such trouble if you didn't think that I was on a winner. And it's great to meet these lurkers that are coming out lately...had over 6000 visits as of today...I'm amazed. psw

I've thought of phantom power for another project that has some onboard control elements but I don't think the general public will accept this kind of change. They have a hard enough time accepting a battery in a guitar! Actually, Roger Mayer has just released an idea that I had...radio remote switching...doh. I burnt my thumb and got a big blister from catching a 300 degree soldering iron by the wrong end. Still that's the sacrifices youv'e got to make I guess. What I've made so far is the power block, buffer block and preamp block. I've tried to incorporate some of LK's ideas into it but have'nt had time to test it. I'm using both normal sized components and surface mount capacitors and IC's to keep it small, and this thing really is small...I had to use a magnifying glass the whole time to make it...I only hope it works! I've also worked out how to control it. (I think). There's an on/off switch and a harmonic switch and a gain knob. What i've devised (cause I couldnt find a suitable dpdt switch), is a way of making it so that when you push down on the knob gently it will activate a pair of switches to run it momentarily...I'm really pleased with this solution and I think this will be a real feature to the system. I'm also splitting the circuit into two sections. This allows me to put the high current sections closer to the driver and help reduce radiation with the guitar's circuitry and pickups. I think I may also have got a handle on making it easier to wire up. I'm trying to make as much of the complicated stuff hard wired within the circuitry. I'd prefer the system to be able to be easily installed by someone with basic soldering skills...not have to be sent off to some tech. It shouldn't be much harder than installing a new pickup if I get this right. I've also decided to make a Strat specific prototype. Basically it's the idea of moving the jack plate and replacing it with a similar shaped raised unit. This is so the battery can slot in to where the jack was (fits perfectly) and gives access to the wiring through the hole where the output wires come. The other thing is that it's only a couple of screws to replace it, but taking a strat pickguard off is a real pain. The guts of this jack plate box will be modular so that the box could be removed and the whole thing mounted internally if you wish...as long as the on/off, harmonic switch and sustain pot are installed reasonably close together (and why wouldn't you) it wouldn't involve any additional wiring. Anyway, hopefully some progress being made. I've spent too much time worrying about how best to proceed when I should know by now that my best ideas come from doing not thinking about doing! psw

Thanks guys I've got a few guitar's here. The one I'm working with is practically hollow under that guard but that's not the point is it. Most guitars are pretty tight. I think you guys will be surprised at how small the circuit may end up being. The trim pots, switches and cabling will be far bigger than the circuit, not to mention the battery. I don't like the idea of puting the battery under the pick guard cause it would be such a pain to get it out! If you use it a lot, you'll be changing or recharging the battery pretty often I suspect. This is because it is a high current device, not just a little preamp effect type thing...it takes a bit of power to move those strings. That's why I'm interested in having an onboard charger so you could plug the guitar in overnight to recharge without removing the battery. It would also be cool to have a low battery indicator...but I don't want to take up too much space. I'm not sure if there is anyone familiar with digital control to advise me here, but I got a rotary encoder a while back. I think it was about $10 which for this project is a lot but... This is a fine piece of equipment....it's got a smooth clicky feel and turns endlessly and has a momentary switch activated when you pus on the top. It takes standard knobs (althoug it's not fluted). It's also thinner than even my little 9mm pot I'm using now! An encoder like this is often found in car radio vol controls these days, it looks like a pot but sends signal codes to electronics that decode them and activate circuitry in response. It would be great if I could use this device to run gain and you tap it once to turn on, tap again to turn off, and perhaps twice quickly, to select harmonic modes. This would mean that this "pot" would be all that is required for control! Anyway, got the soldering iron out this morning so some practical work is starting. psw

Hi there, sustainer-ettes!...don't get me wrong but is project guitar some kind of boy's club...why don't girl's, women and wives whant to do this stuff. Working slow but already making plans for miniturization. The jackplate hole in a strat by the way is exactly the right size for a 9 volt battery lying on it's edge. But there's no room for anything else. As the requirements are getting more clear the circuit will need to be internally mounted. There needs to be a line from the pickups to the circuit and then on to the selector. I'm also thinking of taking the total output and putting it through a buffer then out to the amp. Thats a lot of signal cabling and a bit of re-routing for people to do. I'm not keen on people soldering to the circuitry so I may need to find some kind of suitable plug so as not to cause damage. The initial buffer block may not be required and could be used for the purpose of buffering the output instead. Perhaps a on-off-on (if I can find one) could be used to allow this buffer to be used as a booster without the sustain function. It's a thought anyway. I haven't found a suitable SMD momentary dpdt push button either, so keep your eyes peeled. I reckon this would be a great feature and not hard to do with the right switch. I'm working up a design for the new illuminated driver. I've got some SMD red LED's that will fit within the magnet array. Thinking of an alloy rail, 6mm wide with a 1mm "window" line across the middle. The ends would be black epoxy and have holes to allow the device to be screwed to the instrument. Tape could be used but I think there will be a need for height adjustment and you wouldn't want it to come loose! A 4 core cable will come down the underside centre next to the pickup. That will require a 3-4mm hole to be drilled at the very least. Now if I could make the circuit small enough perhaps I could set it in epoxy in a cylindrical shape. A hole could be drilled into the internal side of the control cavity and the circuit press-fitted into it. I'm also thinking it may be best to do the circuit on two boards, one next to the pickup selector to take all the signal connections and then another to do the amplification. At least two very small boards may be easier to find homes for than one bigger one. Where the trimmers go and how the controls (which if separate will require 10 wires) will go is still up in the air. On my currect guitar I want to keep the middle tone (mid pup blender) and my phase and selector switches. I may even want to add a DIY piezo system sometime in the future. Your Les Paul require long pots and switches so I don't know if that will be a problem...I'm guessing a master tone setup. Mounting the controls on the pickguard has a lot of appeal. But both the strat jack plate idea and this LP suggestion are brand specific and will be tricky to produce by one person. So I'm still interested in othe suggestions or how it could reasonably be put into other guitars. Check yours out and give me an idea of how much space is in there...and don't forget the battery. Anyway, almos 6000 visitors to the thread...I better get some recordings of this thing to prove it is working ok! psw

OK, it's a good idea to block things up like this before you try making anything complicated (or simple). That way your only dealing with one problem at a time and if a "block" needs improvement it can be replaced with a new version without having to redo the entire thing. I don't usually do stuff like this, as I'm not the electronics guy. Generally I get something that does the job in a kit form if possible or make stuff op on stripboard. Sometimes I "point to point" to the actual chip or other components to make things real small. Then I muck about replacing or just hanging stuff off of these to get the kind of response that I want. Sometimes I'll simply twist the ends of a cap, resistor of diode to see what will happen. This is really seat of the pants experimentation but I should add that on the side I'm spending quite a bit of time reading up and studying schemetrics so I can get a better grasp of what I can try...I'm not just sticking things just anywhere. By the way, that's why us older guys get grumpy because they've done what I'm doing and putting in this effort and destroyed their share of components. If you want something that your pretty sure will work then get a kit or buy a product. A kit's good cause they usually explain the circuit and what's going on. You can add or change components based on this information if you want to to see what happens. If you want to go way out and try something really new...for example sustainers...everyones pretty much on their own and if it was easy there'd be Ebow projects all over the web. Check it out, there isn't, so it must be trickyer than it looks. Anyway, enough of that. The Power block consists of a the batteries 9v supply with a protection diode (this stops the circuitry being destroyed it the batteries put in the wrong way. Some capacitors to ensure that the power is smooth. There is a resistor to reduce the 9 volts to run the LED lights. Then there are a couple of resistors and a cap to divide the power to provide a positive negative supply with a virtual ground (is that how you describe it?). This is needed to allow the opamps to swing both positive and negative (if you think of a sine wave it goes up and down +/- around a line, this line is ground or zero). The dashed lines are simply power lines split supply to the opamps, reduced power to the LED's and filtered 9v for the power amp. There will probably be an interface for the switch so that everything goes to the circuit board and wires go to the controls from there. So yes Bio, it is just a way of routing the power to the different blocks but they require different power arrangements. I should also mention that these blocks are a way of thinking about and developing a circuit. Eventually this stuff will be all over one board and seem to make no sense at all....just like all the other stuff you've seen. Another thing, when LK posts a little circuit idea as on the previous page, you need to realize that this isn't the whole thing. There is an assumption that you realize it's power requirements and have a sense for reducing noise and often, know how to set it up for the kind of sources (say pickups) and loads (say amp or driver, etc). Complicated but easier when you break it up...hope this helps psw

So out of interest....I don't think I've got it or recieved anything like that message...I try and delete out my enormous spam intake as soon as I can...how do you check for it and get rid of it then...say I, the computer naive?

Hmmm...must be now, well...off the top of my head, put a switch on the 9v battery + supply (any switch will do, just so it's connected, or not. This turns off the power. I think I used a 100uF capacitor on the output by the way, gives a little more bass that's all. For your sustain knob...just replace the trim pot with a 1K log pot (usually marked A1k (think A for Audio). B resistors are Linear (think B is not Audio!). The pot gives an amplification of between 20 to 200x. Now ansil reports using tiny speakers as you find in headphones by the way. I'd be going with those two. Technically the 386 chip is looking for 8ohm load and it's easier to get somewhere between 4-16 ohm with speakers. They are also magnetic so that may have an effect as I suggested in the previous post. OK, now one pickup guitar. I have had a lot of trouble getting this type of thing working with the "driver" and pickup together. It's exactly the same as sticking a microphone into a speaker, howling feedback, not sustain. Also there is more "throw" the further along the string you go, hence sustainers are usually up by the neck where the strings are easier to vibrate and away from the bridge pickup which is usually driving it. Ansil does however suggest that it will work on the body and in the tremolo cavity. I'd even suggest trying it on the tremolo block. They will have to be securely fixed but still allow the cone, or piezo element to vibrate. Perhaps super glue when you find that spot (if you dare). All that's required is that you take a signal direct from the pickup to the sustainer. Probably best to take it from the first place the pickup wires connect to (usually the selector switch) but probably the volume control. Another tip, a small cap across the pins 1 and 8 where the trimmer is connected (or the pot if you replace it) will cut back on hiss, a bigger oune will roll of a lot of treble or you could place a 22uF like your output from one pin to the pot and then the pot to the other pin (ie in series) to dramatically loose the highs. These are measures I've been trying to control the high frequency oscillation (feedback squeel) that you may find. One more thing....try reversing the speaker wires each time you try it. This effects the phase of the signal (in this case detirmines whether the speaker is moving in or out). This has a dramatic effect on experiments. Get it wrong in the right place and you'll find the thing unsuccessfully trying to stop the strings from vibrating! I certainly hope you appreciate that as that was very bad timing for me to do this at dinnertime tonight ...I would have gotten something up tomorrow. I expect to here some reports success or not of what happened when you tryed it out. psw

OK, so are we talking Ansil's sustainer right...not mine? Give me a little time, actually there was some discussion early in the sustainer ideas thread also as well as plenty of other stuff if you do a search. Mostly, it was of people complaining that it didn't work!!!!!!!!!!! I even found the other day my original Ansil circuit so I can take a picture of it. I may even go to the extent of trying it again since it's come up again with a vengence. Knowing what I know now, perhaps I can get it to work in what ever fashion that it does, and settle this ounce and for all! Anyway, I'll make it so that there can be no doubt how it's supposed to go together and it's up to you to fiddle around with it and see if you have more luck. I hope people realize that if I were to tell you exactly how my drivers work and show you how to put it together, you might not be able to get it to work. I've been working with the CPx for over six months almost everyday now so that's a lot of thought and as much disappointment when the things fail by sitting there doing nothing. To illustrate the point, LK correspond on the side and we have a confidentiality agreement on the subject. He has a single string CPx prototype and hasn't yet got quite the results I'm getting. Mind you the newer drivers are better. But he surely knows a lot more than me on the electronics side of things. I spent quite a bit of time studying the magnetic side of things. Anyway, as I say give me a little time Hope that helps and takes the heat off of Ansil psw PS thanks for the compliments A.G.

Went out and got those speakers anyway...quite a long drive but at A$2 each I got 16. Their brand new and really good quality as it turns out...Just on a clearance so it's worth a shot. Good for practice amps if it don't sound too good. Now all I need is some kind of cheap sub. Maybe somone's upgrading their car and I'll find one that way. This would provide some more body to the sound I'd guess. I'm aiming for a dollar a watt! I wonder how big I need to make enclosures for these little things. psw

Hi there emre...I love logo's I just came back from a pretty long drive and I past some car dealer that had the word "INFINITI" on it, maybe the Infiniti drive, who knows Must be some kind of car I guess. Anyway, got some speakers for my future amp project...16 little 5 1/2"'s at two dollars new at a clearance...their rated at 70 watts each so they should handle the 200 watts setup I'm thinking of. The yellow writing are just the power supply lines - one is a divided +/0/- for the opamps, one is a straight 9 volt supply to the poweramp and the other is a reduced 2-3v supply for the LED's in the driver or where ever they end up. The controls are on/off and harmonic switch and the gain control same as with present systems but you get all the interplay of the various pickup selections and a lot of internal adjustable stuff inside (4 trim pots) to customise it to taste and each guitar (not shown). I like the momentary thing too, there must be some surface mount dpdt momentary type switch out there somewhere. That could simply be wired up to the on/off switch terminals so it would be activated only when the button is pushed. I keep forgetting some of the features that we've discussed so thanks for reminding me! psw

No need to use capitals...sorry if I didn't get your emails, I always reply. Your sustainer Mod was what attracted me to the PG website forum in the first place...as I was searching for anything and everything I could find. The simple Amplifier 386 plus output cap was the original circuit I used for testing my driver ideas and it worked perfectly....input caps, bah! Now that I've learn't a bit more, I'm sticking buffers and 0.1uf caps everywhere. Your stripped down approach is my touchstone on this as I'm aware that I'm sticking the stuff in cause they tell me too. I'm sorry if I in anyway implied you were lying on this. Resonance is a powerful thing and if your able to get even the smallest vibrations happening in the body or in physically shaking the pickup on its mounts, and hence it's magnetic field, below the strings, and/or the speaker coils causing a magnetic attenuation of the pickup's field, then there is the possibility of a direct action on the strings to produce infinite sustain. The enormous inductive compression effect is enough to drive even moderately loud amps into traditional feedback sustain which is also effectively infinite but with a bit more predictability. I don't want to be seen as someone who is dis'ing this in any way whatsoever. But I fully understand your frustration and have steadfastly refused to let anyone try and replicate my work. I'm more than happy to lend assistance to anyone who want's to have their own go. It's telling that I've had no takers, just offers of $10 for the schematic!!!!!! It's a shame that people dont take these things for what they are, the sharing of ideas for people's own explorations. I'm hoping that my sustainer "journal style" thread would help people realize how much work goes into fully exploring an idea. I suspect that only a few really realize that it takes quite a bit of mucking about and perserveance to get any kind of result. There's also a lot of theorists. I know I can be one, but at least I have pulled my finger out and given it more than a fair go. I bow before you and continue to be inspired... psw

Thanks Mr. Hazard your support is neverending...I could call it a hazard drive I've been trying to post a block diagram of the circuit proposal but am having a bit of trouble getting it to be legible. I'll have a go now, if it's no good, I'll try and replace it later psw hmmm...kinda psychedelic man...whoooo ok perhaps this one is better

Hmmm that looks good...I was thinking even cheaper like a pair of these: **valve preamp kit** I've got 100 watts a side on this poweramp the idea was to use each side as a bi-amp. I also got a cheap (A$10 on sale) surround sound module that will allow the addition of "rear" speakers (no delay...must be some kind of equalization effect) and sub-woofer out. The idea is to get the amp to not only be loud but to spread the sound over an area (stage) instead of eminating from one point. The idea of using it as a bi-amp was allow for more complex tones and/or true stereo effects. It could also be used as a mini PA I imagine, say one side vocals and the other side guitar or for a stereo piezo equiped guitar for instance. The boxes would be light enough to sit atop simple stands rather than on the floor. The other thing is that it would be portable, light and small. The question is....would 16x 5 1/2" be able to produce a good sound or are the speakers just too small despite the number of them? any thoughts psw

I still haven't had time to do this one but I found two things of interest... Access to cheap 5 1/2" speakers. I was thinking of four mini quad boxes. These are paperconed, dual cone 70 watt speakers. Although somall, they'd be a lot of them...what do you think? The other is some small single, miniture valve preamps. Are valves like this of value in a preamp or are you mostly getting a nice warm glow? anyway, still collecting parts for this project psw

sounds like infinte pain...not sustain so you think I should carry on then? what say you Ansil?

Really...well that puts me out of commission...you get infinite sustain with 3 components and a battery! If it works in all those different positions it must be the vibrations acting on the body and the strings via the bridge. I couldn't get those results and I still don't get how, without directly acting upon the strings, or indirectly through vibrating the body, you could. Even then, your not going to get that much vibration from miniture speakers or piezos surely...I didn't! Still I did get that induction compression effect, which some may wan't anyway. Will somebody put a sound sample up...I could go a little humble pie right now. psw

Well thanks transient...actually using the word sustainer might get me into copyright problems how about something more poetic like...um...forever drive So it looks like the thing is going to come together and fullfil the original criteria somewhat, now that's a surprise. I'll try and put together a block diagram of the circuit and guitar modifications that will be required. I'll also put together something pretty much finished for a driver with illumination provided by surface mount LED's. I'm not sure if I can realistically get the thing smaller than 6mm wide which means that a two humbucker guitar may have to have it mounted nearer the bridge and comprimising performance or have the pickup moved a little from the neck to fit it in. Thanks for the input and all the other guests and members who don't wish to be known. see ya psw

Yes, where typing on different days but at the same time...strange OK, as my update says, the selector mode will work but the trimmer vol/tone will need to be activated on the neck pickup's output when the device is turned on. This sounds simple enough so can it be done with the dpdt toggle I've got...if so, how so. As, the bridge and neck will need to be run to the circuit, then the circuit should be internally mounted. With SMD technology it should be really small anyway and I'm going to mock up one of these very soon, possibly with your preamp idea. It wouldn't need to be anywhere near as big as a walkman by the way. Oh and, the guitar's dynamics are changed but not compressed by infinite sustain, at least in my system. The strings will swell in volume, potentially to the limit of the strings capability to vibrate at that frequency. It will swell from nothing, just by touching a note on to a fret. I think that the system greatly expands the dynamic range of the instrument. It may even be able to be adjusted to exploit these dynamic and harmonic effects with the infinite sustainer capabilities so low as to be ineffective. cheers psw

Great stuff this upgrade. If you haven't found it yet the "outline" view selected from the first post of the page your looking at is effectively an index to the whole post. For those following threads like my Sustainer Ideas this is invaluable. Great Stuff Guys psw

If that last post wasn't enough....I've got an update! I just whent out and tried out the "sustain-odriv-a-mat-e-tron" device and can report, with recent oscillation control improvements...I CAN use the pickup selection in all modes (although some sound a little wierd especially the mid combinations, but they will work) however: To be usefull, in sustain mode the neck pickup's volume (total output volume on the guitar's knob) needs to be turned down to about 5 (half way) and the tone down (for taste...the induction mode sound is a little grainy) to about 3 or even 1. That implies that what is required is a trimmer vol/tone on the neck pickup when sustainer is turned on (as LK said earlier, I think?). By using the guitar's controls I'm turning down the whole output, which would also work but the combination would be more effective I think if the bridge wasn't being turned down at the same time. What do you thin LK and others and how do I arrange the on/off of the sustainer to achieve this? cheers psw ALSO : I see that the new look PG interface allows you to select an outline view. This is effectively an Index which I'm sure people will welcome on a post this long...three cheers to the PG team.