DGW

Thanks for the help guys.

I found out it is actually a lacquer finish, according to the manufacturer. I decided to go with the nail polish suggestion, and it looks like it'll work out. I built up a few layers and sanded flush with a small block, then added another few dribbles to the low spots. Should be good for a final leveling with 400 grit tonight, and then I'll hit it with the micro mesh and see if I can get it to blend.

Paul

Black really is the hardest color to "blend" but I've had my best luck using nail polish.

Especially for nitro finishes which is what most nail polish is made of.

I build up the ding with nail polish.

Level it off with a razor.

Wetsand and then use my buffing wheel to help blend it in.

Works really well for me.

VERY nice!

It has genuine character.

I wouldn't do a single thing.

The key is the light "dusting" of the finish before you go whole hog....there used to be a tutorial on this on the main site.

Sorry for the duplicate post.

You CAN shoot poly over the Sharpie with no problem ... I've done it.

You just need to shoot dust coats first to help "lock in" the ink.

Same technique you'd use on waterslide decals.

I've used these guys for restorations and some custom stuff.

Quality vinyl and reasonable prices.

http://www.best-decals.com/index.php?main_...products_id=937

Here's a sample of one of thier restoration decals that I used on one of my guitars.

The vinyl is thin enough that it can be cleared over quite nicely.

(btw ... they no longer offer the PRS signature logo)

I used to have a white guitar and used one of those "Axsack" guitar jackets.

When I removed the jacket years later, it looked almost identical to what you see there.

What had happened was the jacket protected the guitar's outer edges (and backside) while the top was exposed to alot of smokey clubs.

Looked pretty cool actually.

THANKS SO MUCH...BIG HELP

WHAT DO I DO WITH THE STAINS.... DO I SAND EM ALL OFF.. OR DO I JUST GIVE IT A KEY ?

I wouldn't be as concerned with the stain as I would the actual surface that you'll be painting over.

As long as you prep the surface properly, you should be good to go.

i have an sg but its stained, i would like to paint it black.. whats the best way to do this.. sand down the stain, paint and laquer..

whats the type of paint i should be using

what type of laquer should u buy

i can spray a car easly, just wondered if wood was any diffrent.. 2 paint wood id usealy cover in fibre glass resin sand and prime..

can i automotive paint a laquer

please help.. im usless

I'd suggest taking your time and doing a thorough job sanding off the existing finish, filling all dings, dents, etc.

Assuming your SG is a set-neck, tape off your fretboard and the edges of the neck where your binding and/or position markers are.

I use 3M FineLine tape for the edges of the neck ... it leaves nice crisp lines.

IMO, a good paintjob starts with good body prep ... so take your time and do a complete and thorough job.

If you can paint a car and have the proper facilities and experience with automotive paints and sprayguns, this is a big advantage.

I've been using automotive paint (2-part acrylic urethane) for several years and have had really good results.

Before spraying my first basecoat, I spray a 2-part epoxy primer/sealer made by Dupont.

This helps fill the grain and provides a primer for you basecoat.

Let it dry overnight and then go over it with 400 grit sandpaper.

This will knock off the "gloss" and provide a nice smooth primed surface for your basecoat.

At this point, I remove the tape on the edges of the neck, smooth out the edges of the primer/sealer, and then re-apply new tape.

This helps prevent the primer/sealer and paint from "caking" on the tape, which could potentially peel off the paint when removed.

Once you've re-applied your tape, go ahead and shoot your basecoat.

Once your basecoat is dry, remove the tape from the edges of the neck again and re-tape only the top surface of the fretboard.

This will help blend the binding and/or position markers when you apply your clearcoat.

For me, acrylic urethane (automotive paint) works best ...

It cures nice and hard which helps preserve your tone and resonance.

And it won't yellow or crack like nitro, or look "amaturish" and deteriorate like most rattlecan paintjobs.

Good luck!

WoW! That's a beautiful top!

The natural binding really sets it off.

Have you given any thought to maybe chambering it?

orange peel or not, it's still pretty. just maybe level sand and clear again and you might be ok.

+1

I like it.

Lumi is the name of the build ;-D

My apologies.

Given the tests i've done with Plasticote, I've found that given as much attention to the prep as humanly possible, not whaling the paint on and sanding between coats has produced a strong solid finish. It is easy however, to use rattlecans badly and produce a soft eternally-plastic finish. This is pretty thin compared to most solid colour instruments, so a good protective clear will finish the job nicely. Limited funds and limited space do not always go hand in hand with compromising standards, hence why the build has turned out well despite complications along the way. Everything has been thought out before I jumped in (other than the original blank being glued up....). My wife is the do-er. I'm the thinker.

You might think i've lowered my standards as I listed various points on what I have learnt from this build or what didn't turn out as well as I wanted. This was more down to me wanting to illustrate an honest build same as many builders on here do. Not every build can be perfect for most people. The other option would be to take photos which hide imperfection and tout the guitar as pro-level. I'm not interested in the kudos or repetetive "awesome build, dude" posts.

I think that given the right attitude and direction, having limited space (and recovering an existing POS blank!) and resources doesn't mean you can't achieve great results. That is paramount to the spirit of this board in my opinion.

Sorry if i'm soapboxing or you think i'm digging at you DGW. I'm not. I think that perhaps you don't click onto my building ethos, or have taken the thread at face value. Fair enough, I say!

I think that results speak for themselves, no matter what road was traversed to get to that point. At least it's not a lump of vaguely Explorer-ish looking sapele sat in my wood stash waiting for Godot.

There was another well known painter who wrote a book on how to paint guitars with spraypaint ...

He claimed to have used this particular paint for the last 20 years and "gauranteed" professional results.

I, like so many others, bought into it.

Long story short ... a recent "newsletter" from this same author warned others from using this same paint.

While there is no way for me to compare your "testing" to the said authors 20 years of experience, it is my opinion, based on my own experiences, that there are far better ways to finish a guitar ... even for those with limited space and a limited budget.

And while I understand it was not your intent to post such a thread for the purpose of hearing "awesome build dude" ... I did offer a sincere compliment. You did a great job on your build and you should know that myself and others acknowledge your talents. And please understand that the comment regarding your choice of paint was my opinion based on my own experiences with spraypaint. Nothing more, nothing less. Again, I have alot of experience with rattlecan paintjobs and know that you can acheive amazing results ... initially. The problem lies with these paints standing the test of time.

Maybe plasticote is different ... I don't know.

But I do know that I've been using sprayguns for the past 3-4 years now and there's absolutely no comarison in the quality and durability of the finished product.

But in the end ... if plasticote is good enough for you, than I guess that's all that really matters.

What type of paint are you using?

should consider that it is not your choice,not your guitar,and if the craftsmanship and finished product is as was intended,then maybe you should stop throwing insulting pontifications on how YOU "would have done it better..."

Amazing how you can twist my comments that were meant as a compliment into "insulting pontifications on how I could have done it better".

Lumi's own comments of having "limited funds and limited space" as his reasons for using plasticote were what lead me to believe he was "lowering his standards" or "compromising" if you will, so please do not pose your own interpretations.

You know what..I editted out all of what I had here because it does not matter..but honestly,Dino,you should check your attitude.

Wes, this is the second consecutive thread where you've appeared to be very confrontational with me.

If you have a problem with me, please try to be considerate and send me a PM or an email so we can discuss it without disturbing other members's threads.

Thanks.

I always laugh at "That guitar deserves better" replies...

The guitar deserves what the guitar gets,no more,no less.it WAS a piece of blank wood...now it is a guitar...

My comment was meant to be taken as a compliment, not a "dig".

And EVERY guitar begins as a piece of wood.

Thanks for pointing out the obvious.

That looks awesome!

But I really don't understand going through all the trouble af doing such a fantastic build, only to drop your standards in the end by using "Plasticote".

IMO, that guitar deserves much better.

I'd be worried about the FB backbowing. Also, I think clamping it would be difficult.

+1

I wouldn't mind checking out that dvd though.

Last week I try to make what I belived was an improvement on the finish of the guitars I build, so I switch from Nitro to Poly. I tried a test make it brushed but after several coats had to buffer it and the shine was lower than the actual raw material (by the way I`m in Costa Rica so a lot of the brands and products mentioned on some forums are not available here). Then I bought a little re-touch spray gun as working with guitars are very small areas, then after about 4 coats the poly showed some pinholes, I decided to let it rest and see what would happen. WRONG!! I checked the guitar 24hours later and it was full of blisters and bubbles; like the face of a pizza teenage guy. If anyone can help me on any advise on the technique it would be welcomed.

What nozzle size and psi's are you running?

Thanks for the input guys.

And again, I'm not comparing my fretwork to any sort of "PLEK" job.

I was just wondering if anyone else has gotten away with doing a fret job without having to level and crown all the frets.

Cool...well,bottom line is that to react as you did says to others that you consider yourself beyond reproach...it is not conducive to finding help,really.

consider that Wez's post was 90% helpful,only 10% "condescending"....maybe your reply should have only been 10% angry?

I'm sorry ... In all honesty, I didn't find Wez's post even 10% helpful.

Obviously you didn't either or you wouldn't have "respectfully disagreed" with it's content.

Seriously ... you made your point.

Let's please move on.

Thanks.

I prefer to think it is the prep work I do now combined with the patience and care I take to fret properly(for me)

Exactly ...

If you start out with a perfectly straight fretboard that's been properly radiused, and you cut the slots to the properly depth, the only way I can see it needing to be leveled is if the frets weren't radiused and/or seated properly.

It won't be comparable to a "Plek" job, but if done properly, I don't see where it would be a problem.

Another beginner's point of view. I found the same thing. I was very careful building my very first neck (I am on my third now), and much to my surprise, it played like dream. I now attribute this in part to the quality of the pre-slotted pre-radiused rosewood fingerboards I have been buying. That, plus I was very careful to clean the fret slots, and to hammer and glue the frets in (after bending them first) making sure they seated perfectly. After a normal setup (relief and bridge adjustment) it had a nice low action - better than most 'shop' guitars I pick up.

My second neck was also good - except that the very highest frets would "fret out" - which triggered a discussion here about adding fall off to the high frets. I am just about to add frets to my next neck, and hope/expect it to be similarly level. Meanwhile, I have fret levelled some older worn necks successfully, so if it doesn't come out perfect, I will have no problems running a levelling file over it to correct any problems.

Sounds like you also take alot of extra care in your preperations and it has paid off ... kudos.

I guess I should have added that I didn't "hammer" my frets ... I used a radiused press which may have helped in the installation.

I don't think I could have hammered them in and gotten them level like you did.

Again ... kudos.

I prefer to think it is the prep work I do now combined with the patience and care I take to fret properly(for me)

Exactly ...

If you start out with a perfectly straight fretboard that's been properly radiused, and you cut the slots to the properly depth, the only way I can see it needing to be leveled is if the frets weren't radiused and/or seated properly.

It won't be comparable to a "Plek" job, but if done properly, I don't see where it would be a problem.

Now...what Wezv was saying is that he does not understand how a guy experienced enough to attempt a refret on what he considers a nice guitar(I don't consider it so) could possibly not be able to tell if he needs a fret levelling...

I agree...If you performed a fretting in which you don't need to level,then surely YOU would be able to tell?

Again, I am experienced to know it did not necessarily "need" to be leveled.

I was simply fishing for maybe other advantages in doing so that I may have overlooked.

I do have experience, but I don't do this for a living like alot of you guys.

I almost did not respond due to the original poster's over-reaction to what I consider a fine and HONEST post by Wezv..

I apologize for what what you consider "over-reacting", but WezV's comment would lead me to believe he thinks that if I have to ask the question, then I have no business attempting to refret a vintage instrument.

QUOTE by WezV:

"i have to question what you doing attempting this job on a 60's epiphone if you have to ask this question."

If it was not meant to be condescending, than I apologize.

But it certainly sounded that way to me.

And even if I didn't know what I was doing, those sort of comments really wouldn't be too encouraging.

Isn't that what this site's all about? Helping others?

If those with a little more experience can be so kind as to offer thier advice in a less condescending manner, I'm sure it would be greatly appreciated by those with less experience.

Having said that ...

The reason I asked this question was because the fretjob I did on this guitar didn't appear to need leveling.

I began by taking all the relief out of the neck until it was perfectly straight.

After removing all the frets, I sanding the fretboard using the proper radius sanding block.

There are no variances in the fretwire itself, and the only way I can see having to go through the trouble of leveling and crowning the frets were if I didn't seat them properly.

The frets were radiused prior to glueing them in and they were all seated nice and tight to the fretboard.

When I was done, I checked everything with a straight edge and couldn't find one area of the fretjob that was uneven.

My initial thought was that "leveling" them at this point would only be creating more work for myself.

I simply wanted to post this to see if anyone could offer me any other advantages that "leveling" may offer that I may have overlooked. I just wasn't expecting a response that would try to make me look like some sort of piss ant.

i have to question what you doing attempting this job on a 60's epiphone if you have to ask this question.

After you have installed the frets they will need levelling 99% of the time... unless you happen to be so skilled as to install them with such even pressure that they dont.. which some people can. Personally i always give them a level anyway just to be sure

The real question is do they need levelling? only you can answer that... and i reckon when you are working on a guitar with any value you should know how to answer that

Thanks for your condescending response.

If I had no "skills", the question of not having to level wouldn't have even entered my mind ... I just would have done it.

WoW! You sure have a superiority complex.

I'm replacing worn out frets on an old 60's era Epiphone.

I straightened out the neck, pulled all the frets, used a radius sanding block on the fretboard, and replaced all the frets using the proper radius.

All the frets are seated nice and tight.

I have no gaps, no lifts, nothing ... everything looks perfectly level.

Do I still need to level and crown the frets?