First Build - 6 String Bass

[dsdesigns]

Hello all,

I have probably spent 50 hours reading this forum, and have purchased Hiscock's book for the second time, since I lost it in the move from new york to north carolina. I have been playing guitar/bass for nine years and have been wanting to build for most of that time. I want to build a neck-through 6 string bass. i have a full-scale drawing/picture with just about all dimensions except for the knobs and cavities, not sure how to post it though.

specs as follows:

34" scale, 22 frets

Body wings:

3/4" curly maple/ 1/4" walnut veneer/ 3/4" curly maple

Neck:

7 piece curly maple/purple heart/ CM/PH/CM/PH/CM

I would like to use purple heart for the fretboard, but im not sold

I do not know what size or material for frets, i also do not know what neck angle

I have no idea what type of nut to chose

I am unsure whether to use two truss rods, or use one with two CF pieces.

I would appreciate feedback on a possible neck radius and i will most likely make it assemmetrical

Electronics/hardware:

2 EMG-HZ Bass Pickups (stew mac), although im open to others as my playing styles differ greatly and im not particular

hotshot bridge

I have not chosen machine heads, but i want the head to be 1/2" thick so whatever is compatible

Head:

Angled 12 degrees, im not sure if i will put a veneer on the head

Finish:

I like Truoil or shellac with a coat of nitro, i like the curly maple as is, maybe a touch darker. i will have to learn more about their application when it comes time

I was originally thinking to first glue (titebond I) the neck pieces together with the pick-up wire channel routed and then glue the uncut laminated body wings to the body. From recent research im thinking i should cut the wings out before i glue them to the neck core. Is this preference or an issue of practical building. Right now i have 2 50"x8"x1" curly maple planks kiln dried to 6-8% and 1 70"x5"x1" purple heart equally dried. I love the look of these woods together. The neck will have 3 1/8" purpleheart stripes surrounded by 1" maple which will be grain reversed. I have been debating as to whether i should put veneers of walnut on the sides of the neck for appearance sake. I have a dremel xpr400 and i am acquiring many of the hand tools listed in Hiscock's book. I am not comfortable in planing yet so any important cuts will probably be done at a local mill, at least for the first guitar. I have also purchased plenty of beautiful poplar that i will practice every stage on. So i may get more comfortable and come out of this with to basses, we'll see.

Let me know of anything I may be missing and possible next steps.

Thank you for all your help, I feel that we are almost brothers since taking these many hours getting to know you all.

Dave

[Dean]

I would glue the wings on before cuting....a flat surfice is easyer to clamp on,but I have yet to do a neck thru ,so wait on a little more advice on this one.

[Xanthus]

I would glue the wings on before cuting....a flat surfice is easyer to clamp on,but I have yet to do a neck thru ,so wait on a little more advice on this one.

Ayup, definitely agree with this. I'm trying to wrestle my head around gluing the bottom wing onto my flying V right now. Yeah, trying to glue a triangle to another triangle. I'll form some king of Rube Goldberg contraption with dowels and block wedges, I'm sure, but definitely glue the wings on before cutting. It'll help a LOT..

It's also easiest to make an instrument with no neck angle, in my experience, and also because I think playing a non-angled guitar feels better. I would do a side diagram with the height of the proposed fretboard and the height of the proposed bridge and see if you'd have enough play in the saddles to get a good setup. If not, then raising the fretboard or recessing the bridge is doable, preferably the former rather than the latter.

Depending on how you cut your headstock/scarf joint, you might want to consider putting a veneer on to hide the glue line and make it look classier

Truss rods and CF strips are both easy to install, CF moreso. I don't see any problems with one truss rod and some CF, though I'm sure opinions are divided over this one.

Carving the back of the neck is entirely subjective, but remember you can always take material away, not the other way around

HZ pickups are pretty nice for a bass. I'd also look into the traditional Seymours or Dimarzio's, and decide whether or not you want an active preamp. Other brands are MEC and Bartolini.

Good luck, I'm going to bed! 3am here. I'll check back after work tomorrow. The more questions before starting construction, the better!

[low end fuzz]

this is all about preference; which you dont have if you havent tried multiple things;

first off, critisisms

6 string bass-unless you are doing 2 higher strings you need a longer scale

1/2" headstock seems a lil shy for me unless this is the thickness before a headplate (front/back)

glueing- it may be (it is) easier to glue wood that is flat, clamps sit like they should and its easy to keep everything lined up;

but now what are ou stuck with? 3 rectangles that weigh 30lbs and some pretty hands on carving with things in your way; plus try carrying that around a shop and pushing it thru tools; and you still might have problems with levelness;

what i would do (2 piece i like) have your neck piece and wings seperate, mark all your joins with your template, so your looking at it together then like a jigsaw puzzle when theyre apart; keep any of the joints planed and untouched;

do your headstock, add your fretboard, carve the neck; stay away from your joining marks by about 2 "

then cut out your wings and do as much crving on them as possible; you can be a little more sloppy with the glue side on these because they can go thru the jointer w/o screwing up too much in the process;

then gluing; this is why you keep your scraps from the wings; stick them back in against you wings and you have a somewhat 'perfect' clamping caul;then after you glue has set for some days you start smoothing the trasition;

at the very least you should do all the inner parts of the horns b4 glue but whatever;

neck angle- i would have one, especially on a bass; you have to know this exact angle before you start anything, cause once the first gluing happens after the initial blanks are made its tooo late;

and also have fun; its probably not gonna turn out the way you want; but the next one will (at least a little closer)

watch out for suggestions that are telling you abou t a bunch of fancy aesthetics for your build; push these aside, and really learn how to make this thing, or your gonna be over your head with extra (uneeded) time and money dumped into the learning cuvre; and a multi lam neck of hard rock and ph isnt gonna need cf rods. but thats preference;

but too stiff is just as bad as spaggetti neck

[dsdesigns]

i suppose i could do a 35" scale, but i ave seen quite a few six strings with 34. I always figured it was more of a novelty issue. I look further into this. Is it ok to cut the head out of the same neck plank, meaning all one piece? and just cut the angle into it? I dont think i will put active electronics on this bass possibly the next one. Are there any other pitfalls i can look for because its a neckthrough 6 string. I can thicken the headstock and i am too cautious to my detriment. I love to plan but hate to cut! Like i said i will be practicing all of this on the poplar, but i am sure its different to work with than maple and purpleheart. I would like to use a 2 degree neck angle. i have to run to work. ill try to get a picture too

[low end fuzz]

who the hell works on saturdays?

id go with 35" because it stretches the thicker string over a longer area making less flappy with better 'tone'

i personnally like cutting the angle into the wood; i think it looks cool;

but the flip side is the 'short grain' argument; whereas the wood (this is hard w/o pics) involved in the angle has very short grain lenght whereas a scarf joint is long grain thru the entire headstock (its even harder to write out)

i have found all the technical aspects and $$$ pointing towards a scarf joint w/ a heel block but havent had any physical differences between the two myself

[dsdesigns]

I like the 35" scale. also i will cut the angle into the head. In regards to prepping the neck core and body wings, should i thickness them separately and then glue or glue and do it altogether? I am also thinking that i would like to add some walnut veneer between the neck core and body wings. What would be customary, glue the veneer to the neck,body, or altogether at one time? Also to double-check, i am going to cut the 2 degree neck angle by raising the body and flipping it on a planer, all before gluing to the body. Hopefully that sounds about right. At the same time could i cut the angle in the head or should i wait to that. Also this neck core blank will be two inches thick, so about what time would i want to thickness the neck out of that.

thanks guys

Dave

[low end fuzz]

for the veneer, your best bet is to prolly throw it inbetween when you glue everyting;

i would say thickness everything prior to glueing, but your still gonna have to level everything after the fact; remember you need to have a real flat suface for your bridge;

i dont know what you mean when you start getting into the angles of the neck and body; but id prefer an angle of 10-12 deg. or making the head drop down so the strings are at a strong angle

[dsdesigns]

I will cut the neck to 2 degrees and the head to 10 degrees, should i do both these angles before gluing the body? would you say to carve, or round, some of the horns before gluing the body? i suppose that would be more difficult when its all glued. how do you usually apply the glue? I was thinking of using a plastic putty knife, will that spread it thick enough? would you attach the walnut veneers to the outside of the neckcore or the gluing side of the body wings?

Thanks,

Dave

[low end fuzz]

ah i see,

1 thing; are these just angles you think are gonna do it (2 degrees) or have you determined this thru the height of the bridge in compaarison to the height/length of the neck?

as for the glue, im sure if you own one wood working book theyll show you a starved joint and too much glue; i put a whap of glue on my stuff and rub the 2 peices to and fro to spread it even and push it thru the wood fibre; its a little hokey but works; or a simple paint brush 1"

when you do veneers there is some things to keep in mind; 1 actually, dont put glue on the veneer; and it dont matter that your brothers friends uncle chuck did it and it worked fine, its not proper;

spread the glue on the neck and on the wing, and right before you clamp it throw your veneer in; if its possible have extra sticking out everywhere, this is because lining up veneers is tedious; there are ways just be creative.

when i built one (i call it joe lado style) all of our neck pieces were roughly profiled with the angles prior to laminating the neck;

now tho i would start w/ a perfect block and cut my angles prior to the fb (this is my o.o.o.(order of operation))after the lams are all together;

so recap; square (kinda rectangular) blank; cut neck angle, plane smooth, slot rod, add rod, glue fb ,cut out neck profile incl. head angle; trimming etc to fb, ruff shape neck (keeping back from ''no go glue area'')

shape both wings and any other routing you feel like doing now; glue on wings, smooth transition , final routing, mock up assembly; tweak errors (theyre there) final sand, finish.

this is my o.o.o. i wrote it out so your not getting misleading info compared to another method of building; thres alot of ways to go about it, but i find switching paths even if it sounds reasonable is tramatic to the build, but youve planned alot, so i dont see you switching gears every few weeks;

good luck

[dsdesigns]

As far as the angles go, they are not precise with the dimensions of the bridge that i have chosen(stew macs hipshot) i havent done the numbers for that. So before i continue with any solidified angles, i will start with the bridge height. i do not have the bridge yet so i know i can not do any cutting, so these are optimistic estimates. I also have not done a side view to scale. My next step is to glue the neck core together after i have my planks cut to size and likewise with the body wings. I am just trying to get everything in place before i any gluing, or at least as much as i can. Are there any problems with gluing these prior to actually having the pick-ups and bridge in hand? As previously stated, I am probably too cautious, but i want this thing to be as perfect as i can possibly have for a first build. I already have plans and numbers for two electrics guitars id like to build. Im not going to lie, I will probably not make a cut unless more than myself agrees, and i do practice cuts until im comfortable. How comfortable were you when you started? I ask this because i feel i have more than enough knowledge in the working of the instruments and the relation of parts, but its probably because i havent done enough practicing. At some point i will just have to do it.

Thanks fuzz

Dave

[orgmorg]

About the angles- Check this thread out, if you haven't already:

http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=14036

Based on what you have said, you may find you do not need a neck angle at all.

Also, if your neck blank is only 2" thick, you may not have enough material for much of a headstock angle.

A 13 deg headstock on a guitar requires 2 1/4" of stock for a 7" long headstock, and your head will probably be a bit longer, being a 6 string bass. Draw it out on paper. You may get away with it, but you will probably need to reduce the headstock angle a bit. If you decide for some reason you need some neck angle, you will need to cut the angle out of the body end. ( This is neck-thru, right? ) in order to have enough height left at the headstock for any kind of angle there.

Sounds like a fun project, and you are doing well to work out these details beforehand.

[dsdesigns]

I hate to be the guy that resurrects an old thread but I have progressed with the build, albeit several years later. I really began working on this about two months ago. I found the neck under my bed and thought, oh yea, I was going to build a bass. Aftee purchasing many tools and all hardware, I began.

[dsdesigns]

_{So, uploading pictures is taking a while so I will give some specs that ive went with:}

_{The style I was going for is a mix between Tobias and Warrior}

_{35'' scale, 6 string bass, curly maple purple heart 5 piece neck with a 16'' radiused purpleheart fretboard, walnut body with maple top and back, purpleheart/walnut/purpleheart separating wings from neck. I decided to include this due to not tapering the lams when I build the neck four years ago. Its one of many mistakes that I have grown to enjoy fixing and think it has turned out better than planned. I inlayed several side markers onto the front of the fretboard in an S pattern...I dont like standard dots on the front and actually wish I would have left it plain....oh well. The rod is body fed so i built a cover from the excess neck blank to match. Gotoh tuners, carvin bridge (16mm spacing), pickups and module, stewmacs dual rod. Ive run the jack into the recess in the bottom of the body so it is hidden...I will be finishing with oil and wax the way Wes has described. A couple of issues I ran into....carving the neck a little thin, router mishap which dictated where I placed the battery, also, do use the right sized bits. I did not plan drilling the headstock too well and started to route the center of the holes as a guide for the drill but it slipped and has left me making a new veneer for the headstock. Purpleheart is kind of frustrating to hand sand. I do have a few questions.......}

_{What grade would you sand the fretboard too? I have it at 320 and do plan on giving it at least one coat of oil. I had heard if you sand too fine, it may not take oil so well.}

_{Do I need to ground the bridge? They are active electronics....I am covering the cavities with copper.}

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

I have got to fix the headstock before final sanding and test fitting

[dsdesigns]

[dsdesigns]

it was an amazing eveing of jacking the headstock up....it started with one small mistake then i tried 'fixing' it. seeral more mistakes later i get to make a veneer.

[dsdesigns]

I set the cap into the headstock in a 1/16'' knife-carved recess. It rests about a 1/16'' proud of the rest of the headstock. I am happy with the way it came out, kinda a 3 dimensional look. I will insert two abalone dots in the glue/sawdust holes. I will trim the holes to create a recess for the tuners as i did with a portion of the A string peghole.