TeiscosRock Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 If i use Colortone (StewMac) black grain filler on an ash body, would I apply it before or after staining? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 Test on scrap. I'd probably stain, then seal, then fill, so I could sand the filler level without worrying about sanding through the stain coats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikhailgtrski Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 I've been testing this stuff on mahogany. StewMac also says to stain first, apply washcoat of sealer, grain fill then sand. So far I haven't figured out how to sand the filler last without sanding through into the underlying stained wood. Seems like grain filling first w/ dyed filler, then sanding, then staining and washcoating is the safest. Maybe mattia can shed some more light on his method? We've discussed this before with varying opinions offered. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 I've been testing this stuff on mahogany. StewMac also says to stain first, apply washcoat of sealer, grain fill then sand. So far I haven't figured out how to sand the filler last without sanding through into the underlying stained wood. Seems like grain filling first w/ dyed filler, then sanding, then staining and washcoating is the safest. Maybe mattia can shed some more light on his method? We've discussed this before with varying opinions offered. Mike ← Well, mostly, you do it carefully. Practice. And put a decent seal coat on there. I know, not terribly helpful, but there you have it. Grain filling then staining may not work perfectly (grain filler interfering with stain penetration, and what if you need to sand that back? You risk 'opening' more pores if you sand down too far) but may work well enough. Test various methods on scrap, see what works best for you. You often need several applications of grain filler to deal with very open-grained woods. I have to admit to having minimal experience in this arena; the staining I've done has tended to be on maple tops only (no filling needed), and most of the time the other woods stay natural, or get tinted topcoats shot over them, which kind of dodges the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikhailgtrski Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 Yeah, the bare mahogany takes about 3-4 applications to fill the grain. I figure if I sand it until it's just filling the pores, then the stain should go on evenly. The pores are already "dyed" with the filler. I didn't experiment with the sealcoat, though. Perhaps that would make for less filling, and less sanding. Though I wonder if you don't have the same problem with a clear filler. The dyed filler over the top of stain looks blotchy if you don't sand it completely. Then you end up sanding into the stain, compounding the blotchiness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlrhett Posted January 13, 2006 Report Share Posted January 13, 2006 If i use Colortone (StewMac) black grain filler on an ash body, would I apply it before or after staining? ← I have grain filled with black Colortone on ash, sanded back (a major pain in the a*$. Unless you want the ash to be splotched grey, you really need to go all the way back to the bare wood) then applied a deep cherry red/mahogany stain, then a dyed red transparent and finally unspeakably many clear coats. The result was an even dye with a very beautiful and noticeable grain. I get a lot of compliments. I am just a weekend warrior, and I don't presume to know half of what mittia and others know. Their websites show AMAZING guitars. But I'm pleased with the process. I suppose the moral of the story is that you can successfully do it either way. It depends more on your care and execution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeiscosRock Posted January 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2006 Hmm.. I may end up going w/ alder on this one, instead of the ash i had planned on before. Then again i COULD just dive right on into this whole thing couldn't i? . I'll use ash and test on some scrap, see wha's what. Thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikhailgtrski Posted January 23, 2006 Report Share Posted January 23, 2006 Another trial-and-error lesson learned this weekend... The Colortone filler wants to be sanded back after each coat! I made the mistake of building up several coats thinking that would fill the grain, and then I could just sand it back and be ready for dye. All I did was make more work for myself sanding stubborn areas (i.e. the cutaways) where it was difficult to squeegee off the excess filler. After all that sanding work, it needs some more filler. But the Seahawks are going to the Superbowl, so all is good! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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