davee5 Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 (edited) Hi all, I've been lurking around here for a long while, picking up tips while I plan out my first luthiery project. Now the SolidWorks model is pretty close to done, the bulk woods are in house, and it's time to laser cut the template for routing this baby. Before I let this one loose, I'd love to get design feedback or have anyone spot potential issues. Current concerns are the placement of knobs so close to the edge of the guitar and if the throuhg-body ferrules will apply pressure properly across all the strings since I've arranged them in a parabola. I also think the upper horn and the F-holes might be a little large, bu tthe figure of the koa top-plate I've got in the horn region is killer and I'd hate to cut if off! Here are the specs: -Flat-top w/ heavily flamed Koa plate. -Chambered mahogany body (nice, broad flamey figure on that too!). -Mahogany neck -Ebony fingerboard and headstock veneer. -Curly maple binding around body, neck, headstock, and f-holes. -Black MOP markers (planning on imitating Myka's silver outline concept and using it on both side dots and fretboard dots). -Gold hardware. -Handwound (by me!) humbuckers. -Ghost tuneomatic-style bridge w/ preamp and 3-way switch for mag, mag +piezo, or piezo selection. -Knobs for: mag volume, mag blend, neck tone, bridge tone, piezo volume. -Knobs will be ebony with inlaid black MOP marker. What do you think? Any comments or thoughts? I'm excited to give this a go, but a bit nervous as I'm a sort of idealist (not exactly a perfectionsit, but dangerously close). -Dave http://web.mac.com/davee5/iWeb/Evans_Guita...low_closeup.jpg Edited July 21, 2006 by Maiden69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 I like pretty much everything about the design, but the horns look a little too large to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Hi all, I've been lurking around here for a long while, picking up tips while I plan out my first luthiery project. Now the SolidWorks model is pretty close to done, the bulk woods are in house, and it's time to laser cut the template for routing this baby. Before I let this one loose, I'd love to get design feedback or have anyone spot potential issues. Current concerns are the placement of knobs so close to the edge of the guitar and if the throuhg-body ferrules will apply pressure properly across all the strings since I've arranged them in a parabola. I also think the upper horn and the F-holes might be a little large, bu tthe figure of the koa top-plate I've got in the horn region is killer and I'd hate to cut if off! Here are the specs: -Flat-top w/ heavily flamed Koa plate. -Chambered mahogany body (nice, broad flamey figure on that too!). -Mahogany neck -Ebony fingerboard and headstock veneer. -Curly maple binding around body, neck, headstock, and f-holes. -Black MOP markers (planning on imitating Myka's silver outline concept and using it on both side dots and fretboard dots). -Gold hardware. -Handwound (by me!) humbuckers. -Ghost tuneomatic-style bridge w/ preamp and 3-way switch for mag, mag +piezo, or piezo selection. -Knobs for: mag volume, mag blend, neck tone, bridge tone, piezo volume. -Knobs will be ebony with inlaid black MOP marker. What do you think? Any comments or thoughts? I'm excited to give this a go, but a bit nervous as I'm a sort of idealist (not exactly a perfectionsit, but dangerously close). -Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davee5 Posted July 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Ben, Thanks for the feedback, I've been waffling over making the horns smaller and thinning out the f-holes. The holes used to be even longer, so I'm slowly scaling it back to a reasonable size. The whole thing is about an inch wider than a strat and both horns about an inch and a half (upper) to an inch (lower) longer. The width in the upper horns is clearly much larger than a strat. I'm going to play around with those dimensions tonight and see if I can come up with an alternate I like better, even at the expense of a few square inches of koa flame! Rich, I have modeled the body quite accurately in 3D, including the internals, though I haven't bought the pots yet so they aren't represented in there (maybe I should do that just to cross all my t's and dot the i's). I haven't bound anything before, though frankly the routing scares me more than the bending. I have the patience to work carefully with the bends and miters, but I figure routing gouges are harder to deal with. As for the TOM model, it's not real accurate, mostly there to get a feel for aesthetics. The placement is correct and I will be using and adjustable model it to nail the intonation. I have a TOM sitting around I should model up more accurately to check the string angle, that's a great idea I definitely should have thought of before. Jack placement will be just a little further up from the last knob. The neck will be a bolt on and parallel to the body, so the TOM and pickup height adjustments will certainly be relied upon. Anything else you could think of? Please feel free to nitpick, I'm all about feedback. -Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Ben, Thanks for the feedback, I've been waffling over making the horns smaller and thinning out the f-holes. The holes used to be even longer, so I'm slowly scaling it back to a reasonable size. The whole thing is about an inch wider than a strat and both horns about an inch and a half (upper) to an inch (lower) longer. The width in the upper horns is clearly much larger than a strat. I'm going to play around with those dimensions tonight and see if I can come up with an alternate I like better, even at the expense of a few square inches of koa flame! Rich, I have modeled the body quite accurately in 3D, including the internals, though I haven't bought the pots yet so they aren't represented in there (maybe I should do that just to cross all my t's and dot the i's). I haven't bound anything before, though frankly the routing scares me more than the bending. I have the patience to work carefully with the bends and miters, but I figure routing gouges are harder to deal with. As for the TOM model, it's not real accurate, mostly there to get a feel for aesthetics. The placement is correct and I will be using and adjustable model it to nail the intonation. I have a TOM sitting around I should model up more accurately to check the string angle, that's a great idea I definitely should have thought of before. Jack placement will be just a little further up from the last knob. The neck will be a bolt on and parallel to the body, so the TOM and pickup height adjustments will certainly be relied upon. Anything else you could think of? Please feel free to nitpick, I'm all about feedback. -Dave Dave, Your drawing looks great (I work with CAD and Building Systems daily so I can appreciate your work). You will do fine with the binding. You should bend some Maple though to get a feel for how it bends and how thick you dare use to make some of those tight bends. I suggested you practice before you try to install because you may want to use multiple thinner pieces in a lay up or thinner binding and maybe purfling. You will see what I mean when you start bending the tips of those horns. As far as routing for the binding. Get a good cutter and the correct bearings. Take your time and be careful around the outer part of the horns and bouts (thin grain is prone to tear out). You can also moke two passes taking less wood with each pass if you want and extra margin of safety. As far as the neck angle and bridge.If you are running a flat neck angle. Do you plan to raise the neck, or increase fretboard thickness, or recess the bridge? If you recess the bridge you should really look at your string break angle over the bridge and string travel to the ferrules. There are several ways to get the string height to work, but you really should look close so you don't miss anything. That's all I got . It is great to see really sharp planning. Your project will be much better for your efforts . Great Deal! Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAI6 Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 I think the lower horn is OK. Maybe a little shorter, or just drop down the tip a little. Right now the lower horn feels like it's "pushed in" towards the neck... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mammoth guitars Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Dave, I think the overall shape is fine. The neck is set a bit far into the body if you want access to the upper frets. Reminds me of the new Micheal Kelly Valor which has nearly impossible upper fret access. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Heres a paint rendition of what I would do: Basically just made the body a little smaller, moved the neck further to the right (as mammoth guitars suggested), and shrunk the top horn a little. $0.02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Ha, here I am sitting with a blank piece of paper in front of me, getting ready to sketch out some f-hole ideas...and your post comes up...mind if I steal your holes? (no, no, just kidding, I'll probably go with cat's eyes). I like the way the holes work with the curves of the body design. The size of the holes seems pretty well proportioned to me. I like Ben's iteration, personally, although I'd take the upper horn back just a bit more --think LP double-cut assymetry. But you left out some important info: How many frets will the guitar have? And will it be a set neck or a bolt on? Both will have an influence on the neck joint area. To me, pushing that neck humbucker so far into the middle looks a little weird. I love the Harmony Rocket vibe of the knob placement --if the Rocket can get away with that (it's a hollowbody), then you shouldn't have any problems. Maybe go with mini pots if you're worried. You, uh, forgot the pickguard, you know. Oh yeah, I don't like the ferrules idea-- I think it'd be classier with an archtop-style tailpiece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davee5 Posted July 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 20, 2006 (edited) Thanks for the feedback, all, I think you reinforced my thoughts about the body being a bit large. I just hate to cut off this wood, but in the end if the guitar looks funny the extra flame won't help it too much. I'm still going to keep the horns a bit larger than a strat or a PRS, but I reigned it in a bunch. You guys are great. So I made some tweaks to the model to shrink the horns a bit, though I need to rebuild it eventually as a continuous-curvature spline to get that real nice, water flowing look. The reason the neck looked like it was "pushed too far into the body" was not because the neck was too deep, but because the body was real long. I'm also considering keepin ght eoverall body size but moving the scale further up the guitar, putting the neck so it joins at a higher fret and pulling the pups and bridge further towards the middle of the body. Rich - It's to be a bolt-on neck, Fender 25.5 scale and everything is drawn in it's right place, with the neck pup right where where the 1st strat pickup would be (I want to get a similar sound if I split the coils, which I plan on doing using push/pull pots on the tone knobs). The fingerboard will be elevated above the body sufficiently to avoid needing to add any neck angle, though I will certianly do the numbers to make sure the break angle from the strings over the tom is sufficent to apply the right amount of pressure. As for the suggestion about using a hollow-body style tailpiece I think it woiuld look good from the front in this CAD generated view, but pretty silly in real life to with the flattop (I'd carve it if the koa wasn't only ~3/16" thick). I figure the ferrules will give a similar visual layout for the strings without breaking up the overall profile as much. Mick - Never seen the Harmony before, an interesting reference piece.The overall design is supposed to be sort of a fence-straddling, has it's own sound, redheaded love child of an ES-335 and a Strat. No pickguard or tailpiece, but with humbuckers, stylized f-holes, and some hollowness. We'll see how it comes out eventually. As far as the f-holes go, you're welcome to plagiarize anything. I'm not in the business of making guitars, so I'm not going to be particularly protective of my design. In fact if anyone wants a digital copy of the model, they're welcome to PM me and I'll ship off a DXF or even a solid model. Here's the latest iteration: http://web.mac.com/davee5/iWeb/Evans_Guita...all_fholes2.jpg Edited July 21, 2006 by Maiden69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott French Posted July 21, 2006 Report Share Posted July 21, 2006 I say... bring in the waist (pinch?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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