matttheguy Posted January 14, 2007 Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 I'm thinking about building an acoustic guitar now that I've finished my first electric and I've decided to first start out with a kit, since it actually seems relatively simple. Now, I'm going to go with a kit with Mahogany backs and sides, as generally the Rosewood kits cost much more, and as a first attempt I don't want to go all out. I wanted to know if you folks think I should buy the kit from Stewmac , which is 365 and clear that it comes with no tuners and clear that I'm getting a dovetail neck, or should I go with the kit from Martin that isn't clear on the neck construction or the inclusion of tuners, but is 350 and is made by Martin? Which is the smarter way to go. It's only a 15 dollar difference, so I'm really not concerned about the price. Which kit would YOU, Mr/Mrs Acoustic builder, buy if you were looking for a quick build for yourself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted January 14, 2007 Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 I'm thinking about building an acoustic guitar now that I've finished my first electric and I've decided to first start out with a kit, since it actually seems relatively simple. Now, I'm going to go with a kit with Mahogany backs and sides, as generally the Rosewood kits cost much more, and as a first attempt I don't want to go all out. I wanted to know if you folks think I should buy the kit from Stewmac , which is 365 and clear that it comes with no tuners and clear that I'm getting a dovetail neck, or should I go with the kit from Martin that isn't clear on the neck construction or the inclusion of tuners, but is 350 and is made by Martin? Which is the smarter way to go. It's only a 15 dollar difference, so I'm really not concerned about the price. Which kit would YOU, Mr/Mrs Acoustic builder, buy if you were looking for a quick build for yourself? Just as extra options... John Hall offers kits and can be very helpful-click LMI is also a great place to look. They offer plenty of options also-click I can't make a specific recomendation as I never used a kit. There are several tools and jigs that are pretty good ideas. Most of which can be made by yourself. The jigs are what really make your acoustics go better and with better accuracy. A kit will allow you to avoid bending, most of your neck building. That will help you focus on assembling the box. After you get your kit and have read through instructions(video/book or ??). Post up again and maybe we can add some jig,methods and what have ya. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verhoevenc Posted January 14, 2007 Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 Hung out with John Hall yesterday actually. Great guy, much recommended! Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 Well, I think I'm going to give Stewmac's kit a try, as they've always been good to me, and I know what I'm getting with it. I'll let you all know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted January 15, 2007 Report Share Posted January 15, 2007 FYI: if you like the tone of Indian Rosewood better, build with that. I can't think of many easier woods to bend... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 15, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2007 Well, the sides are already pre bent, so that's no worry with me on this build. Next build I'll go for woods that I think sound / look better, this one's just to set a benchmark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 20, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 Well, I had ordered it, and I don't live too far from Athens and packages usually get here pretty fast, but when it starts looking like this outside within 2 hours: ... and doesn't stop coming down, it takes our postal service a bit longer. It stopped snowing for about an hour here, but Lake Erie just keeps producing more and more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2007 Now starts the fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted January 22, 2007 Report Share Posted January 22, 2007 This should be interesting. Could you take a few extra pics of the sides, braces, and what not. People ask about these kits all the time, but I have never looked really close at the individual pieces as they come shipped. Also, could you give some info on some of the specs. Such as radius of the top and back, maybe take a caliper to the top, back and sides(curious about thickness). Looks like a lot of good parts. I am sure it will be a fun build. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desopolis Posted January 23, 2007 Report Share Posted January 23, 2007 is the neck pre shaped? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2007 Yes, the neck is pre-shaped. I'll get some more photos up soon, Rich. Some things came up and I can't start this right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 24, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Those are both the back and the top braces that came with this. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/mat...-23-07Sides.jpgThere are the sides. Question, will those 'burn' marks come out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erikbojerik Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 (edited) double post madness... Edited January 25, 2007 by erikbojerik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erikbojerik Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 Yeah, they'll sand out no problem. They're actually moisture stains from the steam bending. I've actually scorched walnut so that its almost black, a thin layer that sands right off with 220. Best to avoid it tho, when you go to bend your own. Gack! That photo through the screen gives me a headache! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 Yep, The sides should clean right up. What is the thickness of the sides? Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 (edited) Rich, being without a caliper and a micrometer limits my measuring abilities. I use to have an old manual micrometer sitting around that I swore by, but it has since come up missing. Looks like I'll have to dig into the pockets again to start getting some accurate readouts. Just from measuring it with a ruler I'd say it's between 1/16 and 3/32 of an inch thick. Edited January 28, 2007 by matttheguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 31, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Okay guys, quick question on the x braces. Simply put, I messed them up. About half of the each brace was scalloped and the other half was full height. They were supposed to cross at a point where they were both full height, but I misread the blueprints and crossed them where they were scalloped, like this: Did I just ruin the guitar? Another view can be seen here. Other than that, things are going good. Most back braces are on, sides are glued up and kerfing is all good. Pictures can be seen here. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Okay guys, quick question on the x braces. Simply put, I messed them up. About half of the each brace was scalloped and the other half was full height. They were supposed to cross at a point where they were both full height, but I misread the blueprints and crossed them where they were scalloped, like this: Did I just ruin the guitar? Another view can be seen here. Other than that, things are going good. Most back braces are on, sides are glued up and kerfing is all good. Pictures can be seen here. Thanks. You have got an issue there. Everything from the waist up is about strength. The main x braces need to be strongest from the bridge up. Can you remove the braces from the soundboard(I am assuming this is not going to be easy). You may want to grab a new soundboard and whip up a new set of braces. It is possible to remove braces with a chisel and drum sander, but the radius makes it tricky. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted January 31, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Right now with the equipment and the expertise I have, the only option is to buy new braces, a new soundboard, and a new rosette, unless you think that the braces could be strong enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanb Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 IMO, you don't need a new soundboard at all. A sharp chisel, some sandpaper, and a little care will make those braces nothing more than a bad memory. New brace wood is cheap, as are a chisel and sandpaper at the local hardware (which you need anyway). Consider it good skill practice for your next build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Is it honestly that catastrophic towards the setup of the guitar? I'm sure with some work I could get these off, yes, but is it truly necessary, is the soundboard going to sustain massive damage because of this, or the guitar sound horrible? I'm just weighing my options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 (edited) If you can tell me what the dimensions of the braces are at the x (width and height), and the thickness of the top(I am assuming it is .110" +/- .010. I could give you a more confident answer. Like I said before. The bracing is intentionally stronger above the waist. This is because this area is being forced to collapse, and the area below the waste is the area that you can play with a bit more. I am sure pre-carved braces are a bit heavy, but without dimensions I can't give you a good recommendation. As far as removing braces with a chisel and sandpaper. That will not only be time consuming, but there is a good chance you will thin the top sanding away the titebond(I am assuming you didn't use HHG). Believe me it is easy to have something like this happen. I actually glued all my back braces on the wrong side once(now I felt pretty good about that as the back was not replacable ). I started to chisel them away, but stopped and ran it through my drum sander slowely bringing them down and it actually worked(I got lucky). Peace,Rich Bracing can be done differently depending on design- This is a Modified X that sounded pretty good and has structurally held up well- Edited February 1, 2007 by fryovanni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 (edited) Those are some rough dimensions. You can see though, from the pictures, that it's not solid stock the entire way to the top, it tapers at those high points. I'm sure you know this already though, just stating for principle, though. Here's a side angle of the soundboard. And you can see a picture of the braces alone here By the way, all those black marks that look like gaps are just pencil marks yet to be sanded. I can assure you everything is glued tight. And yes, I did use Titebond. Didn't read you wanted the top thickness. Measuring it with a straightedge - no caliper or mic - it looks about 1/8 thick. I'm willing to say its probably around .120 - .125. Edited February 1, 2007 by matttheguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Those are some rough dimensions. You can see though, from the pictures, that it's not solid stock the entire way to the top, it tapers at those high points. I'm sure you know this already though, just stating for principle, though. Here's a side angle of the soundboard . And you can see a picture of the braces alone here To be honest I think you will be pushing it. You can see in that picture I posted that I toy with the configuration a bit(even drilled out the braces). The main thing I have found is that height is strength. Even after drilling the area near the X I found I lost very little strength. The place that the X is joined at yours is about 50% the height I shoot for. The X bears a lot of stress, and the main braces also carry vibration. You also have to remember over time the torque of the bridge and string tension will work to collapse the soundhole area(and raise the area behind the bridge). Overtime this leads to neck re-sets. I would give Stew Mac a call and tell them what happened. Ask how much they would charge to help you out. They might make you a deal because you just bought the kit. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matttheguy Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 I've already sent StewMac an email, but I'll call them in the morning, also. They've always been good to me, we'll see how they react here. Thanks Rich, much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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