donbenjy Posted February 20, 2005 Report Share Posted February 20, 2005 (edited) hey, im about to start putting a KA motherbucker and a P90 into my guitar and i pretty much have the wiring figured...there s afew things im not clear on though: im gonna have one option of the MB so that i have all 4 coils on and a want a toggle switch to switch between series and parellel wired. can anyone help me out with wiring a dpdt on/on switch for series/parellel on effectively 2 humbuckers? i only want it for one position of the 5 way super switch im using to switch between MB positions though, so should i split all the wires into 2, one to go to the toggle switch and the others to connect usually to the other 4 positions of the super switch? theres also the pickup selector....ill be using a 3 way on/on/on dpdt LP style mini toggle switch to select the pups...how do i wire it for standard neck/both/bridge wiring (i dont know cos thi sis my first project and im working with a strat, so im not used to tggle switches) also, im not sure what order i should wire things...im using a 5 way super switch for the motherbucker, and a mini LP style 3 way toggle switch for pickup selecting (P90, both, MB) can anyone help with the order i shoudl wire things? shoudl it be: "hot" pickup wire--->5 way super switch (for the MB)--->series/parellel switch (only for one position on the 5-way switch)--->pickup selector-->jack "ground" pickup wire--->vol pot----> jack the P90 will obviously be wired like a normal pup: "hot"---->3 way pickup selector--->jack "ground"--->vol pot--->jack i hope this is right... cheers in advance ben Edited February 20, 2005 by donbenjy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted February 21, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2005 *cough* bump* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockthe40 Posted February 22, 2005 Report Share Posted February 22, 2005 guitarelectronics.com and the seymour duncan site have diagrams. im sure you can figure it out, just give it a try. you can use the les paul diagram for you PUP selector, for the superswitch, im as lost as it gets on those things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted February 22, 2005 Report Share Posted February 22, 2005 What switch(es) are you using, and exactly what do you want it to do? It's very hard to draw something up from the vague description you wrote up. If the "5 way super switch" you're talking about is the Stew-Mac #3200 Super Switch, you don't need another switch for the Motherbucker, unless you need more than 5 different options on that pickup alone. If you'll decide precisely what you want and post it, I'll try to draw you a picture. Oh, and if you find that having those 11 options simply isn't enough, and you've got to have more, simply send a signed blank check to.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted February 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 ok ill try and explain more comprehensively. I was in a rush last time so sorry if it was vague. ok here goes: the MB is wired to the 5 way super switch (yes, the stewmac one) for the following positions: 1- neckside coil, reverse phase wired 2- 2 "neck" coils, out of phase 3- all 4 coils* 4- 2 "bridge" coils, in phase 5- 3rd coil (if the one nearest the neck is 1) in phase. * the 4 coils have a switch to select parellel/series wiring- dpdt on/on the P90 is wired as normal and im using a LP style on/on/on switch for neck/both/bridge. What i was asking is, how do i wire the on/on switch for series/parellel so that it only changes it for the 3rd position on the switch? a diagram would be SO useful if you dont mind, i was gonan get a tech to do it cos of the switch bit i dont get (i AM capable of soldering and following a diagram though) but the tech people were takign too long to come up with a quote and i figured it faster to do it myself. good practice too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 First of all, some of those choices make no sense to me - for instance, the neck coils wired out of phase (#2) will get you almost no output from the strings, and with no noise rejection (since the out of phase coils aren't humbucking), the noise will be worse than a single coil. Unless two coils are a fair distance from one another, wiring them out of phase simply cancels the signal almost completely. Where did you get these choices, and what do you expect to achieve by using them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted February 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 they were posted on some other forums by someone who had done it. surely as the MB is high voltage it wont have a problem? so is that not a good idea then? i could just have it in phase then? with the front coil still reverse wired so it's out of phase with the P90? would this be harder to wire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Oh, it can be done without any problem, but again, I'm just not sure it's worth the trouble. I don't think you're going to find much use for that out of phase sound, but that's just me. I'll see what I can get done in the next day or so. Just out of curiosity, what was your tech going to charge you to do all this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted February 26, 2005 Report Share Posted February 26, 2005 OK, here's your (unverified) wiring diagram - somebody check my work, my eyes are starting to cross from staring at it! Click on thumbnail image for the full size image. I'm assuming you know how to wire a DPDT 3-way - have fun, and let me know if it doesn't work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted February 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2005 (edited) woo thanks so much!!! might be a couple of wereks before i get the parts, im ordering from US so not sure how long it'll take but thanks!!! oh yeh, because the MB is so high output, im usign 2 volume controls, one for the P90 and 1 for the MB...i jsut put these in before the 3-way switch i guess? Edited February 26, 2005 by donbenjy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted February 26, 2005 Report Share Posted February 26, 2005 (edited) Yeah, just hang one on the output of the above and one on the P90 hot lead. Easy-peasy! I still wanna know how much this was gonna cost you to get done in the shop. Edited February 26, 2005 by lovekraft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted February 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2005 lol the guy i was email ran the shop and he'd emailed his tech people about 20 times but they didnt get back to him with a quote, so we thought it best to just order the parts and ill do it myself parts came up to $178.15 inc. pickguard, pots etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2005 ok, just about to start wiring now, i'll let people know how i get on, & if your schem works lovekraft though i have full confidence in you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2005 ARSE! ok, well MOST of the circuit works i got one switch upside down so the "neck" position is the bridge pup. but the biggest problems are the volume differnce, i didnt have time to test it with strings, just tapping with a screwdriver buuuut, the MB looses a lot of volume when the centre position is selected, and also if i turn the knob on the conecntric pot for one pup to "off" both pups turn off. I havn't had a chance to check as i had to leave it, but also the series/parellel switch:- one position works, the other has no output. but, agai, i had no time to check which was which...sooooo any ideas? im guessing the pot thing is possibly to do the grounding? and the series/parellel switch possibly a dodgyy connection. oh also, i presume i did this right, but the pups aer wired parellel to the jack right? i coudln't get my head around wiring it series wth the switch... ---1.0--0.4 ---2.0--0.5 ---3.0--0.6 if thats the 3 way mini toggle switch from pups, i left 1 and 6 empty, then put the P90 hot lead to 5 and the MB hot to 2 and then cables off 3 and 4 that join together at the jack...i that right? cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted March 24, 2005 Report Share Posted March 24, 2005 ... I havn't had a chance to check as i had to leave it...Well. check it when you get time, and get back to us. ...if i turn the knob on the conecntric pot for one pup to "off" both pups turn off...This is the first anybody's heard about a dual concentric pot - sounds like you've got both halves wired as master volumes. I'd strongly recommend you go back and debug each switch one at a time, ie, get the motherbucker switch working, then add the series/parallel switch, etc. And don't decide anything until you've at least strung it up and played it - it may be working fine (after all, those pickups weren't designed to reproduce a screrwdriver). It's probably time for you to draw up a diagram of what you've wired, and check it carefully against the diagram posted earlier - you can't simply assume you got it right your first go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2005 yeh i guessi need to check it...any help with the volume changing when i have both pups on? the levels drop when bth are selected :s as for the pot, the lugs are farly close, the solder might have blobbed across to other ones...its not anythin to do with the fact that i linked the grounds together across the terminal does it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted March 25, 2005 Report Share Posted March 25, 2005 We're gonna need either a clear photo or an accurate drawing of what you've done to try debugging it - one of the problems with these arcanely complex wiring ideas is that they are complicated to get right, and often interact in unforeseen ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2005 (edited) lol yeh, well my guitars in my uncles workshop atm so i can't get any pics right now, although assuming i wired the schematic you drew up properly, then i guess i can remember the other bits...but it's only a guess. hmm, the coaxial cable from the P90 might be shorting something? im gonna try neatening everythin up today and working through systematically. could the volume dropbe to do with more resistance in that part of the circuit, or an intermittant connection? ill check with a multimeter going round anyway and make sure the braided cable isn't shorting against anything. oh also, the dual concentric has a plastic bottom so i couldn't ground to there. temporarily I used a connecting block to join the grounds. would this have a good enough connection for a permanent ground? theres a screw inside the cavity i guess i could use...maybe wth a ring terminal? and, just to be sure, the two pups are wired parellel to the jack right? i've got 2 hots, one from each pup going to hot... ill do some diagrams now... edit: sorry about the way i did them, but i dont have a decent design program on this PC. if its really too hard ill do a proper schem later when i can get to photoshop. the "MB hot" lead is the lead that says "to 3 way" on your diagram. edit sorry sbout the size Edited March 26, 2005 by donbenjy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted March 26, 2005 Report Share Posted March 26, 2005 Try swapping the hot lead(s) and the switch lead(s) on each pot - that should take care of the volume interaction. Why didn't you use a standard single pole switch for the pickup selector? That one will probably work, but it adds yet another layer of complication, and makes it that much harder to debug. Does the Motherbucker switch work as expected if you hotwire it directly to the jack? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2005 (edited) lol i realise a single pole switch would've been easier NOW ok i didn't have a chance to see my guitar today, so i'll try that tomorrow. And the leads on the pot. I'll try switching the leads on the selector too to see if that helps oh yeh, i just grabbed any peices of wire for this, some ofit is single core...i guess that mgiht be a problem...this was only to text btw i wont be using it in the finished thing. but there were definately problems with the core snapping quite a few times Edited March 26, 2005 by donbenjy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted March 27, 2005 Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 Solid core wire is not a problem - it works fine, as plenty of people around here can testify. Connecting it to the wrong place, however, can cause problems. Happy Easter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2005 ok then, just wondering if it had any effect on the resistance in the circuit. hmm, do you think if i had the out of phase option selected on the MB coudl ahve caused a volume drop? ill try it on all 4 full on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 ...do you think if i had the out of phase option selected on the MB coudl ahve caused a volume drop?D'ya think, maybe? This is going to become long and tedious unless you pay fairly close attention to what you're doing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 (edited) hehe ok then...tis my first time with a guitar righty fixed it!!! the problem with the series/parellel switch was that i'd got the 2 switch outputs the wrong way...duh! switched the wires on the pot...that works, although i think i got some dirt in the top pot cos the workshop was relly dusty...guess i cant fix that cos theres no way to the contacts on a concentric pot!!! all works fine n dandy except the loss of output on the pot at a certain postion edit: hmm seems to have gone abit now...just from twisting, so prolly dirty :s hmm im really having probs with the ground...because fo the lack of space, i used one of those plastic connector blocks & the wires fall out all the time...any ideas? Edited March 28, 2005 by donbenjy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donbenjy Posted March 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 ARSE the groundings gone AGAIN!!! anyone got an idea where i can ground to? this connector block is CRAP im thinking ofjust getting a largish peice of metal and star grounding to that then glueing it into place on the scratchplate? any ideas for a piece of metal? lol oh btw my soldering iron isnt the er..smallest in the world...infact its a gas one and so kinda melts anything around it so im solder THEN putting on the scratchplate well good news is that EVERYTHING is fine except the grounding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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