Stains, Nitro And The Like

[MikeB]

i have a few questions:

in regular nitro (i bough some behlen) can you mix behlen alcohol based dye into it for a candy coat effect?

i know to try these things, and so I have just done 6 or so tests with varying stain quantities, but am i missing something long term? will come a cropper somewhere? i cannot tell yet as they are drying at the moment.

how effective is bushing nirto? to make it less smeary or streaky should i mix acetone in it or cellulose thinners, make for a thinner coat? should i try a roller? i cant affore a spray rig right now

has anyone used polyester resin as a grain filler? i have experimented - when its dry its awesome. the problem I had was it didnt dry for a month. I phoned the guy i bought the MEKP accelerator from and he assures me if i mix it very accurtely it will be fine. i now have a measuring syringe!

one more question - what do you use as grain filler? I have used epoxy to absolutely no avail. bear in mind I need a clear filler. or black.

thanks

Mike

[Mattia]

dyes won't get you candy coat, they'll get you tinted finishes.

Lots of people use epoxy as a clear filler with great success. Many, many acoustic builders (who almost per definition use finishes) included. LMI's system 3 clearcoat, and Z-Poxy Finishing Resin (a fibreglass resin, really) seem to be the faves.

[MikeB]

whats the difference between a tinted finish and a candy coat? i thought they were both just coloured laquer.

I might look into different epoxies than the ones I have tried.

you mention fiberglass resin - thats what i have out there now, and hopefully within a week i will be able to try some accurately!

cheers

Mike

[AlGeeEater]

Yes, mixing alcohol based dyes will give you tinted lacquer. Candy is a metallic base with a translucent color over top of it(I think).

I have never brushed nitro, but a spray rig isnt THAT expensive. If you can borrow a compressor from a buddy then buy the gun you are all set. My set up only cost me around 200 dollars.

I use stew-mac waterbased grainfiller. I havent had any problems, yet! I didnt like using 2 part epoxy, but that doesnt mean it won't work.

Edited September 5, 2005 by AlGeeEater

[Mattia]

Tinted finish is just that, a clearcoat that's got a colour. Like tinted glass, like. Something like a cherryburst is done with tinted lacquers for example. Candy's a different look altogether, but one I'll leave people who actually do them to answer. Look up car paints and colours for examples of candy finishes, though.

Let me add that I've had pretty good success with StewMac's colortone waterbased filler. Takes several applicaitons to get a good, complete fill, but it's easy to work, and sands back well.

[AlGeeEater]

Tinted finish is just that, a clearcoat that's got a colour. Like tinted glass, like. Something like a cherryburst is done with tinted lacquers for example. Candy's a different look altogether, but one I'll leave people who actually do them to answer. Look up car paints and colours for examples of candy finishes, though.

Let me add that I've had pretty good success with StewMac's colortone waterbased filler. Takes several applicaitons to get a good, complete fill, but it's easy to work, and sands back well.

←

I'm pretty sure what I said was a candy. It's a transparent clear over a colored base.

http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.ph...c=9874&hl=candy

They are basically the same thing though(a candy coat). The candy coat is transparent(tinted clear) just like tinted lacquer is. Just, to get the candy effect you need a colored base.

Edited September 5, 2005 by AlGeeEater

[MikeB]

A rig over here would cost me about £180 i think $350 or so. I dont have that cash to spend, infact I have no cash to spend cos im going to uni and I have to pay my way - transport fares etc...

i will buy one sometime, but for the meantime im looking for alternatives.

the thing is i could probably get a rig for about £110, but it would be a 6Litre compressor and no pressure regs and stuff so i could risk doing a worse job than brushing or rolling.

I have a waterbased vinyl grain filler, does the job for solid coats, but useless for stains, and it seems im doing alot of stained ones. i have tried waterbased natural under a stain and it looks nothing short of crap!

My tinted laquer tests look good so far (3-4 coats) in 2 hours im gonna start clear coating them. The nitro has great potential so far, much better than poly imo, apart from it stinking to high hell! i have a good respirator though.

how many coats of nitro for a good glassy finish? 12? more? and is wet 1200 grade paper sufficient for finishing, followed by polishing.

Mike

Ps algee your refin jobs impress me i liked your suggestions and i would use a blow heater but i have always decided not to because of dust issues.

[AlGeeEater]

A rig over here would cost me about £180 i think $350 or so. I dont have that cash to spend, infact I have no cash to spend cos im going to uni and I have to pay my way - transport fares etc...

i will buy one sometime, but for the meantime im looking for alternatives.

the thing is i could probably get a rig for about £110, but it would be a 6Litre compressor and no pressure regs and stuff so i could risk doing a worse job than brushing or rolling.

I have a waterbased vinyl grain filler, does the job for solid coats, but useless for stains, and it seems im doing alot of stained ones. i have tried waterbased natural under a stain and it looks nothing short of crap!

My tinted laquer tests look good so far (3-4 coats) in 2 hours im gonna start clear coating them. The nitro has great potential so far, much better than poly imo, apart from it stinking to high hell! i have a good respirator though.

how many coats of nitro for a good glassy finish? 12? more? and is wet 1200 grade paper sufficient for finishing, followed by polishing.

Mike

Ps algee your refin jobs impress me i liked your suggestions and i would use a blow heater but i have always decided not to because of dust issues.

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Ouch nevermind, you are on the uni(college) budget

I would LOVE to spray poly-urethane, it's more durable than nitro and cures faster. Buffing nitro is easy as hell though.

I would say 12 sounds good if you are scared of sanding thru. I never do more than 10-12 clear coats on a body. I also never spray for more than 2 days. Using the heatbox I can probaly do about 9 coats a day, but that's rushing it. I do about 5-6 a day. I don't think that a good glassy finish comes from layers, more from how you buff them out. If you buff out nitro before it's done gasing off all the solvents then it's just going to look like crap 2 weeks later. That's why I like using the heatbox, althought you have to be carefull with 150+ degree lamps on paint

Thanks a lot! That means a lot to me. It makes me glad doing whatever I do haha. Blow heater? You mean heatbox or something?

[Maiden69]

Fiberglass resing would dry to a greenish color, you need the gel coat resin, thats the one that is clear and can be tinted to whatever color you would like.

Adding the dye to the nitro will give you the samething as a candy coat, alto the real candy are a bit different, all you are adding is a toned coat. Make sure that once you get the tone that you want, to build up with clear nitro, Candy coats (or translucent color coats) don't react too good to color sanding. If you are color sanding and you see a bit of color on the water, stop and recoat. If you sand thru it might mean a complete redo...

polyester resing is nothin more than a high build primer, unless the one you got is putty thick, this is the stuff that I use when I make fiberglass mold, it build up very quick, and is as tough as the fiberglass resing once dry. I don't know why it took so long for yours to dry since when I apply it it takes about and hour or so to harden propertly, and I used to spray it veeeery thick.

Brushing the tinted nitro, I would consider it a nightmare. It is not easy to get it very even and it could be very tricky to sand it smooth before topping with the clear.