Gibson Spirit Guitars.

[Marzocchi705]

First guitar was a Encore, played that for 2 years, i thought it was great. Then i got my epi, i still have it now, ive never wanted anything else, well wanted anything else enough to save up for ages to get it. I simply dont know what has hapend to Gibson, they seem like theyr trying so hard (with the MAGIC system and what not) but they dont seem to be with it now. Why do they feel the need to make these plywood POS'? Heres what i think, its pure greed. All these little kids want to play gibsons and fenders right? because of the name, fender has the Squire, you can get a basic squier for 70buk with an amp and strap and a tutorial vid. Altho gibson have Epi, there a bit more expensive than squier, so they brought out the spirit so that it can be in the mass market (cause lets face it, way more people go in to toy shops than guitar stores.) so therefor they will sell more of them.

[Gorecki]

Seriously, the venting of your spleen over something that you'd never buy anyway. That's just kind of silly, no?

Wouldn't buy it now, no - but I did buy one of these antfarms with strings when I was 11. I guess I'm still irritated about trying to learn to play that cheese slicer.

30 years later I still have my cheese slicer and damn glad we crossed paths.

[marksound]

I'm trying to find another like my first crap box, but so far no luck.

[GEdwardJones]

First guitar was a Encore, played that for 2 years, i thought it was great. Then i got my epi, i still have it now, ive never wanted anything else, well wanted anything else enough to save up for ages to get it. I simply dont know what has hapend to Gibson, they seem like theyr trying so hard (with the MAGIC system and what not) but they dont seem to be with it now. Why do they feel the need to make these plywood POS'? Heres what i think, its pure greed.

Actually, what you describe is "good business."

[GEdwardJones]

30 years later I still have my cheese slicer and damn glad we crossed paths.

I still own every guitar I've ever had. Including the Global guitar and Harmony bass my brother and I got when I was 7 and the Cort EVH replica thingy I started taking lessons on when I was 12 (20 years ago this summer where's the "decrepit" emoticon?). If it wasn't for department store guitars (JC Penny's AND Sears) I probably would never have started playing.

So, while people are in this thread screaming about how big POSes these things are (which, seems funny given that I don't think anyone's lowered themselves to the level of actually BUYING one and living with it long enough to make an informed decision) I'm sitting here thinking, "y'know, that's how *I* started playing."

Not every town has a music store, and not every parent is going to order a guitar off the interweb. For a lot of kids these guitars are the only way they're going to get a guitar for Christmas. Period.

Also, a lot of "classic" guitars were, in fact, cheap department store POSes. I'm looking directly at YOU, anyone who owns a Dan-o. Just because something's inexspensive doesn't mean it's cheap and just because something's cheap doesn't mean it's crap.

[marksound]

Ok, my first electric was a white Alamo Fury hollow core single pickup bigsbylike thing with an Alamo Capri tube amp. I had it for nearly 30 years until some losers broke into my storage unit and trashed what they didn't steal (lost a lot of gear). Anyway, I've been trying to find another one, but I can't even find a picture. Any help?

[Gorecki]

Also, a lot of "classic" guitars were, in fact, cheap department store POSes. I'm looking directly at YOU, anyone who owns a Dan-o. Just because something's inexspensive doesn't mean it's cheap and just because something's cheap doesn't mean it's crap.

Yeah, when Sear's Silvertones started becoming 'a thing' I couldn't and still don't understand.....WHY?

Then we throw Ibanez in to the soup, going from pretty much nothing but copies of this and that to one of the biggest guitar markets.

Wish my Global became a classic so I can justify having the ugly old dog!

[psw]

I simply dont know what has hapend to Gibson, they seem like theyr trying so hard (with the MAGIC system and what not) but they dont seem to be with it now. Why do they feel the need to make these plywood POS'? Heres what i think, its pure greed.

Actually, what you describe is "good business."

At best it is a cynical attempt to begin brand loyalty by attaching their name to an unrelated product in the hope of a future flow on. We all have fond memories of our first guitars and these do influence our future loyalties. The "spin doctors" surely used this as justification for the marketing angle.

But this is what passes for "good bussiness" in an age when mangements and company ownerships change practically yearly, this is the business of the fast buck, and (like putting stripper's in a failing bar in a desparate attempt to keep it afloat before it goes under (instead of say *thinks* inviting a young local band attracting all their family and friends...hmmm))..."good" business, "greed" business...or perhaps just a desparate attempt to stay afloat against a tide of increasing quality and innovation on their high end (so they're scale down the custom shop...) and a huge gap in their affordable low end markets...

You can not really compare a company like Dan-O to this kind of thing. There is no innovation or imagination in this exercise. The argument is not against POS guitars (mine was a white Ibanez SG copy new in the 70's with thre HB's and a Bigsby...i ended up playing a genuine Les Paul...those copy manufacturers did companies like Gibson a big favour at the time). Dan-O looked at the market and thought...how can we approach the product and the market in a different way. Well lets see, new materials like masonite and full plastic binding, creative pickup solutions like the lipstick, and how about a guitar with 32 frets, a six string tic-tac bass, a guitar that sounds like a sitar...endless varieties some of which became classic...

What Gibson has done is just take an average plywood POS, covered it in filler and polished it up...they probably had no input in the design, afterall, it looks a bit like one of their designs...but this thing hardly came out of Kalamazoo. I think the argument, if there is one is not against POS guitars but the squandering of opportunities by this company to do "good" business, taking the easy and cynical way instead of the creative and innovative approach at the same price point. This is not a sign of a confident company, but typical of a desparate and failing company that is struggling to come up with good ideas and lacking business vision.

What this thread is really, I think, is not "screaming" complaint about POS guitars, but a lament for a company who could be doing great things but seems to be showing signs of sinking..."bad" and "sad" business...my 2c non-refundable pete

[GEdwardJones]

At best it is a cynical attempt to begin brand loyalty by attaching their name to an unrelated product in the hope of a future flow on.

Or, it's an attempt to capture a portion of a market which they are not in currently without destroying their brand image. Seems pretty smart to me, Gibson's your high end, Epi's midline, Spirit's low end. You don't sell Gibsons ar Toys R Us, you don't sell Spirits at Guitar Center. Everyone can buy your guitars, you make money.

But, even if I take your analysis at face value (and I don't, mind you, but if I did). Yeah, you know that's why BMW has the 120 AND the 760. That's why you can buy a VW Jetta AND an Audi S8. If you're a large manufacturer it's not a bad idea to be able to serve your customer base at all levels of their financial development.

You can not really compare a company like Dan-O to this kind of thing. There is no innovation or imagination in this exercise.

I can, and I did. "We'll make a guitar out of the same stuff they make kitchen counters out of." Isn't really that far from "we'll make a guitar out of the same stuff they make kitchen cabinets out of." Those old Dan-Os and Silvertones were, in intent if not execution, the exact same as these guitars. That's not conjecture, that's not me theorizing, that's historical fact.

Dan-O looked at the market and thought...how can we approach the product and the market in a different way. Well lets see, new materials like masonite and full plastic binding, creative pickup solutions like the lipstick, and how about a guitar with 32 frets, a six string tic-tac bass, a guitar that sounds like a sitar...endless varieties some of which became classic...

You're either being disingenuous or delusional. Every single part of those classic Dan-Os and Silvertones were made because they were cheap. I am not making this up. The lipstick tube pickup was created because someone figured out that actual discarded lipstick tubes were an alright, cheap, way to make pickup housings. Those guitars were built to a price point. Any innovations they had came from the need to make the guitars as cheaply as possible. That is all. These were guitars that were made to be cheap, disposable learning tools for kids to get on Christmas morning. They were never meant to be classics.

What Gibson has done is just take an average plywood POS, covered it in filler and polished it up...they probably had no input in the design, afterall, it looks a bit like one of their designs...but this thing hardly came out of Kalamazoo.

What Gibson has done is taken their designs and built them to a price point. The same as Silvertone did back in the day.

Also, Epiphones, Kramers, Steinbergers and Tobiases don't come out of Kalamazoo

Well, neither do Gibsons, being as how they're in Nashville.

Now Heritage, those come from Kalamazooo

I think the argument, if there is one is not against POS guitars but the squandering of opportunities by this company to do "good" business, taking the easy and cynical way instead of the creative and innovative approach at the same price point.

Right, 'cos you'd buy a guitar from Circuit City? Someone in this thread stated straight out that all they needed to know that it was sold at Toys R Us.

I don't think the $100 price point is one where a lot of innovation happens, innovation costs money. Money that you don't have to tack on to a guitar that you're selling for the bear minimum anyway.

These guitars aren't for people who care about how innovative the guitar is. If you want innovation, get the digital Gibson. These are, by and large, for kids who will take their first guitar lesson on them.

What this thread is really, I think, is not "screaming" complaint about POS guitars, but a lament for a company who could be doing great things but seems to be showing signs of sinking..."bad" and "sad" business

's Funny, still seems like a bunch of people yelling about POS guitars to me.

Wish my Global became a classic so I can justify having the ugly old dog!

I wish my Global became a classic so I could find a pickup for it.