Should I Build One Or Buy One?

[Riodectros]

I'm new to this forum, but I may stay here if it turns out to be nice. well anyways I have been saving for a Gibson Les Paul Studio the past few months and I'll have enough aftert the holidays are over.

But, I happened to stumble upon ProjectGuitar.com while looking at ways to customize guitars. And now, I want to build my own. My problems re I have no expiernce at all, I've never owned a guitar (I just use my families), I've only played for 1 year (and thats bass guitar), I'm only 15 years old, and I'm only willing to spend at most $600 for one try at it.

Really I'm just looking to have a ton of fun (yes I've read and know its a ton of hard work too) making my own original guitar. I love originality, which is why I'd rather do this than buy one in the first place.

I have the basic wood working skills, and I could always get help from my Dad, so thats not a huge issue. But as for tools, I think I have most of the stuff, or could somehow rent it.

Now at my budget thingy, would I be able to make a guitar of $500 in value (by the time it reachs the walls or a music store, not that I would sell it) or not close to that?

About how much time would it take a kid my age to build the guitar?

Am I better off building a custom version of a already made style or am I just as fine off designing my own body shape?

How hard is it to figure out where the frets would go (I read alot but didn't find anything about this except that it is hard)?

And finally, Is this worth the time, money, and frustration?

I realize I'm a newbie to all of this, but it'd be nice to know before I get into it.

[Southpa]

I have the basic wood working skills

What basic woodworking skills? Its not like nailing 2X4's together. Ever used a router that spins at 30,000 rpm's?

Now at my budget thingy, would I be able to make a guitar of $500 in value

yes, but thats just for parts, wood etc. for the guitar. Tools, templates etc. are another money issue.

About how much time would it take a kid my age to build the guitar?

Got a shop to play in? I found that the actual time it takes me to do something is only a small part of the time I take to figure out what needs to be done and how to get it right the first time.

Am I better off building a custom version of a already made style or am I just as fine off designing my own body shape?

For anybody's first guitar I would recommend a tried and true design. That way you can work off someone else's drawings and templates. Its a bit of a headstart over having to try something new and hope that it works.

How hard is it to figure out where the frets would go

Do some more reading anyway. Its in here...believe me. But you can buy preslotted fretboards so your only issue is how far from the bridge to set the neck for the proper scale length.

And finally, Is this worth the time, money, and frustration?

Hell no! But do it anyway!

Seriously, if you just want a guitar then I would recommend a kit assembly to start. You can buy necks and bodies in almost any stage of their construction, from raw blocks to shaped and finished units. You can also buy prewired pickguards etc. so only minimal soldering and assembly is required. Its all up to you at what floor you want to start at. Keep browsing this forum and decide whether or not you are capable of doing some of the stuff that others have done here. Learn and understand the terminology and how its applied to guitar building. For example, if you don't know what a "scale length" is then you have no business trying to attach a neck onto a guitar body until you DO fully understand the concept.

[GregP]

I'm not the best person to answer this-- my first full-on project is still on hiatus (though I've done many of the major components) and I've only done minor projects in the meantime. That said, here's my additional and/or confirmational advice (I cross-posted with Soutpa, but didn't go back to edit redundancies!) get from almost anyone here:

Now at my budget thingy, would I be able to make a guitar of $500 in value (by the time it reachs the walls or a music store, not that I would sell it) or not close to that?

Many people here have been this or more successful right from their first builds. Other people have not. The deciding factor seems to be the planning stage and the amount of patience you have. I'm so patient that I haven't even finished my first full 6-string electric guitar project yet. An abundance of patience. Actually, I just have too little access to a workshop.

About how much time would it take a kid my age to build the guitar?

It'll take exactly as much time as it takes. ;-) There's no way of predicting exactly how long it could take you. If you approach it wisely, you will spend a LOT of time researching first, and testing things out and learning your tools. Then you'll have to source instrument-ready wood and wait for it to arrive. Then you should spend enough time on each part that you don't 'burn out' in a day's work and get careless or impatient. Then the longest part, assuming you are persistent in plugging at it to get it to this phase (and also depending on the type used), will be finishing the guitar.

Am I better off building a custom version of a already made style or am I just as fine off designing my own body shape?

You're fine doing either, in terms of "ease of build," but using known styles can give you certain advantages in some cases. For example, tried-and-true ergonomics (or at least known ergonomic issues that you can either accept or not) and the right components (eg. pickguards if you decide to do a strat style). If you are unsure if you can make a decent template (and templates ARE a must in most people's opinions, even if you design your own) there is guitarbuildingtemplates.com for you, which is handy.

How hard is it to figure out where the frets would go (I read alot but didn't find anything about this except that it is hard)?

Well, the measurements are easy to find. But how many people can line up a fret slot and cut it with traditional tools, to a hundredth of an inch accuracy? Not many. Most people have specialized tools/jigs for the job. Luckily, your best bet is to go with a common scale length (24.75, 25, 25.5) and order a fretboard from a site like Luthier's Mercantile or Stewart MacDonald. You can get them pre-radiused, too, which saves you another step that usually requires specialized tools or at least patience in making a jig.

And finally, Is this worth the time, money, and frustration?

You never know until you try. Everyone has different thresholds of frustration. The people who are on this site and have made it through several builds will tell you "yes!" But the common wisdom is that if your end goal is "to have a guitar," rather than "to make a guitar" (noting the subtle difference between those things) then you might just want to buy one.

Hope that sort of helps.

[Drak]

I have no experience at all

I've never owned a guitar (I just use my families)

I've only played for 1 year (and thats bass guitar)

I'm only 15 years old

I'm only willing to spend at most $600 for one try at it.

I'm just looking to have a ton of fun making my own original guitar.

I have the basic wood working skills

I could always get help from my Dad

As for tools, I think I have most of the stuff, or could somehow rent it.

Would I be able to make a guitar of $500 in value or not close to that?

About how much time would it take a kid my age to build the guitar?

Am I better off building a custom version of a already made style or am I just as fine off designing my own body shape?

How hard is it to figure out where the frets would go (I read alot but didn't find anything about this except that it is hard)?

And finally, Is this worth the time, money, and frustration?

Sorry kid, but honestly, you'd be far better off just buying the guitar you want, you won't come anywhere near your goals on that budget or with your experience level.

Your idea of building your own guitar is a good idea, but not all ideas need be put into motion, some ideas are best left to flutter off into the breeze from whence they came.

Maybe revisit the idea in a few years if you decide you really like the guitar and want to spend some time building one, but your stated prerequisites lead up to a solid 'no' for your answer, you could very possibly kiss most of that $600.00 away into the breeze with what you might make of a guitar the first time.

If you want guaranteed results, absolutely and without a doubt just go buy the guitar you want, that is the correct answer.

[thegarehanman]

There's a saying that goes "Things can be done cheaply, quickly, or well, pick any two. "

I agree with it in most cases.

My first build went off without a hitch if you exclude the refinish I had to do because the spray can clear I used garbage. I planned a lot for that build, and it was an LP. So it wasn't the easiest of tasks. Even with the planning and maybe $1k I put into it in the form of wood, hardware and some tools(had most of the tools to begin with), I still look at it as the pure grace of God that it turned out totally playable and actually sounded good too. Actually...I have the same mentality when it comes to everything I build. I'm still not totally convinced that magic garden gnomes don't invade my shop by night and fix my muck ups . Anyhow, if you got anything out of that nonsense, it should be that you can build a guitar well, just plan ahead and don't expect it to be perfect. Just look at the guitar's playability after the build as an added bonus . Eventually you won't have to look at it that way, but on the first build, it doesn't hurt.

peace,

russ

[fryovanni]

If you want a guitar to play you would be better off to buy. If you are wanting to ensure the value of your investment. Again buy a guitar.

If you like the idea of building a guitar. Your first can turn out quite nice. It takes time, patience,planning, and dedication to doing the job right. In the end due to the fact it is not a name brand and you are not going to have a reputation. The value will not be very high(probably comperable to low end clones-**if you built it very well). As far as quality of the guitar. Most middle of the road guitars are built pretty well(especially or the money). You will find the biggest downfall in that price range will be in the fretwork, setup and possibly pickups(some are pretty good), and lack of options(if that is even a factor).

I personally love building guitars. I bought many guitars before I built one. I did my own fretwork, setups, electronics on bought guitars for years before building. You may very well do better to start working on fretwork, setup and so forth. It will be a huge factor in how well you can do on your own from scratch build.

The big kicker is this, your personal drive and motivation has to answer this question.

And finally, Is this worth the time, money, and frustration?

Just about all of the guys on this board will say it is worth it. However most of the people out there would not understand why we do what we do.

Peace,Rich

[Drak]

I'm only willing to spend at most $600 for one try at it.

Just look at the guitar's playability after the build as an added bonus.

Did you not read the parameters he stated?

It must be worth $500.00 when finished.

A guitar of 'questionable playability' would be basically completely worthless except for the experience gained, and the experience is not what he's after, he's after a perfectly working custom built guitar first time out the gate for $600.00/materials.

That just ain't happenin'.

Eventually you won't have to look at it that way, but on the first build, it doesn't hurt.

$600.00 and one try is all he stated.

He stated his goals quite clearly, as I stated my answer.

[GregP]

He stated that he *primarily* wants to have fun, has some of the fundamental skills, has access to tools, has already done some reading, and wants to restrict his budget to $600 PER TRY, which is how I read those words. If that $600 is wasted, it might not encourage him to try again ever, but I didn't read it as, "I only want to spend $600 and then never think about building guitars again."

Most people, myself included, focused on the bolded dark words which were his actual questions. Forgive me for my attention deficit in not registering the same words you did. I think at the end of the day, most perspectives are aligned with yours, though, in that we just want this young guy to make the right decision with eyes wide open. Other people have also told him that buying a guitar is still an option to consider.

[thegarehanman]

Drak, I wasn't saying that building was the right thing to do. I was telling him what to expect if he did decide to build. Should he decide that the experience is more important than the money, then there's a tidbit of advice for him to chew on. I read it, and I thought that I'd give my $.02, which is equally as valuable as your $.02, but slightly more valuable than GregP's $.02, but only because of the Canadian to American exchange rate.

peace,

russ

[Mattia]

I'm new to this forum, but I may stay here if it turns out to be nice. well anyways I have been saving for a Gibson Les Paul Studio the past few months and I'll have enough aftert the holidays are over.

But, I happened to stumble upon ProjectGuitar.com while looking at ways to customize guitars. And now, I want to build my own. My problems re I have no expiernce at all, I've never owned a guitar (I just use my families), I've only played for 1 year (and thats bass guitar), I'm only 15 years old, and I'm only willing to spend at most $600 for one try at it.

Really I'm just looking to have a ton of fun (yes I've read and know its a ton of hard work too) making my own original guitar. I love originality, which is why I'd rather do this than buy one in the first place.

Based on this, sure, go for it. However, if it's a good, playable, guaranteed guitar you want, buy one pre-made. Building is great fun, and your first CAN be a killer instrument, look great, etc., etc., but there's no actual guarantee it will be. Also, 600 bucks is a pretty tight budget, unless you have a fully equipped workshop at your disposal already.

I have the basic wood working skills, and I could always get help from my Dad, so thats not a huge issue. But as for tools, I think I have most of the stuff, or could somehow rent it.

If you've got a router and a drill press, and a decent jigsaw, you've got all the power tools you need. You will need to buy a few bits, and good ones aren't cheap, so count on 100-150 bucks for various (specialty) tools.

Now at my budget thingy, would I be able to make a guitar of $500 in value (by the time it reachs the walls or a music store, not that I would sell it) or not close to that?

In a word: no. Because value depends largely on brand name on the headstock, and a first-time guitar is very likely to have at least cosmetic issues that preclude a 500 dollar pricetag. Can you build a guitar that sounds as good and plays as well as a 500 dollar instrument? It's certainly possible, but not guaranteed. In any way. It's highly unlikely you'll get the fit and finish most 500 dollar isntruments manage these days.

About how much time would it take a kid my age to build the guitar?

Am I better off building a custom version of a already made style or am I just as fine off designing my own body shape?

How hard is it to figure out where the frets would go (I read alot but didn't find anything about this except that it is hard)?

And finally, Is this worth the time, money, and frustration?

Time: depends. Count on 100-200 hours of actual work, not counting letting the glue dry, and not counting designing it properly. I can do a strat style in less, now, but my first instruments (chambered, carved top, set neck guitars) took a long, long time in hours, and at least a year to actually complete. Get yourself a copy of Melvyn Hiscock's Make Your Own Electric Guitar, which takes your through designing a guitar, step by step, and various build styles. In terms of fret spacing, either buy a slotting jig (if you're going to make more than one guitar, and you are if you start building, trust me), or buy a pre-slotted fingerboard.

Is it worth the time, money and frustration? For me, that's a big fat yes. But I'm almost in it more for the building and the designing than I am for the final products per se. If I wanted great guitars to play, nothing more, there's no way in hell I'd build. It takes a pretty huge amount of investment in tools, materials, and above all TIME to get to the point where you start feeling confident enough in your guitar building skills to build for others, as it were, and right now I'm only doing it for friends, essentially at cost (between 150 and 700 bucks per instrument, just so we're clear; that's purely materials). It's a fantastic hobby, but it's not a way to save time, and it's definitely not a way to save money; the cost of the learning curve (your first isntruments won't be as good as your later ones) and of tooling up (you can build guitars with a basic set of tools, but you will want to buy more/better tools as you go along) are significant.

Over the past 8 years of building, I've easily spent over 3000 dollars on tools (including a giant bandsaw, 4 routers, drill press, good jigsaw, dremel, compressor/spray gun, variety of good quality chisels, rasps, planes, scrapers, sanders, etc. and I still need/want a few more items), probably more, and more than twice to three time that on wood and parts (admittedly, I'm a bit of a lunatic that way, and have enough wood stashed for the next three or four decades of building if I maintain my current build rate, probably longer). I might be a slightly extreme example, but remember, all I wanted to do in the beginning was put together a strat from some warmoth parts. It kinda...snowballed.

[Drak]

This was one of those times where the post came off a little more heavy-handed than I actually meant it to be, reading it back it seems a bit harsh, sorry Russ, didn't mean to sound overly dramatic, apologies if I offended.

[thegarehanman]

You didn't in the least bit. C'mon, you're drak, you're expected to have a bit of a bite(which we now know is because of dial up ).

peace,

russ

[Riodectros]

Wow. I love you guys. Well I was gonna quote some stuff, but theres alot of different things to quote, so I'm just gonna copy and paste em and answer the questions or respond and so on. I'm only going to answer the neccesary ones, but I did read everything, so you all know.

"What basic woodworking skills? Its not like nailing 2X4's together. Ever used a router that spins at 30,000 rpm's? "

I've worked with jigsaws, sanders, nailguns, bandsaws, and those big saw things you push down on to cut the board. As for routers, I think I've used them in Wood Tech class 2 years ago, but I never paid much attention to that class cause it was boring. Too bad, I should have. Well my dad works with stuff alot, cause we live on a really old house (<150 years) so theres alot to do with wood that he does. We might have a router, I'll have to ask him when he's back from vacation.

"It'll take exactly as much time as it takes. ;-) "

Well that clears things up It makes sense, though, so it really does clear things up.

As for a fretboard, it seems like buying a pre-made might be my path for now.

"Sorry kid, but honestly, you'd be far better off just buying the guitar you want, you won't come anywhere near your goals on that budget or with your experience level."

I understand. Well dispite what you've said, Drak, I think I might go through with this. The idea of painting my own guitar sounds too good to be put off by hard work. And anyways, I'll be having fun doing the hard work (hopefully). Thanks for another angle, though.

Well I have to go, but I'll respond to the rest when I get back later tonight.

[Drak]

I wasn't trying to talk you out of it, just trying to give you an honest appraisal based on your stated needs.

[Hydrogeoman]

Buy the Gibson now so you can learn to play with a quality instrument. Spend a lot of time learning as much as you can from this forum and elsewhere (Melvyn Hiscock's book for starters). You are going to have to invest a fair amount of money in tools just to get started (and if you are like a lot of us here, you will get addicted to adding to your tool collection as well and end up literally spending a fortune). After learning a little about what is involved and it still interests you, save a little more cash and GO FOR IT! In the meantime, you will have a great guitar to play while you are making your first creation.

Just my 2 cents

[Riodectros]

Well my dad got back from vacation this night, and I talked to him about this guitar-making idea. We do have a router (sweet), but I know we don't have a drill press. He also gave the usual speech "Well when you're older and have the money you can do that" as I tell him about how much cooler it would be than buying a guitar. He was like that with other things, half of which I ended up doing anyways. I hope this will be one of those, and I can get him on my side, cause I need his help with all the technical parts of it and wood working.

I'll have to find a way to change his mind, like actually try at school or clean the house without being asked. Or... just figure out a way to get him into it, which is near impossible. Well, if he's not on my side I'm on my own to do everything, meaning cutting trees down. So I need him on my side, so this may not start for awhile.

BTW, I decided that I'll give it a try. Once I get more details from my awesome music teacher guy, I might start the plans.

Thanks guys.

[Drak]

As long as you're mentally prepared for some setbacks, then proceed straight ahead.

It's a lot of fun, but only if you can take the learning curve with calmness, as there will be a learning curve, and there will be things you will probably screw up. This is no place for temper tantrums and giving up, but more of a 'well, OK, I screwed up, I learned what NOT to do now, let's try it again' attitude.

UNLESS you decide to buy a quality pre-made, pre-painted body and a quality pre-made neck, then your chances of success and ending up with a really nice guitar for the first time go up dramatically.

At that point, you could possibly wind up with a NICER guitar than the $600.00 store bought job.

But the more you want to try and do yourself from scratch, the more your chances of winding up with expensive firewood and not much to show for your money go up also.

Long story short, it's all about how much risk you're willing to take with your money as to where your starting point will be, there is a very safe route, and a very dangerous route, and a few somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.

Making that first decision, where you want to start and why there, is really the first important decision you need to mull over and give some serious thought to, as that will be your starchart to your destiny.

[fryovanni]

Any chance your dad might be interested in doing the project side by side with you? Get your old man interested in building and you could have a good time learning as a team.

Peace,Rich

[Riodectros]

Any chance your dad might be interested in doing the project side by side with you? Get your old man interested in building and you could have a good time learning as a team.

I've thought about, and it might come to that. It's just I'd rather do it all myself and feel like wicked proud of myself. I know I'll have to ask him for help on how to use some tools, and maybe my brother about the electric stuff, but I want the the most of it to be me. Not trying to be selfish, I just haven't built anything I've said I will, now I finally wanna do it.

It might come to that anyways, depending on how much he has to teach me.

[hooglebug]

i was 15, had been playing guitar for about 6 months, had little woodwork skills and had only ever picked up one electric when i made my first guitar. yeah its not the best, but its playable, it sounds ok and with some work it could be quite a good little guitar. but i dont want to work on it, cos its my first, and i like it like that.

just go for it

[Acousticraft]

Give it a go but digest as many books as you can re guitar building.

Look in libraries. I remember when I wanted to build my first acoustic I stumbled on The "Steel String Guitar" a white covered book by a guy from LA if I remember correctly.

This gave comprehensive plans and step by step instructions. I read that book over and over till it was clear in my mind how all the bits went together and why. Thats what I would recommend you do firstly. There are things even in an acoustic book that apply equally to electrics so go forth and read.

[matttheguy]

Here's my experience:

My first guitar is nearing completion now, and it seems as though it's going to be playable and probably sound alright to boot, but there's so many mistakes on it. In the finish, the binding, how the fretboard lines up with the neck and the body, et cetera, there are just a lot of cosmetic problems with it. To someone with an experienced eye, this guitar could easily be described as 'ugly' when inspected up close.

You know what? This is the guitar that will always have a hardshell case and will always be properly maintained. Am I completely proud of my work? Not in the least of the sense, but I've learned so much on this first try. That's all that really matters when you're done.

Edited November 28, 2006 by matttheguy

[zeke]

Hey Guys and Matt,

This reply might be two months late but I thought I'd add it since I can identify with Matt's questions.

Matt, have you considered getting one of those Saga electric guitar kits in a box?

I've been googling for a beginner's project for myself and I like the telecaster model TC-10. I even lucked out and found a tutorial on Steve Robinson's website today(http://www.manchesterguitartech.co.uk/kitbuild.html).

Just an idea,

Zeke