spacecowboy Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Hey everyone, so I just picked up this sweeeeeet sounding vintage guitar a few days ago off kijiji. 60$ so worth it just for the gold foil pickups. Honestly I love everything about the from the look to the play-ability and the neck pickup sounds like a million bucks. The bridge sounds a little thin but not bad. However there's three things. 1- When switching both pickups ON, there's a significant volume drop and it sounds a little funny I think it could be a phase issue? How can I solve this. 2- The volume pot only works on 10 and cuts out if you touch it. No biggie I'll just fix it. 3- it's missing the whammy bar. I'm wondering is there any replacements or DIY type things I can use/do. I'm going to be opening the guitar up hopefully tomorrow to see the guts of it. So the main thing I need to figure out is the phase issue... also if you guys have any cool wiring mods or ideas I'm all ears!! Thanks a bunch!! -Vince Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim37 Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 sweet you should post some pics in the japanese thread http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=45598&pid=492527&st=0&#entry492527 1 if you think its a phase issue just pop the pickgaurd off and swap swap the leads of one of the pickups where it meets the switch. 2. these where fairly cheap guitars when they where built find out what the value of the pot is and replace it with a good one. (i would do both) 3 you can find used tremolo bars on ebay or i think guitar fetish has a tremolo pretty close to the old japanese ones you could pull the bar off of. and if you really want a diy you could use a old butter knife or something. http://cgi.ebay.com/Teisco-Kay-Silvertone-Japan-Tremolo-Bar-/320739923772?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item4aad96d73c http://cgi.ebay.com/Teisco-Kent-Silvertone-Kay-guitar-tremolo-cover-arm-MIJ-/330590719815?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item4cf8be0f47 btw i always liked those models one day i will finde one i love the sg look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwedishLuthier Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Quick test to determine phase problems: Hook up an analog voltage meter to the output. Take a piece of ferrous steel (it sticks to the pickup...) and quickly aproach it to the top of the pickup (hey, don't bang it against the pickup). Note the direction the neadle jumps on the meter. Swith to the other pickup and repeat. If the pickups are out of phase the neadle will move in the oposite direction. It works with a digital meter, but the analog is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 (edited) Thanks Tim and SwedishLuthier! Tim I'll definitely post it up in that section after I finish fixing it up -SwedishLuthier I unfortunately do not have a voltage meter So it seems that both pots are 500k. I'm going to run to my electronics store to pick two up. But I just opened it up and it looks messy... is this okay or should I rewire it? I mean you guys are way more experienced in wiring circuitry I don't know much at all. Maybe it's volume dropping because of how it's set up?? Like my brain is hurting when I look at the on/off switches with all those wires. Also I'm used to pickups with only 1 or 2 wires coming out not 4. Also I wonder what value that Capacitor is? Since I'll probably destroy it when I try to remove it lol. Edited August 15, 2011 by spacecowboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkAvenger Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 So it seems that both pots are 500k. I'm going to run to my electronics store to pick two up. But I just opened it up and it looks messy... is this okay or should I rewire it? I mean you guys are way more experienced in wiring circuitry I don't know much at all. Maybe it's volume dropping because of how it's set up?? Like my brain is hurting when I look at the on/off switches with all those wires. Also I'm used to pickups with only 1 or 2 wires coming out not 4. First off, love the guitar, great steal. It looks and sounds like it's OoP. Are there 3 wires or am I missing one? I think that there is a wire for start/finish of the coil and a ground, just basic single coils. If your wanting to rewire and you like the sound of OoP(in addition to normal wiring), here an interesting topic http://projectguitar.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=45518&st=0&p=491421&fromsearch=1&#entry491421 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim37 Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 i would just replace the pots and leave the rest of the wiring along its worked for nearly 50 years i dont think its gonna start huring any thing now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 (edited) yayyyy i just used WD40 on the pots and they work. Saved a lot of hassle. The only thing I think this guitar was meant for tiny baby strings. I put on 11-50 flatwound and the G string on the 14fret hits the higher frets... ugh.... I tried adjusting the truss rod and it's not actually doing anything. I think maybe it's a fake truss rod??? I wonder.... Yeah that's pretty cool DarkAvenger! Glad you like it. Edited August 16, 2011 by spacecowboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lvs Posted August 16, 2011 Report Share Posted August 16, 2011 (edited) Your pics show each pickup has 3 wires. Normally, with a single coil pickup this means one wire connected to the beginning of the coil, one to the end of the coil, and one to metal pickup parts that should be connected to ground, like for instance a metal bottom plate and cover. Two black wires and one red for the bridge pickup. One black, one white and one red for the neck pickup. Both red wires run to the slide switches which get them connected to hot, all the other colors have a fixed soldered connection to ground. For a 2 pickups in parallel configuration this appears correct, and having two identical colors (red) running to hot makes a phase problem look less probable. Also, the wiring doesn't seem to have undergone any modifications even though it's not soldered in a very tidy way. These are of course assumptions, but reasonable ones in my opinion - a multimeter can provide certainty. I see in the meantime you got some more advice and you cleaned the pots - I'd say spray some WD40 into the slide switches also, there still might be a bad connection in there. A nice mod would be to rewire it so that with both slide switches in the off-position, you get both pickups in series instead of silence. No extra parts needed. Edited August 16, 2011 by lvs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy Posted August 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2011 I'd say spray some WD40 into the slide switches also, there still might be a bad connection in there. A nice mod would be to rewire it so that with both slide switches in the off-position, you get both pickups in series instead of silence. No extra parts needed. Will do with the WD40! Good idea. Is it a big rewiring job to have them in series or just 1 or 2 extra wires that I can attach without redoing everything? Since now that it works I probably should mess with history...too much haha. -Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lvs Posted August 16, 2011 Report Share Posted August 16, 2011 Is it a big rewiring job to have them in series or just 1 or 2 extra wires that I can attach without redoing everything? It comes down to unsoldering a few wires and resoldering them elsewhere, no big deal but you have to determine first, at least for one of the pickups, which one of the two grounded wires comes from the coil because that one has to be unsoldered from ground and resoldered to one of the switches. If you want I can post a diagram to give you a better idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkAvenger Posted August 16, 2011 Report Share Posted August 16, 2011 If you decide to rewire, there is an easy way to check which wires come from the coil without anything special. When you unsolder the two grounds, plug your amp into your guitar jack with low volume and the coil your working with on and touch each wire to ground. Whichever one pops when you touch it to ground is the one your looking for. The pop happens when you complete the circuit through the coil while the ground coming from the pickup's plate/housing isn't necessary for functionality. The whole wiring job would be easy, it's just a matter of what you prefer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lvs Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Okay, here's a diagram starting from the current configuration (or better, the one I saw on the photo - you might wanna check) and turning it into a parallel/single/single/series one. The result is electronically the same as a 4-position Tele. Only one of the diagrams on the right is the good one. You could gamble, and if you don't hear any change in tone while sliding the neck pickup switch back and forth, you'll have to swap white and black. Or you might wanna do the test that DarkAvenger suggested. There's also a slight chance you'll find out just looking at the bottom of the pickup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacecowboy Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Wow thanks! That's really cool. I'm going to save it and possibly to this mod soon because it's definitely useful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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