Avalon Posted May 11, 2007 Report Share Posted May 11, 2007 Im not compairing Stacked series to side-by-side parallel mate, im compairing the Stacked parallel to the side-by-side parallel. Both have a very similiar interfearence, relative to how close they get to the bridge pickup, at maximum power (before it picked up EMI from the bridge), and how much sustain was still present on the strings. The effectiveness of the stacked HB (or lack of effectiveness) is not in question, but the amount of EMI the Dual and Stacked attract, is very similiar in parallel wiring, so based on this, i think the Dual and the Stacked will attract similiar amounts of EMI wired in series (similiar amounts to each other, not to the parallel versions). Thats why i haven't built one yet, i've not writen anything off, im just going down the Dual Rail parallel route, based on what i've tested so far, its the most effective driver, its just my opinion though. Ah, sorry 'bout that, I misunderstood - seems like good reasoning - and thanks for putting the time and effort into these tests - Its great that the project is being moved on constantly. (btw, it's the EMI that they are producing that we're worried about rather than what they attract... but that's just a little detail that doesn't effect the validity of the tests at all ) I can't wait for someone to compare a side-by-side 2x4ohm series driver with a side-by-side 2x16ohm parallel one cheers Col Nps mate, we're all in this together lol, and as i've mentioned, this is all very new to me, and im learning alot about it all, which is down to you guys and this fab thread, otherwise i'd be up a well known creek with out a paddle lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted May 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2007 I just think it's fantastic that you guys are all carrying on what I started all those years ago and that people are still so enthusiastic... Here is another thread that may be of interest that is becoming active again after a while...DIY ebow People who'd like to experiment with this can do so with the F/R amp if they like...two project experiments in one... I still have not given up on the idea of a stacked driver, but with the success of the dual rail designs, there doesn't seem to be a need to bother (unless converting a SC pickup to a driver is required). I just have a different sense of it than col, I would have thought that as one coil is opposite to the other with any positive or negative signal swing, the coil feilds would repell from one another, not cancel them selves out, and thus (hypothetically) create more of a drive...however, I could be completely wrong in this and I can see where col is coming from on the cancellation idea... I am also wondering, if I was to make a mid driver (no mid pickup) on my HB/S/S strat, how should I wire my 5 way for versitility. There is a type of tele wiring that simulates the out of phase kind of sound I believe...that sounds interesting, as I do like that sound... Maybe there is some suggestions from people out there that could encourage me to take to my guitar sooner than later... Keep up the good work, especially you Avalon, you are doing all the things I should have been doing had I continued with my experiments on this...greatly appreciated...and you col for maintaining your interest and engaging with others, really in the spirit of this whole thing... pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalon Posted May 12, 2007 Report Share Posted May 12, 2007 Well i think one of the main problems with the stacked design is having a single pole throughout the core of both coils. On my fullsize humbucker, i tried having both cores on the same pole, and it reduces the effectiveness alot, which might be a big part of the problem on the stacked driver. But on the other hand, would two cores with opposite poles just fight with the strings instead of working together if they were stacked? its hard to know really without testing it, but the biggest prob i think is getting both halves with opposite poles on (that might just be me being simple though lol). Anyhow, going to be working on some more dual rails over the weekend, and i've just received the parts for Cols circuit from Maplin (bar 1 capacitor which they sent a Pigme bulb in place of ), but i'll be starting work on that very soon too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted May 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2007 (edited) That will be interesting... Another design idea that may suffer along the same lines as the stacked idea, is a coil around a core and another reverse coil wrapped around the first to provide a kind of active shield... Nps mate, we're all in this together lol, and as i've mentioned, this is all very new to me, and im learning alot about it all, which is down to you guys and this fab thread, otherwise i'd be up a well known creek with out a paddle lol The great thing about this project is that it is simple enough to understand in general and there are so many ideas that can be explored with lessons learnt and shared along the way. Really, any idea is valid till tested (though some are obviously better than others) but it is important to stick to the practical also (my hex designs were in the end a little impractical on many levels)...with so many simple yet clever ideas being explored at present, this all fits well with this principle... pete PS...on the subject of a HB and single strat with mid driver...here are some wiring diagrams for SH guitars from DGB Studio, a great site for wiring ideas...but so many choices, any opinions... Edited May 12, 2007 by psw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
col Posted May 12, 2007 Report Share Posted May 12, 2007 ...and i've just received the parts for Cols circuit from Maplin (bar 1 capacitor which they sent a Pigme bulb in place of ), but i'll be starting work on that very soon too Not Maplin in UK them? Did you order the exact type of Jfet 'J201' ? thats important - also might be wise to get a few of them as they can vary so much - the tolerances are very wide. If you want the latest version of the schematic or layout, just holler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalon Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 ...and i've just received the parts for Cols circuit from Maplin (bar 1 capacitor which they sent a Pigme bulb in place of ), but i'll be starting work on that very soon too Not Maplin in UK them? Did you order the exact type of Jfet 'J201' ? thats important - also might be wise to get a few of them as they can vary so much - the tolerances are very wide. If you want the latest version of the schematic or layout, just holler Yeah, Maplin in the UK, i have to order all the chips from them, as they are the only ppl who stock them. The J201's practically don't exist in the uk, or atleast as far as i can find, i'll probably have to use an MPF102 in its place as i did on the Ruby/Fet and see how it go's (not alot of choice really). As for the latest version of the schematic and layout, any info is greatfully received, but if its alot of hassle, its nps for now mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
col Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 ...and i've just received the parts for Cols circuit from Maplin (bar 1 capacitor which they sent a Pigme bulb in place of ), but i'll be starting work on that very soon too Not Maplin in UK them? Did you order the exact type of Jfet 'J201' ? thats important - also might be wise to get a few of them as they can vary so much - the tolerances are very wide. If you want the latest version of the schematic or layout, just holler Yeah, Maplin in the UK, i have to order all the chips from them, as they are the only ppl who stock them. The J201's practically don't exist in the uk, or atleast as far as i can find, i'll probably have to use an MPF102 in its place as i did on the Ruby/Fet and see how it go's (not alot of choice really). As for the latest version of the schematic and layout, any info is greatfully received, but if its alot of hassle, its nps for now mate I'll have a look for up to date docs for you... As far as J201s, I found a bunch in a local electronics shop - so I bought them all (like I did when I found some AC127s and AC128s in the same shop a few years back). unfortunately, I don't think he has restocked the J201s.. although I'm not sure... What I do know is that you will not get stuff like that in Maplin - not because its not availabe or not being manufactured, but because Maplin is run like a supermarket - stuff that doesn't shift gets canned... its all about cash flow rather than providing a service.... just look how limited the selection of pots are... basically, try getting any component that doesn't also come as part of a bumper beginners pack (I know I'm exaggerating, but you know what I mean).... I suppose mail order would be a good bet - try RS components or Farnell. They both do J201s amongst many other fancy goodies.. although its best to put in a fairly large order to offset the postage cost.... mind you shoppping locally in Maplin, you have to budget for at least 2 trips, 1 to buy, one to go back to have the wrong parts replaced... and also sometimes to have faulty stuf replaced.... so I guess thats your postage cost cheers Col Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalon Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Well i have to mail order to Maplin, but usually if you order monday-friday, in in your door the next morning, so other then the Pigme bulb, i haven't many complaints, but like you say, they only stock what sells, which isn't that handy. I do have a shop local to me which stocks alot of electronics, but other then the MPF102, they don't stock many JFETs, but i'll check out the above links, most of the circuits seem to use the J201, so it might be worth getting a few instock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashBandit Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Trouble shooting question: I've built many drivers and they all are microphonic in that when an amplified sound goes through the coil, it reproduces that signal audibly, like a speaker. This seems to kill the efficiency of it. Specs: the driver is a 3mm thick core, 33 AWG wrapped to 8 ohms, and its about 3mm tall. I get the best response on the high E and B, and I didn't understand why that was until recently and correct me if I'm wrong. I think the reason why I only get response on the two highest strings is because since they're higher in pitch, the amplified signal is less likely to create microphonic problems in the driver, where as when the pitch is lower, it more easily vibrates the coil of the driver, and kills the efficiency so it doesn't vibrate the string. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primal Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Trouble shooting question: I've built many drivers and they all are microphonic in that when an amplified sound goes through the coil, it reproduces that signal audibly, like a speaker. This seems to kill the efficiency of it. Specs: the driver is a 3mm thick core, 33 AWG wrapped to 8 ohms, and its about 3mm tall. I get the best response on the high E and B, and I didn't understand why that was until recently and correct me if I'm wrong. I think the reason why I only get response on the two highest strings is because since they're higher in pitch, the amplified signal is less likely to create microphonic problems in the driver, where as when the pitch is lower, it more easily vibrates the coil of the driver, and kills the efficiency so it doesn't vibrate the string. Any thoughts? Sounds like a potting issue to me. How did you pot your driver? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted May 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Trouble shooting question: I've built many drivers and they all are microphonic in that when an amplified sound goes through the coil, it reproduces that signal audibly, like a speaker...I get the best response on the high E and B Usually it is the other way around, most have no trouble with the lower strings...hmmm You can only get audible sounds if something is vibrating the air (like a speaker cone does) so something must be loose. The other thing is the interaction between the driver and the pickups, the driver will react with other coils like a transfomers coils do, inducing current in them and possibly magnetically induced vibration. The distance between the driver and the pickups is important to prevent this...this is the EMI problem that more elaborate drivers with multiple EMI cancelling coils are trying to address to some degree. I also found interactions between earthed pickups that were disconnected...in my guitar I found it necessary to completely disconnect both ends of these pickup coils from the ground...but this was not an 'acoustic' noise in my guitar...more an electronic signal/distortion/noise. You could get such effects though from other pickups as they will have current and possibly vibrations induced in them regardless of being connected. Other than describing the driver, and i believe you have tested the circuit to be sure it is working properly...perhaps you could describe how you have set up your rig. Are you in test mode with the driver above the strings, well away from the pickups...this will help eliminate if it is a driver/pickup interferance. Can you hear or feel where the sound/vibrations are coming from...the driver? What happens when you turn down the gain on the driver amp...you need to strike a balance where the thing is just before uncontrolled feedback/oscillation. You could try different output caps, I use a 100uF in place of the 220uF for better high string response, perhaps you need more bass to bring out the low strings... Anyone else with thoughts? pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
col Posted May 13, 2007 Report Share Posted May 13, 2007 Trouble shooting question: I've built many drivers and they all are microphonic in that when an amplified sound goes through the coil, it reproduces that signal audibly, like a speaker. This seems to kill the efficiency of it. Specs: the driver is a 3mm thick core, 33 AWG wrapped to 8 ohms, and its about 3mm tall. I get the best response on the high E and B, and I didn't understand why that was until recently and correct me if I'm wrong. I think the reason why I only get response on the two highest strings is because since they're higher in pitch, the amplified signal is less likely to create microphonic problems in the driver, where as when the pitch is lower, it more easily vibrates the coil of the driver, and kills the efficiency so it doesn't vibrate the string. Any thoughts? Just to add a few more options: An audible driver could be caused by the magnet not being securaly fixed to the core... also possibly if the coil is very thin and the LM386 is full on, the coil itself could be flexing causing plastic bobbins (if any) to vibrate.... FWIW many people have had the 'audible driver' problem, me included, all I did was to dramatically reduce the gain of the LM386 and that sorted it. The loss of performance on all but the highest two strings _could_ be caused by parasitic oscillations in your circuitry... check all ground points are securely grounded... check all soilder joints are sound... check that all components are correctly wired... make sure there aren't any accidental solder bridges where there shouldn't be.. make sure you soldered all the pins of the chip(s)... double check your layout... Does the circuit work when coupled to a speaker... how does the sound quality of the lower strings compare to the higher ones ? Good luck Col Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashBandit Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 Tons of experimenting has yielded no answers. Plugged into an 8 ohm speaker, the amp produces a constant high pitched whine whether notes are playing or not. This seems to go away after a minute until I touch the strings, bridge, ground etc. and the whine returns. I have a trim pot between pins 1 and 8, should I also have a cap? What would the cap do? Also, I checked out this Ebow Tut and the guy seems to succesfully recreate the ebow using much thinner wire for the driver, 38 gauge. Why does our experimentation revolve around 32 gauge wire? Does anyone know the gauge and impedance of a commercial sustainer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted May 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 Plugged into an 8 ohm speaker, the amp produces a constant high pitched whine whether notes are playing or not. This seems to go away after a minute until I touch the strings, bridge, ground etc. There you go...the problem is still with the circuit... The loss of performance on all but the highest two strings _could_ be caused by parasitic oscillations in your circuitry... check all ground points are securely grounded... check all soilder joints are sound... check that all components are correctly wired... make sure there aren't any accidental solder bridges where there shouldn't be.. make sure you soldered all the pins of the chip(s)... double check your layout... Good advice, ground loops and such could also cause you problems perhaps, if it doesn't work with a speaker, then the driver will never work...so look into this problem until you can get it to work as an amp... I have a trim pot between pins 1 and 8, should I also have a cap? What would the cap do? In the chip's data sheet a 10uF cap and some other components (see my champ circuit on the previous page or so) are specified for high gain applications such as this. Running a cap between the trim and one of these pins (1 or 8) may help to stop internal oscillations in the circuitry. The runoffgroove stuff on which the Fetzer/Ruby is based is stripped down to the bare minimum and probably works fine for an amp, but in this application, I feel it can use all the help it can get. In my guitar, I used this champ circuit slightly modified with a 100uF output cap for a higher frequency response to help the high strings along. I also used a modified prechamp kit for higher gain. This preamp uses two transistors and various filters to take out very high frequencies...takes up a little more space, and not my ideal, but it does work! Idealy I'd like to see the F/R replaced with a preamp, probably based on an IC with phase reversal up front for the harmonic function (ie not on the driver leads) and possibly a different amp, I am looking into a BTL amp for my next circuit...this seems to offer some advantages such as more power, less chance of ground interferance (the driver is not connected directly to the negative rail) and may address some of my pop and EMI/bypass problems/workarounds as a result. If anyone has any ideas for such a preamp, very keen to here about them... Otherwise, there is also Col's or Juan's circuits...interesting also... It is interesting to see that the bilateral driver ideas have fallen by the wayside in favour of the dual rail ideas...I think we are on the right track, but considering that these have formed the basis of the sustainiac devices and several other commercial designs, and that rail designs seemed to have been phased out of production, that we are having so much success with the concept... Why does our experimentation revolve around 32 gauge wire? Does anyone know the gauge and impedance of a commercial sustainer? Well, I am at fault there I guess...I tried thinner and thicker designs, thin and tall but only the 0.2 guage worked well for me. Others also varied the formula and had little success, so this has become an important part of the "thin driver" designs pioneered on this thread. There are reasons- the amount of current that a wire can carry; the number or turns for a given resistance; the resonant frequency of a coil...we are not in a position to be very specific about why, other than experimentation shows us that it is so! The caveat is that with new designs like parrallel coils and multiple coils, this may not necerssarily be the best formula for these applications. A case in point is my hex driver designs, these used very fine wires that destroyed themselves under the current put out by the LM386. The secret to their survival was the heatsinking provided by the metalic epoxy mix they were set into, insid an aluminium outer casing. As for the ebow, this is only trying to driver a single string, so all the energy is being run into a coil from the same amp, not devided by six and the spaces between the strings as in sustainer designs we are working with...they also don't need a preamp, cause the dedicated driver pickup is matched to the impedance of the circuit (using even finer wire) and no loading occurs as it is not connected to the guitar circuitry at all. Given this, it will work for that design (apparently very well) and you can get away with a lot more in this application. At the very start of this thread, a lot of my designs were single string drivers, my first one which was very small, bounced the string right of the fretboard and had an amazing effect...extended to a sustainer though, you don't get the same response for the reasons above, and because you need to fix it in one place and deal with EMI problems associated with sharing the ground with the guitar, loading and pickup/driver proximity issues... Anyway, enough from me for now...it might be time to rebuild the circuit again and see if you can get it working right with the speaker...good luck... pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
col Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 ... Good advice, ground loops and such could also cause you problems perhaps, if it doesn't work with a speaker, then the driver will never work...so look into this problem until you can get it to work as an amp... Something else to consider is faulty or damaged components. Try swapping out the transistor... Always use sockets for transistors and ICs (chips) They can easily be damaged by soldering... if you use sockets, its easy to swap them out for testing and it also means you can minimise handling - some ICs and Transistors are very sensitive to static. Don't use old electrolytic caps unless you are sure they work... electrolytics have a finite lifespan, usually in old electronic gear, it is the electrolytic caps that fail... even in valve gear, it is more often the caps than the valves. Also make double sure you have any polarised components the right way round... electrolytics again Make double sure that you have the transistor pins wired correctly - this can be tricky so you need to triple check it I have a trim pot between pins 1 and 8, should I also have a cap? What would the cap do? In the chip's data sheet a 10uF cap and some other components (see my champ circuit on the previous page or so) are specified for high gain applications such as this. Running a cap between the trim and one of these pins (1 or 8) may help to stop internal oscillations in the circuitry. The runoffgroove stuff on which the Fetzer/Ruby is based is stripped down to the bare minimum and probably works fine for an amp, but in this application, I feel it can use all the help it can get. In my guitar, I used this champ circuit slightly modified with a 100uF output cap for a higher frequency response to help the high strings along. I also used a modified prechamp kit for higher gain. This preamp uses two transistors and various filters to take out very high frequencies...takes up a little more space, and not my ideal, but it does work! I would guess that the cap is specified as part of gain control to prevent DC drift ? FWIW, I made the basic Fetzer Ruby and it worked fine... I found the gain to be much to high at all but the lowest settings on my gain knob... The Fetzer that is used as a preamp was originally designed to give good tone - which we don't need as you never hear it in our application. It was never intended to be either efficient or easy to set up.. (I'm sure it is efficient enough, but that trimpot is a big nuicance) Idealy I'd like to see the F/R replaced with a preamp, probably based on an IC with phase reversal up front for the harmonic function (ie not on the driver leads) and possibly a different amp, I am looking into a BTL amp for my next circuit...this seems to offer some advantages such as more power, less chance of ground interferance (the driver is not connected directly to the negative rail) and may address some of my pop and EMI/bypass problems/workarounds as a result. If anyone has any ideas for such a preamp, very keen to here about them... I guess a simple op-amp based preamp would work better for our purposes than the Fetzer, and also be easier to build with easier to find parts. If a dual opamp is used, then the other half could be used for basic (or more complex) harmonic mode functionality. It is interesting to see that the bilateral driver ideas have fallen by the wayside in favour of the dual rail ideas...I think we are on the right track, but considering that these have formed the basis of the sustainiac devices and several other commercial designs, and that rail designs seemed to have been phased out of production, that we are having so much success with the concept... Nobody (who is willing to share) has built a bi-lateral device yet - it baybe the best... It's also possible that it's no better, but was patentable, so more attractive as a product. I wouldn't be surprised to find that the bi-lateral configuration naturaly evens out the string balance - making the AGC circuitry less significant, therefor allowing it to be simpler and cheaper. Why does our experimentation revolve around 32 gauge wire? Does anyone know the gauge and impedance of a commercial sustainer? Well, I am at fault there I guess...I tried thinner and thicker designs, thin and tall but only the 0.2 guage worked well for me. Others also varied the formula and had little success, so this has become an important part of the "thin driver" designs pioneered on this thread. There are reasons- the amount of current that a wire can carry; the number or turns for a given resistance; the resonant frequency of a coil...we are not in a position to be very specific about why, other than experimentation shows us that it is so! The caveat is that with new designs like parrallel coils and multiple coils, this may not necerssarily be the best formula for these applications... My instinct when I suggested the parallel wired coils was that its all about mass of copper, for any power level/impedence there is an optimum, too little and you get wastage through heat.. too much and you don't generate enough flux - or its not focussed enough or somthing.... its all pretty hazy, but - my suggestion seems (so far) to have been born out so far by your best single core driver being about 7.5 ohm (IIRC)... and Juáns best dual/parallel driver being 2 x 13.5 ohm.... I calculated the length of wire needed using the guages you both used, and the mass of copper is very similar in both setups... a coincidence ? maybe. @FlashBandit - did you build your circuit using strip board or plain matrix board ? If it was strip board, it should be pretty simple to swap out components until you have found the problem one(s) Before you do though - Double, Triple and Quadruple check your build layout, component orientation and soldering. And make sure that the boards earth is getting a good earth connection when in use (e.g. to the earth on your guitar cable via the Jack socket) cheers Col Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashBandit Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 And make sure that the boards earth is getting a good earth connection when in use (e.g. to the earth on your guitar cable via the Jack socket) Are you saying that this needs to be connected to earth, like in an outlet? Right now I'm testing my guitar without it being plugged into any amp (just the F/R), and therefore it isn't grounded to my house's ground. Is that causing my problems? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
col Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 And make sure that the boards earth is getting a good earth connection when in use (e.g. to the earth on your guitar cable via the Jack socket) Are you saying that this needs to be connected to earth, like in an outlet? Right now I'm testing my guitar without it being plugged into any amp (just the F/R), and therefore it isn't grounded to my house's ground. Is that causing my problems? Testing with a speaker should be fine as long as the circuits earth and the speakers earth are both connected to the battery negative terminal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onelastgoodbye Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 Well, I can't get my agc to work with the little gem and I have no idea where to start troubleshooting... what i've done is connect the output to the input of the little gem (the basic ruby, no preamp or filtering); connect the two grounds (which is also signal ground); and connect both circuits to +9v (diagram for the acg says 6v, but according to the datasheet of the tda 7284, it should be able to take 9v, though this does increase output voltage, so maybe I'm overloading the little gem). I'm basically getting static, the pot on the preamp (is it supposed to be linear or audio taper?) controls the pitch of the static, the pot on the little gem controls the volume (obviously). Anything I'm obviously doing wrong here? Note that this with an active emg running @18v. The little gem works well enough on it's own, as it always has, but come to think of it, it is near maximum gain (pins 1 and 8 bridged)...probably too much. The coil is also shaking quite heavily so that might be it. any and all help welcome. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zfrittz6 Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 (edited) onelastgoodbye Prueba esto: El circuito esta mal diseñado. Fallos: pin 5 tda7384 no esta bien conectado pin 6 r1--2k2 pin 7 falta c-100uf y r--56k hasta pin 5 pin 8- r-3 no esta bien conectada etc. falta r-10k a masa en la salida. r-6 500k cambiar 10k Son muchos errores hazlo de nuevo siguiendo el esquema que te pongo Hazlo en stereo y un canal se utiliza para el sustainer y el otro se puede utilizar como compresor; es una idea. Saludos Edited May 15, 2007 by zfrittz6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primal Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 Does anyone have a working, single sided PCB layout for the fetzer/ruby amp? I've etched two of my own design so far, and for whatever reason it doesn't seem to be working. EDIT: Never mind, a closer inspection of the schematic and PCB layout over at runoffgroove.com shows that its the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truth_David Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 onelastgoodbye Prueba esto: Try this: El circuito esta mal diseñado. The circuit is ill designed. Fallos: Errors: pin 5 tda7384 no esta bien conectado TDA7384 pin 5 is not correctly connected pin 6 r1--2k2 Pin 6 r1--2k2 pin 7 falta c-100uf y r--56k hasta pin 5 Pin 7 is missing c -100uf, and r-- 56k to pin 5 pin 8- r-3 no esta bien conectada etc. Pin 8 is not correctly connected to r-3 falta r-10k a masa en la salida. r-10k to earth missing on the output. r-6 500k cambiar 10k change r-6 from 500k to 10k Son muchos errores hazlo de nuevo siguiendo el esquema que te pongo There are many mistakes, make it again from scratch following the included schematic Hazlo en stereo y un canal se utiliza para el sustainer y el otro se puede utilizar como compresor; es una idea. Construct it in stereo and use one channel for the sustainer and the other can be used as a compressor; that's one idea. Saludos Hope this translation helps, David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalon Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Hi guys, not done much new as far as coils and circuits go's yet, not had the time, but i have installed my first sustainer, its the 2x16ohm parallel wired fullsize humbucker, running on the Ruby/Fet (with the two extra mods from Petes circuit). Here's how it looks : And: The two Switches on the body used to be coil spliters for the pickups, but i never used them, so they are now and on/off switch and Standard/Harmonic switch for the Sustainer. Im really pleased with it, and its going to be put straight to use in some music projects too. A big thanks to everyone who's working on this project, for making this possible, you all rock , and this is by no means the end of my building either, now my attentions are going to be turned to a mid driver for my other guitars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted May 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 That's fantastic Avalon, I really must congratulate you on your work and your contribution to this thread in a number of areas... Here is another one, the full sized HB driver...always been a lot of talk about it, primal made a single coil HB conversion, but this looks extremely well done. It is an interesting test as in discussions I had some doubts about the width of coils and the cores "effective width" in a dual blade driver of this size...generally people (as you have done previouslu) have gone for a SC sized HB. The success of this shows that perhaps my concerns we ill founded, again experimentation and having a go, proves the day. This also brings into question whether you could convert a conventional HB to a driver/pickup as I have done with my SC strat...possibilities... And, you are going into the mid-driver area...makes me feel that I'd better do one myself or I won't have anything more to contribute to this thread . I would be surprised if one could make a mid/driver on a 2xHB 24 fret guitar like yours without some interferance with the pickups...all I have heard of, and the patent of Hoover's (Sustainiac) are for strat type guitars. I hope to do it on my strat with HB bridge, but the distances are larger than on this type of guitar. Anyway, the quality of your work is amazing and I am sure that people will be keen to know how you made your bobbins so neat, the blade material, and how you mounted the driver, etc. You may wish to do a tutorial with pictures along the way of one of your next projects... Im really pleased with it, and its going to be put straight to use in some music projects too. A big thanks to everyone who's working on this project, for making this possible, you all rock , and this is by no means the end of my building either, now my attentions are going to be turned to a mid driver for my other guitars. I look forward to hearing what musical use you put it to and your future efforts. A big thank you to you and everyone else who has had a go at this and contributed their own refinements along the way, and of course, stimulated discussion for so long... pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalon Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Well i've been having a ball with it this afternoon, im currently working on a track called "Rockin In The Free World" (G3 style version) with a few friends, and its just excellent, its working better now then it did in testing too. Between standard and Harmonic mode, there are no dead spots at all, the harmonic mode is working on 5 of the 6 strings now too (it didn't work that well at all in testing), its just the G string which it doesn't fully work on (open to 14th fret'ish) in harmonic mode, but i can certainly live with that. As for its construction, the cores are 2mm x 56mm steel cores, 2 x 16 ohm coils wired in parallel, made with 0.16 guage wire (38 SWG), made basically as two 16ohm single coil drivers, then i joined them together after winding. The bobbings are a top and bottom made from 1mm plastic, slotted to size and length of the core (quite a nice tight fit), then glued to the core with super glue, leaving a nice 2mm tall gap for the coil to be wound in. Once they were wound (set nicely, and fully tested), i sprayed them Black, sanded the paint back off the blades once it was dry (more for visual effect then anything), then mounted it on a bent up piece of aluminum sheet, which forms the backing plate & mounting plate, and was basically the same as the plate on the pickup that came out of it, and it uses the old pickups springs and screws. To fix the magnets to the cores, and the driver to the backing plate, i used Evo stick, which seems to have done the job nicely. Final results are very pleasing indeed As for the mid drivers, im not sure i'll have a great deal of sucess on my main guitar, as the pickups are very close together, and seem to be very sencitive the drivers (its fitted with Dimarzio Fred & Paf Pro), where as the other guitar is fitted with a HS3 and a YJM, in the bridge and neck, has alot of spare room inbetween, and don't seem to mind the drivers half as much. So this is where the real fun begins , but with Cols circuit and some decently wound Dual Rails, who knows, maybe its possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted May 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Again, fantastic work, and a fantastic description of how you went about it, a few more observations and questions in the quote below... Well i've been having a ball with it this afternoon, im currently working on a track called "Rockin In The Free World" (G3 style version) with a few friends, and its just excellent, its working better now then it did in testing too. That's what it is all about... The system does work much better once installed in the guitar. Testing that the thing works is essential, by holding the driver above the fretboard away from the pickups, but in this position it does tend to spray it's EMI a lot further. Between standard and Harmonic mode, there are no dead spots at all, the harmonic mode is working on 5 of the 6 strings now too (it didn't work that well at all in testing), its just the G string which it doesn't fully work on (open to 14th fret'ish) in harmonic mode, but i can certainly live with that. Strange, 'cause my G is very responsive in the lower frets, and even in normal mode, below the 7th fret, morphs to a harmonic over time (probably due to my 100uF output cap, treble bias mod to the circuit, and driving it hard with a powerful preamp, and the spiky single coil bridge pickup in the strat...) Harmonic mode can be a little more inconsistant than normal. It works by dampening the fundumental frequencies and leaving the harmonic frequencies to be driven. This can mean that it lacks a little power in this mode and, because harmonic frequencies are faster and closer together, will be prone to problems at various points along the strings length due to the driver's position. It also may be associated with the pickups frequency response, better harmonic response may come by adjusting the bridge pickup closer to the strings overall, or problem strings like your G...could be worth experimenting with... As for its construction, the cores are 2mm x 56mm steel cores, 2 x 16 ohm coils wired in parallel, made with 0.16 guage wire (38 SWG), made basically as two 16ohm single coil drivers, then i joined them together after winding. The bobbings are a top and bottom made from 1mm plastic, slotted to size and length of the core (quite a nice tight fit), then glued to the core with super glue, leaving a nice 2mm tall gap for the coil to be wound in. Ahhh...so, we have tested a thinner guage wire with more turns in parrallel, nice one. You have them down to 2mm thick (like col's), how wide are they (do they completely fill the bobbin?) and roughly how many turns do you think. Once they were wound (set nicely, and fully tested), i sprayed them Black, sanded the paint back off the blades once it was dry (more for visual effect then anything), then mounted it on a bent up piece of aluminum sheet, which forms the backing plate & mounting plate, and was basically the same as the plate on the pickup that came out of it, and it uses the old pickups springs and screws. So, are these wound with PVA wood glue type stuff like mine...what did you use for potting? To fix the magnets to the cores, and the driver to the backing plate, i used Evo stick, which seems to have done the job nicely. Final results are very pleasing indeed It looks fantastic...a lot of your success is in part to your skill in the arts and crafts, top notch construction. A terrific description of how you did it to get a professional looking job, not like my long winded explanations that can intimidate people... As for the mid drivers, im not sure i'll have a great deal of sucess on my main guitar, as the pickups are very close together, and seem to be very sencitive the drivers (its fitted with Dimarzio Fred & Paf Pro), where as the other guitar is fitted with a HS3 and a YJM, in the bridge and neck, has alot of spare room inbetween, and don't seem to mind the drivers half as much. Yes, very close pickups on these types of guitars may well be a problem, at least at this stage of development. The way things are going with the experimentation and implementing of ideas, who knows, perhaps it is possible... So this is where the real fun begins , but with Cols circuit and some decently wound Dual Rails, who knows, maybe its possible. Certainly a mid driver is possible and holds many benefits...the main one being the simplified installation and wiring due to no longer needing to bypass the pickups...it would be just like installing on a single pickup guitar, once the mid pickup is removed and an alternate switching system is decided upon for the now two pickup guitar (that's what I'm looking at now...) I'm sure we'll all be pleased to see how you go with col's circuit. I am sure you could patch it in in front of the F/R circuit in place of the lm386 one, if you wanted to test it out on this guitar BTW. I think the mid driver is just a matter of construction, you look like the best candidate to make it happen in the short term. so go for it!!! Other than this, and the endless refinement of the device, I guess the remote box idea comes back as a possibility. One of the main problems with the box idea was that it required a lot of wires to and from the controls and the driver in installation. Most of this associated with the bypassing of other pickups. A mid driver or single pickup guitar removes this necessity and the box could provide some with the potential to try this without drilling holes for switches and providing space for circuitry and easy battery access...if it could be built as cool as some of Tim's designs (back in the page 30's), it could even be a preferable solution... Oh yes, and the bass sustainer, oh and the seven string sustainer, oh and the ultra small/thin surface mounted sustainer... pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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