Seeking Hot New Pickup!?

[GibsonSG86]

Hi all im a new member to this forum so bear with me here. I want to know a lil bit about the line of available humbucking pickups out there. Currently I have a Gibson SG special w/ wine red mahogany body and stock Alnico Humbucking pickups in the bridge and neck position. However recently I've been having the urge to transform my axe into something a lil bit more of a soloists instrument. I play alot of metal and use various dropped tunings. Right now I have my axe equipped with GHS TNT guitar boomers so I get better definition of notes in these dropped tunings. I play rhythm and lead though and sometimes I have the urge to just shred out every note I can but these pickups don't seem to be cutting it cause I can never get those fast tapping solos to sound like bliztkrieg or whatever. Before I bought my SG I learned about sustainers and after shopping around I bought a Jackson with a duncan designed sustainer unit, I believe the company was called Sustaniac. Well anyway to make a long story short I returned that axe which had everything going for it but it had that stupid floyd rose tremolo unit and I couldn't tune the thing for beans. I traded that in and got my SG special which has a lovely body and a nice low tone when the rhythm pickup is active. Boy do I love this guitar but there are a few major gripes like the fact that it doesn't have that cool tremolo bar like the Jackson had for those amazing EVH dive bombs and also it doesn't have the sustainer... :-( ... How I miss that thing. Ok so if anybody has any idea what pickups i should be looking at im open for suggestions...I heard alotta good things about Seymour Duncan and EMG particulary the Dimebucker and the EMG 81. Well anyway which one has better sustain. I also was hearing good things about the Dimarzio Evolution that Steve Vai uses...hmm...choices, choices, choices. Boy I don't wanna bore you guys, so lastly I'd like some advice on installing a tremolo bar on the Gibson SG. Your comments are greatly appreciated.

[Librero]

First off, it would be nice to chop your post into several paragraphs for easier reading.

I've used a DiMarzio Evolution and an Air Zone quite a bit. They're both very good high-output humbuckers. Their sound don't lose definition when playing lower notes, which is a plus for detuned guitars. Between the two. I prefer the Air Zone more right now. I've also played guitars with a Tone Zone and an SD Distortion Trembucker and have no complaints.

Right now, I want to go ahead and order a pair of Bill Lawrence L-500's for a custom guitar. That ought to be interesting.

[GibsonSG86]

Thank You for your reply Librero. If there are anymore comments or reccomendations I would love to hear your advice. Sadly after going to Guitar Center a place where you figure someone would have some sort of basic knowledge about this subject, I was dissapointed to find out that none of their sales reps. or employees working in the guitar section had any knowledge about my problem. They couldn't even tell me which guitars had which humbuckers I was interested in so I could hear their sound. I will return there today, hopefully I will be able to get more help this time.

[LukeR]

You know... I personally dont like 'hot pickups'- i think if you get a GOOD set of alnico pickups, you will get a great sound- maybe add a decent overdrive pedal? I know that you say that you are looking for a 'hot' pickup; I have bought MANY over the years- to me, they always sounded 'fizzy' when distorted (which was nice), but TERRIBLE when used clean. THe absolute WORST pickup I ever bought was the 'Hot' Seymour Duncan P90- basically, it was an overwound P90, with ceramic magnets. It was noisy, and sounded terrible.

Eruption by Van Halen is an example of a good sounding alnico pickup (to my ears) you could check that out, if you are interetsed in hearing the tone.

I am not saying that all high Output pickups are horrible, but i play an SG myself (which had all the above pickups in it at different stages) through my modded JCM900, and for me, it was like night and day. To me, High Gain pickups have a tendancy to sound a bit 2 dimentional, whereas Alnico seems MUCH more versatile.

Obviously, it is up to you, but please at least check out some decent paf type pickups using a high gain amp/pedal setting before you spend up- if you dont like it, thats cool, but I would be highly suprised if you preffered the 'hot' pickups.

Honestly, I have found far better results using a Paf and a High gain amp than using a High gain pickup with an intermediate gain setting.

Hope thats another aspect for you to consider (even though i have suggested the opposite of what you wanted to know

Cheers man,

Luke

[GibsonSG86]

Interesting advice there Luke I will definitely look into these alnico pickups your mentioning. If its good enough for EVH then its good enough for me I guess...lol. Keep those replies coming. Thanks!

[GibsonSG86]

Ahh **** I just remembered. I really want some suggestion about installing the pickups. I know I can't do this on my own cause I have no clue when it comes to electronics and wiring so I'd much rather have a professional tech install it. When I went to Guitar Center they said it was 50 dollars to install one pickup and 70 dollars for two, which seems like a decent deal but I was wondering if it was smarter to have the pickups installed in a private store. Im pretty sure its a better idea though to at least buy the pickups at a commercial retail chain such as Guitar Center or Sam Ash cause they do price matching and all that.

[mushy the shroom]

Welcome to the forum! In my opinion, the Bill Lawrence L-500XL is the ultimate lead pickup, but the clean tone isn't all that great. You can install a sustainiac in a humbucker space, alongside a single coil, or mini-humbucker. As for the wiring, if you are going to install the sustainiac, you're going to need some wiring knowledge, but if you were to just replace the pickups, all you would need is a soldering gun, solder, and a wire code for each pickup. Very easy stuff. I know that www.musiciansfriend.cm sells pickups, and www.billlawrence.com sells the L-500XL. Good luck!

[Librero]

To me, High Gain pickups have a tendancy to sound a bit 2 dimentional, whereas Alnico seems MUCH more versatile.

hmmm.... This doesn't make a lot of sense. There are high-output alnico pickups, such as the Dimarzio Ar Zone and Tone Zone.

If you're making a comparison between ceramics and alnicos, here's an interesting quote from Bill Lawrence's website:

When I read that ceramic magnets sound harsh and alnico magnets sound sweet, I ask myself, " Who the hell preaches such nonsense?" There are harsh-sounding pickups with alnico magnets and sweet-sounding pickups with ceramic magnets and vice-versa! A magnet by itself has no sound, and as a part of a pickup, the magnet is simply the source to provide the magnetic field for the strings. The important factor is the design of a magnetic circuit which establishes what magnet to use.

If you're using VH's Eruption sound as a model, then can I assume that you're recommending a PAF-style humbucker?

[Nalo1022]

I have a L-500 and i tihnk the clean sound is nice...just back off the tone a lil bit add some reverba dn bam youve got some nice sound but i will agree that it is one of the best lead pickups ever....and if im correct wasnt it what dime bag used and SD ripped off to make the dimebucker?

[AlGeeEater]

I love my Seymour Duncan Distortions. They are what you call "hot". They are very good sounding, and i would always recomend them.

Chris

[Nalo1022]

if you need the pickups NOW id say go for a SD, but if you want a great sound pickup that is a great price go with a Bill Lawrence L-500xl but i do know that the wait can sometimes be a while but thats what you get when you order great pickups like bills

Edited January 16, 2005 by Nalo1022

[Jivin]

I have to agree with Librero a bit here...

Though I actually agree a lot of high-output humbuckers sound a little 2-dimensional (not that I dont appreciate the mountains of difference between some of them), but thats what they are there for! If you want a pickup that will handle your average distortion as well as nicer clean tones, the Seymour Duncan JB seems to please a LOT of people, not to mention how many guitars it seems to come standard in. However, if you want a searing, crushing, awesomely heavy kickass mother of a pickup, you woudln't want it for playing jazz would you, and chances are unless you place very unreasonable expectations on your specialised equipement, you probably wouldnt be THAT finicky about the quality of clean tones from said pickup.

If you want a metal pickup, the ones you listed at the beginning are a great place to start, and I suggest you stick to those sorts of pickups. They may not be EMG or Seymour Duncan, but I own a range of GFS pickups, and I can say that as they get higher in output (distortion, mega distortion ect ect), the clean tones DO suffer, however, for even the most monster distortion (except maybe the invader style one), with the right EQ changes on my effects board I can coax a clean sound thats more than suitable for any clean tones I would want to use within a heavy rock/metal context.

If wanted something else, I would use one of my other guitars that have less beefy pickups.

Good luck, let us know what you choose in the end!

- Dan

PS: I should elaborate; I have heard that the Duncan JB is actually a quite nice pickup for both handling clean and distorted tones, maybe leaning a -fraction- toward the distorted tones, so if your a bit hesitant on going all out high-output, then you should check it out.

[donbenjy]

well i havn't had alot of experince with a wide range of pickups, but as for the trem unit you wanted...aside from drilling a new cavity into the guitar and buying a non-floating trem unit (like a floyd rose, but no locking nut or fine tuners so you can play drop tunings easily...like the one on a strat) which would be a tad expensive just for a whammy bar IMHO. You could also get a bigsby installed, search on google for images, you find them alot in gretsch guitars, but TBH i really dont like the design and wouldn't want one of those things on my axe but to be fair its the best kinda tremolo unit you can have. Either way you're gonna have to replace the stock bridge

[blackburncustomguitars]

Thank You for your reply Librero.  If there are anymore comments or reccomendations I would love to hear your advice.  Sadly after going to Guitar Center a place where you figure someone would have some sort of basic knowledge about this subject, I was dissapointed to find out that none of their sales reps. or employees working in the guitar section had any knowledge about my problem.  They couldn't even tell me which guitars had which humbuckers I was interested in so I could hear their sound.  I will return there today, hopefully I will be able to get more help this time.

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I would STRONGLY consider the Gibson 496r (neck) and 500t (bridge) pickups. They are extremely powerful and, if you dial them back, can also be used clean. My customers love them. Peace.

[crafty]

I would strongly consider taking the SG back and getting back the Jackson with the Sustainiac. Here's why:

1. It has all the electronics you want.

2. It has a Floyd Rose-style bridge. If you want to dive-bomb, nothing works better than the FR. Take an hour and learn to tweak and tune it, and you'll be okay.

3. You won't have to spend the money upgrading the pickups. The cost for those Dimarzios is usually about $59-$69. You would nearly double that with installation, and forget about trading in the stock pickups. I'd be willing to bet that the Sustainer installation will cost much more than just $50, and if you don't like the sales staff at the store, chances are the techs won't be much better, even if it is a national chain.

4. There is no good, stable tremolo bridge for the SG. Nothing nearly as good as the FR or even a Wilkinson with locking tuners. You may be able to find a Kahler, but it's just as complicated as an FR and it will probably need to be rebuilt.

Sounds to me like you were more satisfied with the Jackson than the SG. Yes, FR bridges are a pain to work with, but it's either that or go out of tune with heavy use of the whammy. The SG is never going to sound like that Jackson, no matter what you do to it.

BTW, have you tried the Fernandes guitars? They were one of the first to develop a reliable and easy to use sustainer system, so much so that when people retrofit a system into their guitar, 90% of the time it's a Fernandes system. Even EVH uses a Wolfgang equipped with a Fernandes Sustainer and a Steinberger Trans-Trem!