westhemann Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 Whatever did as you say happen to innocent before proven guilty. but the auction proved you guilty,whether through intent or ignorance it does not matter in the least,as far as calling you on it goes. and i posted what i posted on my own,without any intention of ganging up...only intending to straighten you out. maybe it could have been handled in a more diplomatic manner,BUT...considering the outright flaunting of guys eager to break the law on this forum lately...and a general "who cares about fraud" attitude shown by many,then maybe you could YOURSELF be a little more understanding of the reason for my tone,rather than lashing out like a wounded bear,and then taking your ball and threatening to go home(to steal a couple of lame sayings). anyway...as my boss always said..."let's just move forward from here,and try not to let it happen again" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 Let me explain my posts dude, as you may not understand the background to it.... You, and Aussie, are trying to fraudulently sell a guitar on Ebay, thats a fact. Sure, its a real guitar, but its not a Washburn. One the day of posting, i had a guy bring in a JEM to have a set up done. He had just bought this monstrosity off ebay (another Aussie, QLD). Homemade.... advertised as the real thing. It WAS trash, unrepairable, and i recommended he take civil action against the seller. We had another Aussie on here last week arguing that EXACT replicas of guitars, including adding the labels, decals, logos, etc, and all fine to do. This is happening MORE AND MORE. Im sure you can now understand why im curt with my posts, ESPECIALLY since ive already had this FRAUD tried out with my own brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKGBass Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 The posts in this thread for the majority are a complete waste of space. I'm sorry if any of you feel otherwise, but I feel truly offended when there's 4 pages of jargon in the "In Progress and Finished" section and no pictures of the guitar, save the ones in said ebay auction. Secondly I'm rather disappointed the the moderator involved, and other experienced parties are posting in this thread bashing, complaining, and speaking their grievances in a manner in which I think would not be condoned by them if they weren't themselves a part of it. It's simply childish how often this kind of thing happens around here. Let the man deal with it on his own. Lit him reap his own consequences, instead of patronizing through the face of a computer like you have the right to do so in the first place. God, what hypocrisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesmortdansant Posted February 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 (edited) but the auction proved you guilty,whether through intent or ignorance it does not matter in the least,as far as calling you on it goes. BUT...considering the outright flaunting of guys eager to break the law on this forum lately ← Ok so basically your telling me that you have never unintentionally in your life done anything wrong? Your saying that I'm a criminal for being nieve ( spelling ) in my actions? I find that hard to believe unless your just perfect and dont make mistakes. At least give a guy the credit for doing the right thing once he is informed that he is going about things the wrong way. have I not now retracted the auction? If I had any serious intention of being Dishonest would I have done that? If there is a lot of this going on then why not have a go at those people whom are seriously involved in fraudulent deals. That I agree with. However dont crucify the one guy who did try and do the right thing and try looking at all the facts next time. As soon as I knew there was a problem I pulled the ad. As soon as you guys started my alarm bells went off and I sorted it out IMMIDIATELY, so give me a break ok. Not everyone out there is a criminal. If you DO have a lot of people on here as you say that are eager to break the laws go talk to them about it. Do I have any markings on the guitar to say its a washburn? NO. Do I have serial numbers? NO. Is there people on THIS FORUM WHO DO?????? YES! Rhodes I apologise for being annoyed. I didnt honestly know this type of thing goes on and if I were in your shoes I would have been as pissed as you were. No hard feelings and good on ya. Edited February 9, 2005 by Lesmortdansant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeR Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 I would like to remind you that civil liability is on the balance of probabilities, NOT beyond reasonable doubt. Luke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesmortdansant Posted February 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 (edited) I would like to remind you that civil liability is on the balance of probabilities, NOT beyond reasonable doubt. Luke ← ahhh for goodness sake grow up would you this is rediculous. I couldnt care less about the mass intention, only my own don't you get it?????? Which was NOT dishonourable you fool. Oh and by the way you want to preach about the law??? Talk to me I'm a commercial business lawyer who has been practising for 15 years now. So please throw me your questions and i'll answer them. I did the wrong thing and rectified it so look mate you wanna be the big I AM without any nuts go ahead and continue cos people like you who try to stoke the fires only makes things worse. Try READING the comments I have posted and then using an OBJECTIVE MIND come back to me. firstly prove intent. " Intent is classifiend as deliberately misleeding with knowledge of intent to mislead the consumer into a fraudulent transaction. If however the person subsequently discovers his or her actions to be misleading he or she is required to remove any offending material at such time immidiately ". and your next extremely clever and informed argument is? Edited February 9, 2005 by Lesmortdansant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeR Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 Talk to me I'm a commercial business lawyer who has been practising for 15 years now No you are NOT. ANY person with even the most MINIMAL legal training and experience would be aware of the most BASIC principles of fraudulent mis-rep. 15 years of practice without even haveing a BASIC concept of such things? Like a policeman who doesnt know what handcuffs are. I fell the need to justify how/why/ what my legal background is- most people I know around here know it anyway If you interpretted my post as an insult, or flame bait, then I appologise. Maybe i should have said it in a PM. As I stated 'I WOULD LIKE TO REMIND YOU' - Im actually tring to help YOU out- its neither here nor there to me. you wanna be the big I AM without any nuts Thats just being plain offensive. Maybe you should also READ THE RULES ABOUT POSTING before you go about insulting people. Anyway, enough of this rubbish (sorry for venting guys) Luke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesmortdansant Posted February 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 (edited) whatever luke tell you what bring an action against me and lets see who wins ok. Were talking about a guitar here which at no time actually stated it WAS an original Washburn. The reason i put that on there was to attract buyers I agree and again I agree in hindsight the description may be misleading which is why it was A modified to state it was not an original washburn and then pulled by myself . good luck. by the way were talking real world here not law world and if you have any knowledge of the legal system you will know the difference between the two. There is a big gap there which I do ( my apologies for again rebuffung you ) tackle on a day to day business. Think about it, if I seriously thought I would jepardise number one my ebay rating which has been accumilated over 2 years or number 2 my reputation in the community and possibly lose my profession what do you think would be more important?? Now get a life go back to college and learn your facts properly. PLEASE. You did frankly annoy me with your original post which is why I'm now talking to you with all guns blazing. you wanna play then fine play away. just dont blame me when you get burned. I'm innocent in this apart from the fact that I was nieve if you cant get over that then thats your problem. Ive stated my case and any further comments from you fine see you in court. im seriously not in the mood to tolerate it. Edited February 9, 2005 by Lesmortdansant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeR Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 You did frankly annoy me with your original post which is why I'm now talking to you with all guns blazing. you wanna play then fine play away. just dont blame me when you get burned. No thank you, Im not going to bite.Although, the above does remind meof that Malmsteen incident on the aeroplane- "You have released released the f___ n' fury!", haha ...and any further comments from you fine see you in court. And what, do you propose, will be your Cause of Action? You DO know its illegal to make threats of litigation whithout any basis, do you? Of course you do, what with 15 years of practice behind you... Have a nice life! Luke (Wes, maybe be this thread could be closed?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted February 9, 2005 Report Share Posted February 9, 2005 The posts in this thread for the majority are a complete waste of space. I'm sorry if any of you feel otherwise, but I feel truly offended when there's 4 pages of jargon in the "In Progress and Finished" section and no pictures of the guitar, save the ones in said ebay auction. Secondly I'm rather disappointed the the moderator involved, and other experienced parties are posting in this thread bashing, complaining, and speaking their grievances in a manner in which I think would not be condoned by them if they weren't themselves a part of it. It's simply childish how often this kind of thing happens around here. Let the man deal with it on his own. Lit him reap his own consequences, instead of patronizing through the face of a computer like you have the right to do so in the first place. God, what hypocrisy. ← it doesn't bother me at all that you feel that way..because my moderating is kept to moderating the rules.and there are no rules against civil discussions...and i have not moderated this thread yet at all.i am merely speaking as a member of the forum.if you can't see that,or the need for someone to originally speak out against a misleading auction,then your opinion means nothing to me. the thread is now starting to become less civil. lesmortestant and luke r.you need to keep the discussion leaned more towards a debate(even if it is slightly heated),and less towards an all out flame war. lesmortdansant.you misunderstand me now.you are reading anger into my last few posts when there is none now that you have done the right thing.all i have been doing in the last few posts is explaining to you the reason for my first post,and i still feel perfectly jusitified in voicing my opinion the way i did. mkg bass.debates,even heated ones,will always be allowed by me,from anyone,as long as the intent is clearly constructive.not everyone feels it necessary to take the side of every guilty party on the forum the way you do.you consistently jump in to say "shame on you" to anyone who disagrees with anyone else. well shame on you for not knowing when it is appropriate to make a stand.and for not knowing the meaning of hypocrisy or what it means to patronize. anyway...lesmortdansant.if it is still not clear,i apologize for not making my last few posts more clear...to be quite clear,i believe you now have done the right thing.i do not apologize for my first post .as i said before,it was justified. all i can say if you still do not understand is that i hope the next time someone does something YOU clearly percieve as wrong,and you have to jump in and speak your mind,that you will remember this discussion and will realize that just because we all make mistakes does not mean we don't deserve to be called out when we make that mistake.it happens to everyone,and when you do get called out,rather than lashing out,just admit your mistake,rectify it as best you can,and move on. and build more guitars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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