Mickguard Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 My plan is to remove the existing nut. Shape a piece of scrap ebony (got loads of that here these days ) and glue it in where the nut used to be. I'd glue the piece so there'd be a gap the correct size for installing a zero fret. Then I'd place the nut at the end of the ebony insert (or conceivably, I could add string guides directly into the ebony, since it'll be tall enough. Can anyone find a flaw with this idea? Would it work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marksound Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Instead of trying to leave the correct sized slot for the fret, why not just fill the gap and cut a new slot? Sounds much easier to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Instead of trying to leave the correct sized slot for the fret, why not just fill the gap and cut a new slot? Sounds much easier to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soapbarstrat Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 That's going to be one pissed-off fret, if you keep calling him a zero all the time. That's been the problem with the "zero fret" all along. Low self esteem = life of crime (stealing and pawning tuning keys, beating the other frets, putting dents in them, prostitution). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 That's going to be one pissed-off fret, if you keep calling him a zero all the time. That's been the problem with the "zero fret" all along. Low self esteem = life of crime (stealing and pawning tuning keys, beating the other frets, putting dents in them, prostitution). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwedishLuthier Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 maybe there's an issue with having no wood beneath the tang? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 maybe there's an issue with having no wood beneath the tang? I wouldn’t worry about that. There is always some space left under the tang of the fret. I would rout away any wood beyond the original nut cut-out (assuming it is fender style, otherwise skip that part). Then I would glue the extra piece of ebony in place and carefully blend the radii with the rest of the board. Just a thought. There will be visual evidence of this, as in a deeper cut slot for the first fret (don’t wont to insult him. I’ll call him the first fret). You can always solve this with a binding. If a binding is visually not working with your design, you can always do a natural wood binding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j. pierce Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 What about sticking a slice of veneer the same size as a fret slot inbetween the piece of ebony and the board when you glue it? keep it shallower than the height of the board, and even if you end up needing to deepen the resulting slot with a saw, you've got something to get you started. Personally, I'd rather re-cut a fret slot from scratch than try and get something to glue into place exactly a fret-slot's-width away from something else. But going this way should sort of be the best of both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Personally, I'd rather re-cut a fret slot from scratch than try and get something to glue into place exactly a fret-slot's-width away from something else. But going this way should sort of be the best of both. Actually, what I'll be shooting for will be a slot that's smaller than fret slot--because I'll want to widen it by taking away a little of the fretboard, I figure. That way the zero fret will end up in the proper place. Since there will be a bit of a slot already, I should be able to work a thin file/emory board in there. Well, that would be the theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tirapop Posted July 20, 2006 Report Share Posted July 20, 2006 How wide (stringwise) is the glue joint for the ebony scrap? With the fret tang wedged into that kerf, it's going to put a prying load on that glue joint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 20, 2006 How wide (stringwise) is the glue joint for the ebony scrap? With the fret tang wedged into that kerf, it's going to put a prying load on that glue joint. I'm thinking of using a piece of ebony about 5 mm wide (in the direction of the strings). I don't want it too wide, because I'll still need room for a string guide (if I don't build that into the ebony). As for the slot width-- here's what I started thinking this morning: Doesn't it make sense to glue the ebony piece with the zero fret already in place? Assuming I can figure out a way to clamp things so that the tang is properly held. I could use epoxy to hold the zero fret too. But, I'm wondering--since it's the zero fret, it will have the string pressure on it, so maybe it doesn't need to be as tightly set as the other frets, right? I can set it tight enough to hold the tang, but not so tight that the tang would exert a prying load. I don't have the link right now, but there's a company out there selling what are essentially zero frets as nut replacements. As far as I could tell, he's using what amounts to the top of the fret--i.e., without the tang. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted February 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Well, believe it our not, I actually went ahead and gone done it: Before: ...After: This is the neck project I've been working on (haven't finished sanding/shaping yet). I took the ebony fingerboard I'd ruined last year and cut off a piece of that, including the fret slot. Then I sanded down the ebony to just about the edge of the slot --the result is that the new fret fits in snugly, but not super-tight, so it won't shift at all but it'll be easy enough to replace if ever need be. And because it's not that tight, I don't see any issues with it putting pressure on the glue joint. It's also the first fret I've ever installed myself The zero fret is a jumbo, the other frets are flat vintage types, so that gives me lots of tweaking room. I'm going to add in the string guides to the front edge of that ebony piece. I'll be using string trees too, most likely, depends on whether I go ahead with my idea to modify the tuners to the EZ-lock type (in that case, the string hole will be low enough to provide the right tension I think). I'm tempted to use the string trees as the string guides, but I don't know if the spread will be right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 If you need to do something like this again: if you need the slot a precise size, I'd glue it into place with some calipers (easy to get the exact thickness with stuff calibrated by fifths of mm...) holding the thing's place. Although honestly, for all the fiddlyness involved, I'd just install a new nut, and be done with it. I'm not anti-zero fret (done one before), but I'm not really an advocate either... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted February 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 I'm not anti-zero fret (done one before), but I'm not really an advocate either... I have one guitar with a zero fret, an acoustic, I like it a lot. Of course, I'm pretty happy with my non-zero fret guitars too. Just want to give the idea a try. If for some reason I don't like it, I can remove the fret, route the slot for a Fender style nut. The caliper idea's a good one-- I could have used a feeler guage too, now that I think of it. Although this would have left a gap at the bottom of the slot--the way it is now, there's no gap, and once the sides have been finished, you'll barely even be able to see that any surgery has been done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soapbarstrat Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 It's also the first fret I've ever installed myself And if it's the last, you'll be known all over the world as a ' one fret wonder ' . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted February 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 It's also the first fret I've ever installed myself And if it's the last, you'll be known all over the world as a ' one fret wonder ' . Naw...if nothing else, this neck project I've been working on has helped me relax a lot about the whole fretting thing (the board was a prefretted/preinlayed ebay wonder that arrived with enough problems that I got my money back). So once this one's done, I'll be ready to tackle the whole deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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