fyb Posted November 8, 2006 Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 This is probably a noob question but . . . Could you make a scarf jointed neck with different woods for the neck and the headstock? On one hand, it seems that it could work because wood glue is supposed to make a stronger joint than the original wood itself. I've also heard though that glue joints between different woods aren't as strong as those between similar pieces, but people glue rosewood to maple and mahogany (for example) all the time for fretboards. That do you think?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted November 8, 2006 Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 This is probably a noob question but . . . Could you make a scarf jointed neck with different woods for the neck and the headstock? On one hand, it seems that it could work because wood glue is supposed to make a stronger joint than the original wood itself. I've also heard though that glue joints between different woods aren't as strong as those between similar pieces, but people glue rosewood to maple and mahogany (for example) all the time for fretboards. That do you think?? As far as the joining of two different woods we do this all the time so it is possible. As far as wood glue joints being stranger than the wood around them. This is not a given. I see people post that glue joints are stronger than the surrounding wood. It can be, but that joint has to be made properly for that to happen. Wood glue has to get good penetration(glue needs to be forced down into the fibers and pores), but not so much that you get a dry joint and lose the connection(endgrain can suck up glue and cause this situation, and too much pressure can also starve a joint). You can also have issues with wood that has a wet surface basically shielding the glue from getting good penetration. So a very dense wood or oily wood needs more pressure to force the glue in getting that penetration vs a less dense wood. Again you have to be careful because a less dense wood joint can become starved if you use too much pressure. These are things to think about if you choose to join a very dense or oily wood to a lower density wood. As an exptream example; you would have a bear of a time glueing Lignum Vitae with Balsa. Most of the woods we use can be joined just fine, but it is smart to pay attension to what you are doing(especially on a critical joint like a scarf). I think the idea is a cool one and could look great. Give it a shot. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fyb Posted November 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 This is probably a noob question but . . . Could you make a scarf jointed neck with different woods for the neck and the headstock? On one hand, it seems that it could work because wood glue is supposed to make a stronger joint than the original wood itself. I've also heard though that glue joints between different woods aren't as strong as those between similar pieces, but people glue rosewood to maple and mahogany (for example) all the time for fretboards. That do you think?? As far as the joining of two different woods we do this all the time so it is possible. As far as wood glue joints being stranger than the wood around them. This is not a given. I see people post that glue joints are stronger than the surrounding wood. It can be, but that joint has to be made properly for that to happen. Wood glue has to get good penetration(glue needs to be forced down into the fibers and pores), but not so much that you get a dry joint and lose the connection(endgrain can suck up glue and cause this situation, and too much pressure can also starve a joint). You can also have issues with wood that has a wet surface basically shielding the glue from getting good penetration. So a very dense wood or oily wood needs more pressure to force the glue in getting that penetration vs a less dense wood. Again you have to be careful because a less dense wood joint can become starved if you use too much pressure. These are things to think about if you choose to join a very dense or oily wood to a lower density wood. As an exptream example; you would have a bear of a time glueing Lignum Vitae with Balsa. Most of the woods we use can be joined just fine, but it is smart to pay attension to what you are doing(especially on a critical joint like a scarf). I think the idea is a cool one and could look great. Give it a shot. Peace,Rich Good info Rich. I was thinking of building a double cut LP type (special is it?) with some P90s, and I was thinking of doing the main part of the neck out of maple (maybe some birdseye that I have lying around anyway) and using either sapele or mahogany for the body and headstock. I thought this could be cool if I could pull it off . . . What do you think about bonding maple and mahogany or sapele? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batfink Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Palm Bay, a British shredder company from the 90's used to scarf Mahogany headstocks to Maple necks as standard and although rare guitars at the best of times i've had a couple and know of a few people who have / had them and never any reported problems. Jem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneMonkey Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Over time glue joints will become weaker than the surrounding wood (providing that the wood is in good condition). This is because glue remains a liquid, albeit a very think one, and is subject to creep. fyb - I have some Les Paul DC plans if you want them. If you drop me a line I'll email them to you. My PM's aren't working so you'll need to post your email address here. But if your in the UK, I'll send you some paper copies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 What do you think about bonding maple and mahogany or sapele? I have never really had any problems with those woods. Just be sure your surfaces mate very well. The better they mate the easier it is to get the force applied to the glue without having it squeeze out(limiting the pressure on the glue). More problematic woods would be like Cocobolo, Rosewoods and so forth glued to low density woods (in my case say Red Cedar or Spruce). Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egdeltar Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Im working on a flamemaple/purpleheart/walnut/purpleheart/flamemaple lam neck w/ a purple heart headstock right now. Havent had any problems thus far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Sorbera Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 I did a coco neck with bubinga headstock it the joint worked out fine. It's nice and tight to this day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fyb Posted November 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 Over time glue joints will become weaker than the surrounding wood (providing that the wood is in good condition). This is because glue remains a liquid, albeit a very think one, and is subject to creep. fyb - I have some Les Paul DC plans if you want them. If you drop me a line I'll email them to you. My PM's aren't working so you'll need to post your email address here. But if your in the UK, I'll send you some paper copies. I'd love some plans! You can get me at michaelkdonahue@gmail.com Thanks ToneMonkey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneMonkey Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 Check your inbox dude Over time glue joints will become weaker than the surrounding wood (providing that the wood is in good condition). This is because glue remains a liquid, albeit a very think one, and is subject to creep. I think that I should point out that this is over a VERY LONG time. The same sort of time that it takes a window to get thicker at the bottom than at the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fyb Posted November 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 Check your inbox dude Over time glue joints will become weaker than the surrounding wood (providing that the wood is in good condition). This is because glue remains a liquid, albeit a very think one, and is subject to creep. I think that I should point out that this is over a VERY LONG time. The same sort of time that it takes a window to get thicker at the bottom than at the top. ThanksToneMonkey !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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