Devon8822 Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 (edited) Hey everybody, I have found useless help at other forums for refinishing and working on guitars. So I found this great forum full of genious luthiers. Hopefully i can get some help here (I have already enjoyed looking through old threads). I have looked through many tutorials and pretty much all were very undescriptive and all said different things and didnt even touch upon essential steps. They rarly even say what kind of sand paper to use, they just say sand. Anyways, down to business. I got this nice Kramer Pacer from mid to late 80s from some friend of my friend. The kid new nothing about guitars and he found it in the garbage, a perfect Kramer. Anyways, the kid took it apart and just scraped the surface in one or two spots uselesslywith sand paper. He wanted to refinish it. So I had to refinish it because of what it was like at that point (all scraped up surface from a bit of sandpaper).I wouldnt have refinished it if it paint wasnt already destroyed. Anyways, I bought it off him for 20 bucks (should be worth 500 - 600 when I fix it up). So thats the story of how i got it. Now for what I have already done to it. I have so far sanded most of it down. Still needs some work. I have discovered that it has a veneer. I dont really know much about that and hopefully you guys can from the pictures tell me whats going on with this guitar. I was told it is a maple veneer with an alder body. Newways, in these pictures you can see that where the cutouts are the wood is darker. I dont know why? Should I sand that down? What kinds of wood is it? Should I sand the veneer right off? Whats the advatages of doing that? I just need to know what to do with the sanding, what i should sand? and I need to knwo whats goign on with the wood. Its darker in the cututs for some reason? Ok, now I have some questions about what to do next. I need to know what grit sand paper to get and for what stages? I dumbfully realized after i had already sanded down to wood that i didnt acctually need to go all the way to wood. Its to late now. So far I have done the sanding with 50 grit sandpaper. How many grit stages do i need before the next step. Would it be something like 50 grit, than 250 grit, than 600 grit, than 900, than 1600 wet sanding? I dont even know if you are supposed to wet sand a guitar before painting? Mybe it depends on the wood? yeah so what grit is the grit i need to sand it with before next step, which would be something like sanding filler, some coat or something, I have yet to figure that out. But, for now what grit is the last one before the next step? and do i need to wet sand? Are there any other details about sanding I should know? Hopefully I can get help here as I work through it. Thanks, here are the pics. http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/5869/imgp1784ng2.jpg http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/4619/imgp1787ot9.jpg http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/4305/imgp1789xz6.jpg http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/4279/imgp1790oc1.jpg http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/2711/imgp1793yb4.jpg http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/1361/imgp1794vn8.jpg http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/4001/imgp1777da8.jpg Edited November 10, 2006 by Devon8822 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desopolis Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 ok.. first I dont see a veneer.. maybe Im blind but the tummy cut and arm rest match the top and back for grain... as far as paper goes, I dont even use 50. I start at 100. fine sand at 250, then 320, then 400. 250 is enough for paint, after that you can go higher. also, after your first link change the tags to URLs that way you dont get yelled at and the 56K crew can view em... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon8822 Posted November 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 I didnt see a veneer at first either until i was told by a lot of people that there was. look at the lines on the bottom of the guitar on one of the pics. I also, dont get why the wood where the cutouts are is the same grain except when i got past the last paint layer it was white all over the guita and dark brown where the cutouts where... and also in some places I even sanded past the veneer and just got to the wood underneath. Can anyone tell me what kind of wood it is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon8822 Posted November 12, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2006 Can I get some help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uv777 Posted November 12, 2006 Report Share Posted November 12, 2006 Can I get some help? without the serial number, or neck details to go on i have to assume a couple of things. according to vintagekramer.com (you should check it out) the bodies after '84 were "maple or heavier ash" i found when researching my beretta (american) project, the vintage site was invaluable. as to the veneer... my beretta looked similar to the pictures you've posted. and it did have a veneer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon8822 Posted November 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 Can I get some help? without the serial number, or neck details to go on i have to assume a couple of things. according to vintagekramer.com (you should check it out) the bodies after '84 were "maple or heavier ash" i found when researching my beretta (american) project, the vintage site was invaluable. as to the veneer... my beretta looked similar to the pictures you've posted. and it did have a veneer. Yeah I checked out that site. I guess it doesnt matter what kind of would it is if it ake into consideration it can be any type so id have to be more careful with it. so after I sand it with 400 grit sandpaper what would my next step be? Grain filler? It may be maple but i dont know so should i still put on grain filler? if so what kind? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uv777 Posted November 13, 2006 Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 i would use grain filler. i use stewmac waterbase grain filler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon8822 Posted November 23, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2006 Ok here is my plan so far for this: -Sand the paint of to the veneer ending in 400 or 500 grit andpaper - puting on stewmac waterbased grain filler, BTW I heard oil based is better and quicker? Which one is most common and which is best? - than after the grain filler i dont know what to do next, paint? Did I miss any steps in between those? After I am done this I will work out thnext ones. I like to know what I am doing a couple steps ahead. Thanks for you help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon8822 Posted November 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2006 Well? Does that plan sound ok^^? any issue or missed steps? thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsnhavoc Posted November 27, 2006 Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 You have the steps right, you just have to decide what you want to use. You had a suggestion given to you but you don't seem so sure about it. Research them both and you choose. Also, I dont see any veneer on there, but I could be wrong. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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