screwdelulu Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 (edited) Hello all, I'm thinking of building 12 string guitar and need some help planning it: 1. Do the StewMac "economy tuners" have any disadvantages. e.g., not properly keeping the strings in tune? 2. In a 12-string guitar, do I have to make the neck a bit wider than a 6-string? 2a.How much wider? 2b. If so, how does it affect the position of the pickups? 3. Which pickups are recommended for a 12-string? I made a 6-string with Select pickups (the cheapest that StewMac sells), and I am very happy them. Will they perform as well for a 12-string? 4. What will happen if I connect a single coil neck PU and a single coil bridge PU in line, to make them work like 1 (splitted) humbucker? Will such circuit do a good job for a 12-string as well? 5. Is it necessary stiffening the neck using carbon fiber? Can i get away with 3 or 5 laminations of hard wood? Thanks, Itai Edited March 18, 2006 by screwdelulu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitefly SA Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 this is a big think, but i think that the neck is regular size, the pickups would then be normal aswell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegarehanman Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 If you keep the neck the size of a 6 string, your strings will be much too close together. This is like most neck measurements, you can't be told what's correct. You need to figure it out for yourself because, by far, it's a matter of personal preference. Go to guitar center, try out some 12 strings, and see what dimensions work for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Hello all, I'm thinking of building 12 string guitar and need some help planning it: 1. Do the StewMac "economy tuners" have any disadvantages. e.g., not properly keeping the strings in tune? Might be a bit heavy, and I'd be very sceptical about the quality. Given you can get a set of gotoh minis from Warmoth for 25 bucks, I'd just suck it up, spend the 50, and know I had a decent set of tuning machines on there. You also want to save as much weight as possible on a 12, so minis are a good idea. 2. In a 12-string guitar, do I have to make the neck a bit wider than a 6-string? 2a.How much wider? 2b. If so, how does it affect the position of the pickups? You probably want to widen it a little, yeah. I'd got for 45-46mm, should be fine (1.75" or a hair wider). Fairly standard width on acoustic 6s, but if someone's got an electric 12 and would measure that (or, y'know, check websites for specs), that'd be good. It shouldn't affect the pickup positioning much at all. 3. Which pickups are recommended for a 12-string? I made a 6-string with Select pickups (the cheapest that StewMac sells), and I am very happy them. Will they perform as well for a 12-string? 4. What will happen if I connect a single coil neck PU and a single coil bridge PU in line, to make them work like 1 (splitted) humbucker? Will such circuit do a good job for a 12-string as well? 5. Is it necessary stiffening the neck using carbon fiber? Can i get away with 3 or 5 laminations of hard wood? Thanks, Itai No clue about the pickups, really; if the selects are well defined enough (you don't want muddy), go for it. Advantage to those; I believe they're blade polepiece pickups, which takes the guesswork out of pickup/string spacing issues. As for the two pickups; if you get a reverse wound, reverse polarity pickup for one of them, and wire them in series, you'll get a slight humbucking effect. It's how many modern Teles are set up. It'll act like a regular, not a split, humbucker. Honestly, I'd think parallel wiring should do fine for a 12. You want it to jangle! CF rods...depending on the hardwoods used, you can probably make a very stiff neck that'll hold up fine to the tension of a 12 (and you are tuning it to a traditional tuning, right? Not E to E? Dropped down to C or D? Takes a lot of the tension off), but CF is more efficient per unit weight. I like to use CF even in the laminated necks I make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screwdelulu Posted March 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Thanks for the quick replies. What is the distance between the "similar" strings? Which one of the truss rods warmoth sells is best for me? Can i use their CF rods? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gripper Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 As far as pickups for 12-strings, I chose a rail SD for the bridge and a Tele neck position from Fender. Mini Grovers worked well for me. I sprung for the Gotoh fully adjustable bridge made for 12-strings. The string tree gave me the most trouble because the screws on a standard tree wouldn't hold that much pressure. Next was the bridge pickup cover that had to be made from scratch. It was well worth the effort. If I had it to do over I would probly use a more standard bridge and reverse the chorus strings like some Ricks did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovekraft Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Some interesting opinions here - FWIW, Fender uses a 42mm nut for their 12 (same as a Strat), and Rickenbacker uses a 41.4mm for the 300 series 12s (same as the 6 string models), and both are easy to play and sound great. It also eliminates any problems with polepiece spacing, since each course (pair of octave/unison strings) is centered the same as a 6 string. Seems to me that making the neck wider transfers the load from the craftsman, who doesn't have to be as precise, to the player, who has to work harder to play it - but that's just me (and Roger McGuinn, George Harrison, Tom Petty, John Lennon, etc.). As always, YMMV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erikbojerik Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 On my doubleneck I made both necks 1.78" wide at the nut. Because the bridge spacing is unchanged, it really didn't change the string position over the pickups that much. It did, however, make it much easier for my rather fat fingers to play, much less tripping over myself. This is the nut spacing I'm going with on all my own builds from now on! BTW, the old 60s Fender 12s do sport a wider neck than the modern 6s; this is how I "discovered" how nice it was to play on a wide neck, when I strung it up as a 6. A 3- or 5-piece laminated neck should work fine, but the CF rods will give you some weight relief (which may or may not be an issue). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screwdelulu Posted March 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Nice double neck Erik, How did you hide the other 6 tuners? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Nice double neck Erik, How did you hide the other 6 tuners? I may be wrong, but I don't think he has two sets of tuners...he's probably just locking down the ends of the extra strings. If I were making a 12-string (and I might one day), I'd put on locking tuners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erikbojerik Posted March 19, 2006 Report Share Posted March 19, 2006 Thanks for the props! Mickguard nailed it...the octave strings start at the fine-tune tailpiece, run through a locking string clamp, they are tuned slightly sharp with the tuners, clamped tight, then snipped. They are tuned using the fine-tuners on the Schaller tailpiece. The regular strings are strung through the body, run through holes drilled through the string clamps, then to the tuners. After a few months of settling in, this thing stays in pitch even when tuned E to E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screwdelulu Posted March 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2006 Did someone use the warmoth Bass Stiffening Rods? If so, how much they weigh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gripper Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Warmoth bass stiffening rods are steel and they are HEAVY! I didn't use any stiffeners on mine. For what THAT is worth. Almost forgot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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