Carvewright

[Guitarfrenzy]

I've noticed a nifty machine called CarveWright. It's made to carve out wood via software and patterns you come up with or anything your imagination can create. I was thinking that it would be an awesome tool for doing inlay work. I'm almost certain it can be used for routing out the inlay cavities, but what would be equally as cool, would be using to cut out the actual inlay material itself. I don't see any reason it wouldn't work. Has anyone else seen this device before? I know that Thorn uses a self made CNC to cut out his T logo and abalone strips. Seems like this tool could do the job, what do you guys think?

[GodBlessTexas]

That's pretty cool. I can imagine a machine like that could pay for itself pretty quickly. I don't see why it couldnt' cut both the inlay cavity and the inlay pieces. You might need to back your inlay material if it's not thick enough, but given a bit with a fine enough point it shouldn't be a problem. However, looking at the demo, it appears that the software only supports creation of the pattern from a pattern library, and not a way to do them on your own.

GBT

[Pr3Va1L]

I can see that also maybe cutting fret slots... Like Thorn does (looks like binding, but it's a CNC that does fret slots that don't do the whole width of the board)

and btw, it should be able to do inlays.

From their website:

The CarveWright software also allows you to import and manipulate images to suit your needs, or draw out your designs using the 2D draw capabilities.

[GodBlessTexas]

Ah, missed the comment on the website, and he never mentioned it in the video. If that's the case, then it sounds like it's a pretty neat tool for the price.

GBT

[Ben]

If I had something like that I would go crazy and make and insanely carved guitar top with it.

something like this example from that site- just with a less tacky design

That thing actually looks like a really cool tool

[rlrhett]

I can see that also maybe cutting fret slots... Like Thorn does (looks like binding, but it's a CNC that does fret slots that don't do the whole width of the board)

and btw, it should be able to do inlays.

From their website:

The CarveWright software also allows you to import and manipulate images to suit your needs, or draw out your designs using the 2D draw capabilities.

I'm not sure on the fret slot cutting. It seems that the smallest bit they have is 1/16" or 0.0625. That is way to big for fret slots. Doesn't seem like the software is terribly robust yet either. But... looks like it might work to make compound radius fretboards. Pretty cool!!!

[Tjensen]

It is pretty cool but, I wonder if it is acurate enough for fret slots ( assumming you can get a small enough bit)

[GuitarGuy]

It is pretty cool but, I wonder if it is acurate enough for fret slots ( assumming you can get a small enough bit)

Really tho, I was looking for the resolution of the steps but it never says. At least not that I could find. And a .023" cutter is very fragile. I've broken many 1/32 cutters which is .030" so I'd hate to see anything smaller. Also feed rates come into question. Is it adjustable?

One would probably be better served with a small cnc mill. But I'd like to see a review of this machine before totally tossing the idea.

[Tjensen]

It is pretty cool but, I wonder if it is acurate enough for fret slots ( assumming you can get a small enough bit)

Really tho, I was looking for the resolution of the steps but it never says. At least not that I could find. And a .023" cutter is very fragile. I've broken many 1/32 cutters which is .030" so I'd hate to see anything smaller. Also feed rates come into question. Is it adjustable?

One would probably be better served with a small cnc mill. But I'd like to see a review of this machine before totally tossing the idea.

Somewhere on the site itt says that it makes passes at .006 inch.

That is probably cool for frets? I havent really thought it out, but it sounds more accurate than me

I haven checked out the software, but if you cant control the feed rate, it aint gonna work for guitar building. At least not for me.

[Spike1956]

Wow, this looks great ... I downloaded the trial software and am testing it.

With a pointed but I beleive you could do an accurate job of marking the frets for sawing, maybe just a groove about .005 deep to get the saw started.

Also, I wonder if it could be used for the back side of a neck. Maybe if it was mounted to another board. After messing with the software for a bit, i looks lick complete neck carve and body carves are possible. You can also import images and it will do a relief of the image for carving, so like a carved headstock logo might be possible.

I would love to buy this but its out of my price range. Could probably pay for itself quickly though.

[Guitarfrenzy]

It is pretty cool but, I wonder if it is acurate enough for fret slots ( assumming you can get a small enough bit)

That would be interesting to know, but like others have said, you'd have to buy one of the small dremel type router bits, like Stew Mac sells.

....

Also, I wonder if it could be used for the back side of a neck. Maybe if it was mounted to another board. After messing with the software for a bit, i looks lick complete neck carve and body carves are possible. You can also import images and it will do a relief of the image for carving, so like a carved headstock logo might be possible.

I would love to buy this but its out of my price range. Could probably pay for itself quickly though.

I think it could be used for the backside of the neck, but it would probably be way slower than just doing it with a wood duplicating machine, or even spokeshave, rasp, hand tools.. etc. I'd think it would really shine on doing inlays though if you could get it setup correctly and the accuracy was good enough. Just a thought. Someone buy one and report back to us..haha

[Mattia]

If speed's the issue, a belt sander can 'do' a neck in a minute or so (there's a vid out there of Tom Ribbeke doing just that..stationary belt sander). Exact duplicates are a different issue, natch.

[mammoth guitars]

Has anyone contacted carveright? I sent them an email several days ago but have not heard back.

[LiquidGuitars]

Has anyone contacted carveright? I sent them an email several days ago but have not heard back.

I have not contacted them yet but the software look fun to use. You can download it on their website and try it . body blank size under 14.5".

I was able to inport my 3d infomation using a grayscale altadute map photoshop and Carvewright's designer.

looks like it should work..

Edited December 31, 2006 by LiquidGuitars

[MartyM]

The depth of cut is only 1 in. The Sears version is almost 2000 dollars. Check out Crankorgan.com for DIY CNC plans at about 35 dollars each. If you can build a guitar, you can build a CNC machine.

[erikbojerik]

If you can build a guitar, you can build a CNC machine.

That may be true, but building a CNC machine with tight enough backlash tolerances for inlay work or fret slots is not easy at all.

[MartyM]

If you can build a guitar, you can build a CNC machine.

That may be true, but building a CNC machine with tight enough backlash tolerances for inlay work or fret slots is not easy at all.

This carvewright machine is a hobbiest machine per their website. The specs on the Carvewright FAQ do not discuss the repeatibility of the machine. This is important for the accuracy that you are referring to especially for inlay work.

Regarding backlash tolerances, by using delrin nuts and threaded rod, one can achieve nearly zero backlash. There are a few different methods for doing this.

I've looked at the Carvewright at Sears. It is a cool looking machine. My point is this, Is it worth 2000 dollars to be able to make templates and to do other work with a depth of 1 inch or less? If the answer is yes, than it should do the trick. If however you want to be able to rout a control cavity down to 1.5 inches for example than perhaps other options should be considered.

[GuitarGuy]

Regarding backlash tolerances, by using delrin nuts and threaded rod, one can achieve nearly zero backlash. There are a few different methods for doing this.

Backlash and repeatability are two very different things. You can have a gantry with zero backlash but still have crappy repeatibility.

machine rigidity, stepper power/speed all have an effect on accuracy and repeatibility. An to get that accuracy it costs money. In parts alone a home made cnc will cost you 2k

Edited January 1, 2007 by GuitarGuy

[MartyM]

In parts alone a home made cnc will cost you 2k

[GuitarGuy]

accuracy around 1/64-1/32 in. repeatability.

Which really is very poor accuracy. thats .015" to .030" .......you could park the titanic in that gap.

Honestly....Break out your calipers and measure 30 thou... thats the width of a fret tang. You think a gap like that is acceptable in an inlay?

In parts alone a home made cnc will cost you 2k

Let me rephrase that. A home made cnc capable of fine work such as inlay.

Edited January 1, 2007 by GuitarGuy

[MartyM]

"Honestly....Break out your calipers and measure 30 thou... thats the width of a fret tang. You think a gap like that is acceptable in an inlay?"

That I can't address, as I'm no inlay guy, but I'm willing to bet that a gap of .015 would be pretty acceptable to somebody who does it on a regular basis. Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know.

[MartyM]

Which really is very poor accuracy. thats .015" to .030".

I am also figuring that a good portion of that error is runout on the Porter Cable Laminate trimmer over which I have no control. The above figure is also a guess. It could be less, I've never measured it other than making a test plug and a corresponding cavity to see how they would fit together. The numbers could be tweaked in the software to reduce the gap.

[MartyM]

All this talk about accuracy made me go down and do a test. With a piece of walnut double taped down to the table, I ran a 1/4 dia straight bit through the wood a little more than 1/8" deep for 4 inches in the Y axis . Then I went.75 " in the X axis. The last pass was 4 in back to the starting position in the y axis. I did this at a high rate of speed with a dull bit with no regard to grain direction or climb milling/conventional milling. The result was about an average of .480-.484 and a flawless cut should have been .500. So we are talking about .016 to .020 off at a high rate of speed. Perhaps a slower speed and sharper bit would have yielded a different result closer to the .500. I know it isn't perfect, but for a comparison, A shopbot ( 7000 dollars) has a cutting accuracy of +/- .015". and a repeatability of +/-.005". Knowing that there is this amount of error, I could theoretically adjust my inlay or cavity to make the space smaller by adjusting my offset in my Cad drawing.

It's not the be all-end all, but it was fun to build, it is fun to work with, and it works for me. Your mileage may vary as they say. I'm sure the Carvewright will work for somebody too. I'd be interested in what kind of results that can produce.

[Mattia]

GuitarGuy: y'know, I thought you were right, but take a peek around CnCzone.com's forums; plenty of machines there that seem to be about 2000 bucks, and big enough for entire guitar bodies, metal construction, good quality rails, ballscrews, drivers, and a good router playing spindle, turning out very acceptable inlay results. Not saying it's easy, but it very certainly can be done.

[GuitarGuy]

GuitarGuy: y'know, I thought you were right, but take a peek around CnCzone.com's forums; plenty of machines there that seem to be about 2000 bucks, and big enough for entire guitar bodies, metal construction, good quality rails, ballscrews, drivers, and a good router playing spindle, turning out very acceptable inlay results. Not saying it's easy, but it very certainly can be done.

I didn't say it wasnt doable. In fact by the way I have been talking you may have guessed I have plans for building my own. My point was if this Carvwright can produce acceptable results 2K is a decent price for a turn-key solution. But with the right know-how you can build a cnc for $500. But it wont be accurate enough. But for about 2K it is doable.

Regardless.... with metal working a sliding fit is going to be .002"-.005" .... A very loose fit is 0.010". With wood it will be similar. For the high quality inlay that is about the accuracy you will need. With marty's machine it appears that .01 is the lower end of its accuracy so best case is a very loose fit.

Again the point is that 2k for a turn-key machine is resonably priced if it can hit these marks.