XcitR Posted June 2, 2008 Report Share Posted June 2, 2008 Just put together and strung up my 1570, and I've got string buzz between the 1st and 12th frets. No buzzing on open strings, though the action from 1-12 is VERY low, and the action from 12-14 is a bit higher. Has a new fretboard, and the frets are nearly perfectly leveled with a straight edge. I tried to loosen the truss rod to give a little more relief, but the truss rod is already as loose as it gets. What next?? Would shimming the nut help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borge Posted June 3, 2008 Report Share Posted June 3, 2008 if the open strings are fine the nut isnt the problem. how much relief do you have? I'd raise the action a bit and go from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Sorbera Posted June 3, 2008 Report Share Posted June 3, 2008 If it's only buzzing on the first and second frets and the open strings are fine the first thing you should check is fret level. It sure sounds like a fret level problem to me, not a relief or action height problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borge Posted June 3, 2008 Report Share Posted June 3, 2008 Just put together and strung up my 1570, and I've got string buzz between the 1st and 12th frets. No buzzing on open strings, though the action from 1-12 is VERY low, and the action from 12-14 is a bit higher. Has a new fretboard, and the frets are nearly perfectly leveled with a straight edge. I tried to loosen the truss rod to give a little more relief, but the truss rod is already as loose as it gets. What next?? Would shimming the nut help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Sorbera Posted June 3, 2008 Report Share Posted June 3, 2008 For some reason I read it as 1st and 2nd frets. I must be really tired. In that case it *does* sound like a relief problem. Check out Frets.com for some really good setup instructions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XcitR Posted June 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2008 actually, I think it could be both! Fretting low E on 1 and 24 leaves very little clearance on 9. Can't quite slip a playing card between the string and fret. The low E string seems to be the worst - buzzing from 1-9. Fretting all strings on the first fret results in buzzing. The height of the bottom of the nut's string guide to fretboard on low E is .080". There is no shim under the nut or in the neck pocket. Sorry - also posted over at Jemsite, and Rich has suggested sending it off to be "plek'd"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted June 3, 2008 Report Share Posted June 3, 2008 actually, I think it could be both! Fretting low E on 1 and 24 leaves very little clearance on 9. Can't quite slip a playing card between the string and fret. The low E string seems to be the worst - buzzing from 1-9. Fretting all strings on the first fret results in buzzing. The height of the bottom of the nut's string guide to fretboard on low E is .080". There is no shim under the nut or in the neck pocket. Sorry - also posted over at Jemsite, and Rich has suggested sending it off to be "plek'd"? What does "plek'd" mean? Anyways, measurements would be helpful. Can you tell us what the action is at 17th fret, what the relief is around the 7th fret (measure with fretted strings on fret 1 and 17). Also, what is the nut height? When you fret a string at the 3rd fret, do you see a gap between the string and the fret? It should be berely noticeable. If the gap is too large, action cannot be set correctly by setting the bridge height because you're starting out too high. The bridge ends up being too low to compensate for the nut height and fretted notes buzz. This is a common problem on a lot of guitars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XcitR Posted June 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2008 I sent it off to Vince at Crossroads Guitar Shop in VA for Pleking. After doing some research, I've found that in a nutshell, pleking is a computer controlled, CNC fretboard mapping and leveling service. There's only a handful of shops in the US that offer this so far and they're all listed at www.plek.com, as well as a more detailed description of the service. Well worth the reading! We'll see how it works, as I should get it back sometime next week if all goes well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XcitR Posted June 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Got the Plek results... Seems with the truss rod completely loose, there is still back bow in the neck - a perfect backbow curve between frets 1 and 12 causing the strings to ground out on the highest frets. The Plek could level the frets to compensate, but it would take the 12th fret to nearly nothing, and the 16th-24th frets would be completely untouched! Being that I glued the board on the neck when it was completely flat and the truss was loose, the fretboard is likely causing more backbow now that it's attached. So, here's my next set of questions if anyone can offer some help: 1. Is there any way to build relief back into the neck in order to save the fretboard and inlay work? 2. Is there any way to build relief back into the neck without removing the fretboard and/or frets? 3. If the frets do need removed, I used CA glue on the ends, which wicked along their lengths - what's the best way of removing them without chipping the ebony board? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Got the Plek results... Seems with the truss rod completely loose, there is still back bow in the neck - a perfect backbow curve between frets 1 and 12 causing the strings to ground out on the highest frets. The Plek could level the frets to compensate, but it would take the 12th fret to nearly nothing, and the 16th-24th frets would be completely untouched! Being that I glued the board on the neck when it was completely flat and the truss was loose, the fretboard is likely causing more backbow now that it's attached. So, here's my next set of questions if anyone can offer some help: 1. Is there any way to build relief back into the neck in order to save the fretboard and inlay work? 2. Is there any way to build relief back into the neck without removing the fretboard and/or frets? 3. If the frets do need removed, I used CA glue on the ends, which wicked along their lengths - what's the best way of removing them without chipping the ebony board? I'm a little curious. Couldn't you have found the backbow with a straightedge? That sounds like pretty serious backbow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
87kevin Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Im assuming you used a one-way truss rod? Not sure what kind of neck this is. If so, this is one of those cases where s 2way could have saved this neck. Not saying it would've been the best solution, but it could have got this job done... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenspoke Posted June 8, 2008 Report Share Posted June 8, 2008 (edited) A two way rod would have helped you out, a straight edge and seasoned wood is second on the list. Heating the fret board so the glue is soft will allow you to bring a bad neck up. I suggest you look for instructions on this repair. If it is a bolt on neck start from scratch. Live and learn. You probably cut the fret slots too tight and back bowed the neck when the frets went in. Edited June 8, 2008 by Woodenspoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XcitR Posted June 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2008 It's a Prestige neck from 2003, one-way truss. I'm told the bow is high starting at the1st fret (which needs a slight bit of leveling), sloping upwards to the 3rd, and a near perfect gradual curve back down to about the 15th. Not sure the exact apex height, but I should get that with the PLEK info Monday. I had noticed the bow back when I glued the board down, but rookie mistake, I thought that was normal and that string tension would help, because the neck was perfectly flat when I glued the board down. Truss rod was completely loose, however. As for the fret tangs being too wide, they were Dunlop 6150's (.020 TW) and LMI slotted board (.023 slots), and all went in fairly easily - but I guess it's entirely possible that the board is adding to the back bow. Also, Setch pointed out when I questioned the bowing after gluing the board down that I probably intruduced the bowing during glue up - using waterbased glue and/or not clamping the neck and fretboard to a deadstraight caul during the gluing. This was seconded today after talking to a local seasoned luthier, Randy Wood (randywoodguitars.com). Anyways, Randy thinks he can heat set the neck back to where it is supposed to be. At this point, I guess I have nothing to loose in trying it. Hopefully I can save the fretboard and inlays in the process... If not, I'll have to find a replacement neck and bolt it on as is. Feeling a bit gun shy about doing another fretboard for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geo Posted June 9, 2008 Report Share Posted June 9, 2008 Perhaps a long shot, but what about removing the fretboard, installing a 2-way rod, and reattaching? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug Posted June 9, 2008 Report Share Posted June 9, 2008 Also, Setch pointed out when I questioned the bowing after gluing the board down that I probably intruduced the bowing during glue up - using waterbased glue and/or not clamping the neck and fretboard to a deadstraight caul during the gluing. There's a lot of discussion about that subject on this forum in case you decide to try again. For years I introduce forward bow (prestress) while attaching the fingerboard. It's an old fashioned technique to compensate for this expected behavior of wood and a surefire way to end up with a straight neck every time. I take no chances... That heating process should get your prized neck back in order though. -Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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