guitarman Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Westhemann, I KNEW as soon as I typed that I had not heard KWS (Except for the Gap commercial I think he did) it would seem strange to have an opinion. so...I tried to explain. As I said...it's a pet peeve. I was interested enough to read the interview and I didn't think about the "SRV-clone" controversy until I read about the guy's set up. I am not kidding when I say it was EXACTLY the same as Stevie Ray Vaughn's (I was far milder on my first post). It even included some pedal with an unusual name (can't remember!!) and at that moment......I was turned off. To be fair to the man....that was some time ago. Maybe he has found his own voice!?!? Surely you can understand having a guitar hero, and then reading about someone who is just duplicating and it would turn you off?!??? I thought I would bring up the issues of originality, conformity and complacency and maybe...just maybe...someone else might have noticed it, or thought to themselves (oh yeah...I remember when people made fun of me because I thought a Fender Squire I tried felt and sounded ok! ) It is only an opinion that I have. It is something that I find distasteful and a little sad. I guess I look at a guy like Jimi Hendrix who was an innovator and all these years later...people keep looking backwards instead of forwards. Really makes me wonder what he would have accomplished if he was still alive. That was a guy not afraid to try new things and follow the beat of his own drum. Just some things to think about. Nothing more. Guitarman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Cool you liked the show, I like him too. It's funny, I hang on some other much more 'Fender' related forums where KWS has been raked over the blues coals for years now, he's pretty much dead meat they've ripped him apart so bad. The KWS bandwagon has come and long gone in some parts by now, he was hot blues news about 5 years ago, I actually heard his new disc was much more pop oriented and he was leaving the blues behind, but I like his first disc a lot, very SRV. Come to think of it, SRV has been raked over those same coals 1000 times too, and I still like SRV, saw him 5 times back in the days. One Bad Hombre that boy was. PS, I take points away for relic'd guitars. Poser! Drak, We are not too far apart on this one. Going back and reading the posts to see how people got so out of shape about this...I noticed three things. 1. The biggest KWS fans are the ones accusing (a flame in it's own right?) me of trying to start trouble. And now I have to defend myself? Truth is you don't know my motives and even though I write them down...you are not looking for them. Pretty arrogant to declare my motives for me. 2. You said almost exactly what I said..read your quote that I am posting from the third post of the thread. (Never used the quote option...hope it works). And by your own admission....I AM NOT ALONE IN THIS OPINION. Many have criticized the guy for the SRV worship/copyright infringement. 3. You take off points for relic'ed strats.....me too. I think it is posing as well. See we see eye to eye on things!! All I know is that if this guy does not want to sound like SRV he REALLY went out of his way to get EVERY specific effect and equipment needed. Come on now!! If you say that his sound has changed, fine....your word is good enough. Seriously!!! Westheman Nice sarcasm being put into play. For someone against flaming, you are pretty good at it! I'm informed enough to read the artists critics and interested/informed enough to read an article about him when he was a young man. Informed enough to buy a new magazine that explains where he has been and his battle with booze. New edition. You are a fan...give it a read!! Interesting stuff. One of the rules of a discussion (when people had respect for each other) was to carefully consider what the other person was saying and see if there was some merit in the point. This is not the same as carefully reading a post looking for something to grab and try to discredit or put-down the other person to try and further your point. It is a juvenile thing to do. From what I read about the man I formed an opinion. It happens to be the opinion of many of his critics. If you think the point is not valid. Cool. Say that, instead of...."you just don't know enough". Would it be so wrong to say "Really?? I hear something different. It is the same genre, but there are a few techniques that really differ from SRV. Try listening to [insert song here] you will notice [observation here]" See...that is being respectful and still disagreeing. You may be absolutely right and I might be absolutely wrong. But you have to do a little better than that. Make a point....I was accused of not participating...but I have my reasons, I have my point and I don't mind disagreement, or even if I am proven wrong. Most of all. It's kind of unfair to accuse someone of being uninformed if they don't see things your way, and it is REALLY unjust to accuse someone of being a troublemaker because they have a different way of thinking. I guess Ned Steinberger is a heretic of the greatest degree. Look forward to reading you on less sensitive subjects....if there are any! Guitarman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Most of all. It's kind of unfair to accuse someone of being uninformed if they don't see things your way, actually you accused yourself of being uninformed,opening yourself as fair game to anyone wishing to discredit you by making it impossible not to,which i am sure was your every intention. flaming? no.by claiming that i am "flaming" you,you imply that my points are not valid,which they are. actually i only have 2 points. 1)you have not heard the man to form your own opinion of him,rather,you read articles and steal others' opinions as your own.basing your entire knowledge of the subject on a list of equipment you once read somewhere. stevie has a left handed trem on his right handed guitar as a tribute to jimi.he also plays a strat and i am sure if you researched you would find his equipment list to be quite similar to jimi's 2)KWS's tone is so dissimilar to stevie's that the assertion you make is bordering on ridiculous.this is not meant to "flame" you,only to maybe make you get off your ass and give a listen to his work so that at least your opinion will have SOME validity there is no question that you are well spoken and intelligent.but ignorance makes you useless in an informed discussion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 By even bothering to answer him Wes, you take the bait of the troll. That is the web of evil they weave. Good trolls are extremely crafty at getting responses, and upping the flames ever so slowly. They'll play you like a violin, and he's good at it. Spotted it right away. Ummm, can I have my ice cream now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlGeeEater Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 There givin out his new CD if you win the contest http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/contests/kws_contest.htm? i suggest some of us enter this ahem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 By even bothering to answer him Wes, you take the bait of the troll. That is the web of evil they weave. Good trolls are extremely crafty at getting responses, and upping the flames ever so slowly. i am aware.but i am extremely good at drawing these "trolls" into coming out where everyone can see them...not just the select few like you and I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 check. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvertonessuckbutigotone Posted November 17, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 (edited) Sorry...I'm not a KWS fan and I've never heard a note from the guy. Why??? I have a pet peeve and it affects poor old KFC or whatever his name is too. This may be fair or unfair. One of the reasons the guy was raked over the coals for so long, is that he is a parrot. That is.....doing someone else's thing. BLAHBLAHBLAH You've got to take into account that this guy made his first big album when he was 17. This means he hasn't had time to change and transform his band into his own stuff which he has started to do in his last album. If you look at ANY band you will relize that they started out as just another band and transformed into their own stuff. A few examples? Godsmack-Metallica, Future Leaders Of The World-Nirvana, the list goes on and on. Even Ozzy started playing like the Beatles at first! This guy pretty much started a band, graduated and started touring. The only reason his first couple albums sound like SRV is because SRV inspired KWS and the media attention caught him before he could make his own stuff. KWS has a LOT of talent and how he uses it is his choice and if he wants to use it like SRV did then so be it, BUT he is transforming his music and you CAN tell if you listen to his newest album. He started singing his own stuff now and his voice sounds NOTHING like SRV's so that changes things up a bit. I DO agree with you though that he is influenced by SRV in a major way. There is no denying that KWS has talent and that he MIGHT be the next SRV with his own style. Also...to reassure you. It has been a topic that my bandmates, and my wife and I have talked about often. In fact...I found an old guitar world mag when Mike Mushok from staind (think that's right) was featured. He was using an Ibanez I believe (good guitars!) and had the strap duct-taped to the horn. I've never even seen the guitarist of staind or whatever live or in a vid or picture but thats what I do, thats what my freinds do and I dont think anyone of my friends even like staind. Just because some famous guy did it on TV doesnt mean every one else does it because of them. Maybe he saw that everyone else was doing it and he decided to do it. Edited November 17, 2004 by silvertonessuckbutigotone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Strats are for 90lb. wussie-boys anyway. Real MEN play Teles. Ya gotta FIGHT and WRANGLE that tone out of a Tele! (marching music) MEN MEN MEN, MEN MEN MEN, MEN MEN MEN!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlGeeEater Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Strats are for 90lb. wussie-boys anyway. yup, thats KWS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 His first disc really kicks. He's young, and his whole life and career out in front of him to stretch out and try all kinds of things. He'll do just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 guitarman.i deleted your last post because it was inflammatory and crossed a line.do not let it happen again anyway ,welcome to the forum.and when you give the man a listen,i will be glad to hear your fair,learned opinion of him,good or bad. by the way.i am curious.who do people say YOU sound like?...people love to draw comparisons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crafty Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Strats are for 90lb. wussie-boys anyway Hey, I wonder how much Prince weighs? He's pretty slight, but he can still sling that Tele around with the best of 'em. I like Kenny Wayne Shepard. His opening act was one of the only good parts of the Extreme Van Halen concert I saw in St. Louis back in '98. I think he's a master of the Texas Blues and I won't insult him by saying he's trying to copy SRV. We all have our influences that make their way into our own music, but they mesh and combine to produce the innovative offspring we call our own songs. Calling KWS a copycat of SRV for playing the Texas Blues is like calling BB King a copycat of Robert Johnson for playing the Mississippi Delta Blues. It just doesn't work, and I've heard enough out of KWS, Johnny Lang, Dereck Trucks, and Joe Bonamassa to know that they channel the blues from all over Texas, the Delta, and Chicago. You can't pigeonhole innovation or the new blues artists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Westheman (Westheimer) You played the trump card!!! Good for you! You took your ball and went home. I made a great point that identified what silvertonessuckbutigot one did Namely-respond respectfully and deal with the issue. He dealt with the issues I mentioned and made a great point. We don't see eye to eye, but he can respond to the issue instead of calling me a troll or insulting my intelligence or calling me ignorant. and you and Drak just tried to discredit me and MAKE it personal. Nice to see that if you lose, you will pull the thread. The only person who made this matter a personal one....is you. You should be ashamed of yourself. You are a coward. SILVERTONES- You are a respectful poster and I thought your last post made a lot of sense. You are welcome to write me and disagree with me any time you want. At least you know how to have a discussion. To anyone else who can read this.... DO NOT EVER DISAGREE WITH A POINT OF VIEW, WRITE ABOUT SUNSHINE AND PUPPIES NEVER STAND UP TO OTHER MEMBERS WHO TRY TO PUT YOU DOWN INSTEAD OF DEAL WITH THE ISSUES And most of all NEVER SAY YOU DONT LIKE AN ARTIST THAT THE MODERATOR LIKES. There....agree with westheimer all the time and it will all go fine. Now you know the rules. Guitarman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeavnerGuitarWorks Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 I personally don't care for KWS. His first album was nothing more than a decent attempt at becoming the next SRV wannabe. Don't get your panties in a wad and take that the wrong way. I know he has taken his career a different direction now and I totally respect that. But come on... let's be real about this. He did use the exact same rig as SRV even down to the beat up sunburst strat. But then again... so do I and half of the white blues guitarists out there. If I had his talent and could actually get that close to Stevie's tone, who knows, I might be in the exact same position. I really don't understand why people get so upset over this issue though. It's not like the people chanting "Stevie is God" aren't sitting in their rooms trying to play "Texas Flood" or playing "The Sky is Cryin'" at their gigs. KWS just made it big doing it. He made one album that sounds a little to close to Stevie and moved on. But yet he still gets flamed for it. Its no different than Tinsley Ellis or Chris Duarte or the countless other so called "Stevie clones". I don't care for him cause I don't like his songs. The first album had a singer from Canada trying to sing blues. The rest of his stuff isn't quite bluesy enough for me. He is talented though... just not my can o' beans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Lord Stratomaster.... I tried to make a similar point and got nowhere. It was never my intention to try and turn anyone off the guy. That can't be done anyway!! THANK YOU for pointing out the overwhelming effort to buy everything that SRV had. And NO...I do NOT know why people do get so upset about bringing those things up. Careful....they will be calling you a troll soon. YAH!!! The guy is talented. No doubt. The SRV wannabe thing talked me out of buying one of his cds. Still.... Silvertonessuckbutigotone makes an interesting point. He is singing on his newest work, and there is an effort to not use the exact same rig as Stevie anymore. I did a little homework and there has been a bit of a shake up. Perhaps his new stuff is a welcome departure from the guitar hero worship of the past. To the people that have both albums....are they night and day, or are they quite similar?? Interested to know if it is worth my money!! I have very little of that lately. Thanks again Stratomaster......another poster proving they can have a point of view, that differs from another person....and they don't make any personal attacks. Guitarman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 No one's upset, we just have a troll on the forum now. No biggie, just another pancake bunny with too much spare time and mommy's computer. It'll pass, it's not the first time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Yep Another personal attack. Clearly someone is upset (over nothing). I'm not going anywhere. Read silvertonessuckbutigotone to see someone who posts with class. Flamers are inconsequential. Guitarman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 <yawn> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AlexVDL Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Hey Drak, looks like the shark in your avatar is yawning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Good for you! You took your ball and went home. actually,as most people on this forum already know,i could easily tear you apart verbally until you run crying.but that is not what this forum is about,and the section devoted to that sort of thing is no longer here. i do not like to repeat myself,but i will ONE MORE TIME. i don't care whether or not you like kenny wayne,or whether or not you think he is a clone.i merely suggested you listen to him before forming an opinion. but you would rather be a "parrot" and mindlessly repeat what you once read in a magazine.good for you.canada must be proud of you now ,why don't you go build a guitar or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Rosenberger Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 The SRV wannabe thing talked me out of buying one of his cds. Still.... He is singing on his newest work, and there is an effort to not use the exact same rig as Stevie anymore. I did a little homework and there has been a bit of a shake up. If you continued to read the entire article you'd have read who KWS Considered the "Great Ones" and why. Jimi, Stevie, Clapton etc. because they all Played AND sang. So, does that make him a Jimi Clone, Stevie Clone etc? Sure they sound similar but I personally consider Stevie's tone to be the epitome of Strat tone, but I wouldn't call it anything too special. I mean take a Strat, a TS-808 and a (insert Fender Tube Amp) and it's gonna sound pretty much like SRV. Does that make you a clone? I don't think so, but if you do. then by that logic anyone who has a strat shaped guitar with a humbucker and a Floyd running into a 100 watt marshall is a Van Halen clone? He did it first and lots of people followed but just call it what it is. It's good for music Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlGeeEater Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 No offense towards guitarman, but hes more annoying then me no what i mean Drak?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 You used to be a PITA, but really not at all lately. This guy is a Troll. Big difference between a PITA and a Troll. His only intention is to stir up crap within our ranks and get people fired up and pissed off over nothing at all, hit us blindsided while he sits back and giggles like a little girl at the sh*tstorm he created, that's his goal, not building guitars. Not to worry tho, he won't be here too much longer. The trap has been set for him and he soon will be caught like a mouse in a mousetrap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdguitars Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 I like Kenny he has a lot of soul in his music. I don't like the fact that all the guitar mags decided to put him on the cover this month. I have Guitar player and VG and he is interviewed in both, I am sure he is in the other ones too. Its old to read the same questions asked a different way. I dislike the fact that most guitar mags rarely pickup things out side the box. This was the same thing back in march when Eric clapton came out with that robert johnson cd he was on every mag, its gets old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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