verhoevenc Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Ok, I've been sanding FOREVER with my grain filler.... I'm thinking I'm almost to the point where I think I've sanded PAST the grain the was meant to be filled?! This isg etting rediculous?! And I've gone through like 20 sheets of sandpaper to NO avail. I go through it so fast because it gets these THINGS on it in like the first 30 seconds I sand with the sheet, and then these THINGS I'm guessing are what's causing the big scratches that I can't get out?!?! It was SO much easier to sand before I filled it?!?! What's going on?! Is this normal!? These are the things I'm talking about: Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikhailgtrski Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 (edited) What are you using for grain filler? Epoxy? What grit paper? You really shouldn't need to use anything lower than 220 or 320 grit. Those "things" are the grain filler clogging up the sandpaper. Did you wait long enough for the filler to cure? Clean it off every few strokes (wipe it on carpet or a rag) and you won't waste so much. Plus you won't be messing up your surface by rubbing all that excess filler back on it. The stewmac waterbased stuff sands easily, although you have to reapply it a few times to fill up the pores. And the 3M Frecut paper they sell is far and away better than the best stuff that Home Depot sells. It doesn't get loaded up nearly as much and it cleans off really easily, so you use a lot less. Mike Edited February 15, 2006 by mikhailgtrski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verhoevenc Posted February 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 I'm using "Glaze Coat" two part epoxy... the only "filling" epoxy the guy at home depot said they had. It left a pretty thick amount of layering so I started with 120... that may be the problem... And yeah, the part is question had been curing for DAYS. Chris PS: This is on lacewood... and the "fish scales" have gone back to not being filled anymore (the smaller grain still is) so I literally have had to sand so much as to negate the filling... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikhailgtrski Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 (edited) The thing with grain filling, especially with epoxy, is to wipe off as much excess filler as you can with a squeegee or plastic card. Ideally you just want to leave the filler in the pores. It sounds like you left a layer of epoxy all over the surface, which is a real bear to sand back. I think all you can do at this point is keep sanding carefully until you get it back to bare wood. There are some good threads in the finishing forum that deal with epoxy filler, plus guitarfrenzy's strat tutorial... that info might have saved you a big headache. Bummer, dude edit: I haven't worked with lacewood... but it seems like the pores are smaller than mahogany. Send a PM to maiden69 - I'm pretty sure he's worked with it before. Or maybe it was Drak... anyway, one of them will have answers for you. Hope the sanding goes well (and quickly) for you. Mike Edited February 15, 2006 by mikhailgtrski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verhoevenc Posted February 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 No no, I've read all those foprum threads and guitar frenzy's tutorial. Thing is I DID use a plastic card like guitarfrenzy did. It just this epoxy.... it's jsut REALLY weird... check the stuff out http://www.eclecticproducts.com/famowood/ctggc.asp . What strikes me as weird is they have it under thier "FamoWood: wood filler" section of their site adn I would NEVER suggest this stuff to ANYONE. I ended up biting the bullet, cutting my losses and getting out the power sander and jsut sanding it ALL back until there was NOTHING but wood.... I've decided I'm gunna go with the pore look and not try another filler on this one. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikhailgtrski Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Ah, the Home Depot guy steered you wrong... you definitely didn't want "high build". I hope you had enough wood to safely sand it all the way back. What kind of finish are you doing for the lacewood? If you change your mind about filling, I'd go with the stewmac. It's a bit of a pain since you usually have to do 2 or 3 apply/sand back cycles. But at least it sands easily (with 320 grit) and you can add dye to the clear type if you want to use your filler to enhance the grain. Hey, the upside is you'll know what NOT to do on your next one! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verhoevenc Posted February 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 too true. I needa stop taking the cheaper route and just start dealing with it, biting my tongue and buying the expensive stuff from stewmac that I KNOW will work. And I'm glad I did it on this build cause although my lacewood and spruce was expensive... my flamed maple neck, purplheart, spalted maple, and black limba is more so Plus, this is only my second guitar.... first to ever be finished (the other [MeuX L-Series in progress thread] will never get finished... atleast not by me... cause I just did TOO much wrong and didn't have the right tools... think I might sell it to someone that wants to give a go at fixing it up nice... cause it's got GORGEOUS wood cause i made it WHILE in southeast asia). So yeah... you live you learn... I've spent a total of 6 hours sanding today, but I'm FINALLY back to normal and just reached 220 grit again Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 To be honest, you don't need to buy the expensive stuff, you just need to do your research first, and *NEVER LISTEN TO HOME DEPOT GUY*. For epoxy grain filling, you want regular, common or garden epoxy *glue*, not filler. Any clear, 5 or 30 minute epoxy will be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegarehanman Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Did you spray a washcoat before filling the pores? Doing so will make it much easier to avoid sanding into the wood when you're leveling your filler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpa Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Just something to add regarding sanding methods. The paper loads up like that because the finish is melting and clumping up. Sometimes its unavoidable and I've had to deal with it when board sanding boat hulls etc. Its a result of too much pressure combined with too much speed. The heat generated by friction melts the finish which is then picked up by the grit. If you don't check it those clumps make nasty striations in your work. You have two options, slow down and use less pressure. OR go buy a cheap paint brush with those plastic bristles that tend to leave horrid brush marks. Cut the bristles in half so you have a very short, stiff bristly brush for cleaning the clumps off your paper every now and then. Actually make that three options. You could wetsand your epoxy filling. The water keeps the temperature down and carries the dust away from the grit in the paper. The paper lasts much longer. Just make sure you mop up frequently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazingblake Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 Is that really porous lacewood you have? I have a lacewood tiop it's not real porous I think i'm just going to dye it and tung oil it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erikbojerik Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 To be honest... *NEVER LISTEN TO HOME DEPOT GUY*. My Home Depot guys are all from Ghana....nice guys, they know where all the stuff is, but I'm pretty sure they're clueless about woodworking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 Something else to add about sandpaper (because while I may be wrong, that doesn't look like top-quality paper. Kinda hard to tell): Buy brand name. Buy expensive. Buy top of the line papers. 3M FreCut Gold, Mirika Silver and/or Gold, top-range Norton. Cheap sandpaper is one of the most expensive disposables you can use, buying it is a clearcut case of false economy (it lasts less long, and the quality of cut is worsE), and 'expensive' paper is great. If I'm stating the obvious here, my apologies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cole Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 as for the build up on the sand paper, when dry sanding I always use a wire brush and clean of the paper every once and a while it makes the paper go a long way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 as for the build up on the sand paper, when dry sanding I always use a wire brush and clean of the paper every once and a while it makes the paper go a long way. I was going to respond on this matter as well. Just go against the sand paper with a lower grit sand paper. If you're sanding an oily wood and trying to remove the clog, this will be a bit more tricky. But it will save you tons of sandpaper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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