Ben Posted April 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2006 I'm liking those two pickguards aestheticaly.. but the main reason for the mega pickguard is to make the wiring a lot easier. The smaller pickguards look good, but do little to make the wiring any simpler. With the big one I can wire it all up before I fit it to the guitar, and it eliminates the issue of getting the controls onto the horns (which I think I could manage... more complex though) The wiring on this is pretty complex... well very actually, and if I'm feeding the wires through channels i'm going to need some very good colour coding system so I dont screw up! (were talking 10 individual wires going to/from the lower horn and 5 to the upper one, I'll need big channels too! ) Overall I there are things I like/dislike about all the ideas, and its making the decision really hard! When you say the horns look unrefined, do you mean the horns on the pickguard, or the actual body design? I think the top horn could look better, the back-side of it is more smoothly carved, and if the pickguard didnt cover it I could do the same on the front. At least I have a fair while to make my mind up about the pickguard Thanks for all the opinions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegarehanman Posted April 7, 2006 Report Share Posted April 7, 2006 Mostly I was referring to the upper horn. It looks chunky to me. As for wiring. 10 wires is substantial, but not really that much trouble to route. Just run 2 4 core wires and a 2 core. Also, I think you should post your wiring diagram, we might be able to simplify it for you. peace, russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2006 (edited) I'll finish drawing up a new version of my wiring diagram soon and then post it. I linked to the older oner that I drew on paint earlier in the thread if you want to get the basic idea. I drew a couple of slightly smaller pickguards that are still big enough to be useful The second one looks a bit like the P-bass idea someone mentioned. I think I prefer the bigger version of the two above ones though... Congrats on winning Guitar of the month, Russ! You can get rid of the "rightfully underappreciated" under your name now! Edited April 7, 2006 by Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted April 7, 2006 Report Share Posted April 7, 2006 (edited) I'm liking those two pickguards aestheticaly.. but the main reason for the mega pickguard is to make the wiring a lot easier. I like the pickguard on this shape, although with the laminated neckthrough and the nice wood I do think it looks better without...or at least as good either way...so it comes down to wiring. You are making a sustainer guitar with some experimental switching and you will have to make changes and experiments on the fly. With my Strat (with mega standard pickguard) there is a lot of hollow space in it (it is a hollow body by design...yet I chose to put in a rear cavity and this was invaluable really when I think about it. Not only do I get really good battery access but there will likely be some technical difficulties which you have yet to encounter.... One is that we don't really know how your switching scheme will work. You have exposed signal wires all over that rotary switch...you are also proposing putting driver wires right along side them. The sustainer driver is a coil of wire which emits a powerful signal, but the wire to it are really just an extention of that coil and give off a signal also...this can get into the wiring and should be kept short and separate as much as possible.... In the above picture you can see that the sustainer circuit and switches are in a rear cavity (much larger than it needs to be BTW) with the switches...the driver wires (twisted green and purple) go not through with the rest of the wires to the driver but exit via their own side hole to the spring cavity...over the trem block...to avoid getting too close to the pickups. They do need to come fairly close at the switching and they are near the jack socket in the same cavity...but running alongside wires and especially near the pickups may be problematic. The other thing is that you may need to move things around while the guitar is playable....that is one of the problems with the strat style pickguard...it's great when you know that it's all going to work...that's why Leo made it that way, preassembly)...but hard to take apart to tinker with... You are being ambitious building the guitar and the sustainer simultaneously and perhaps taking a lot for granted that everything will go as planned. Both pickguard and back plate ideas are good and have their merits but I do wonder about the wiring...you are going to need to be flexible with it and I'm not sure which is the best scheme for that.... pete BTW...I found a total wiring diagram for my strat and will post it over at the sustainer thread. If people are not familiar with sustainer wiring it can get quite complex (fernandes, sustainiac or mine) as there are two systems at work and "strange" forces to trip you up oh...i just saw that post...they look good too...but the same concerns apply....what is getting people is not the pickguard designs but the mix with the line of the neckthrough...the designs are all great on the drawing but the pale centreblock changes it... Edited April 7, 2006 by psw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2006 oh...i just saw that post...they look good too...but the same concerns apply....what is getting people is not the pickguard designs but the mix with the line of the neckthrough...the designs are all great on the drawing but the pale centreblock changes it... I should never have tested the dye on the body wings before I took that photo, Its giving the wrong representation to everyone of what it will look like when finished There will be no pale centre block or clearly visible lines becauce of the neck laminates, because the colour differeces in the photo are due to the dye I put on the body wings to test it. When glued/sanded and re-dyed it should all be the same flat colour. One is that we don't really know how your switching scheme will work. You have exposed signal wires all over that rotary switch...you are also proposing putting driver wires right along side them. The sustainer driver is a coil of wire which emits a powerful signal, but the wire to it are really just an extention of that coil and give off a signal also...this can get into the wiring and should be kept short and separate as much as possible.... Didnt think of that.. (well, I had no reason to, I had no idea that it could be a problem!) Roughly what sort of distance do the wires need to have between them? I could make sure that they are at opposite sides of the cavity, or I could probably run it through the tremolo spring cavity like you did. I know I am doing a lot and being quite ambitious on this guitar, but I am prepared for the fact that it may not all work at first and it may need modifying. I am trying to get some experience at doing all sorts of new things for myself, like pickup winding and complex electronics, so I will have more experience for future projects. I'll have a look at the sustainer thread for your wiring diagram. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psw Posted April 7, 2006 Report Share Posted April 7, 2006 I know I am doing a lot and being quite ambitious on this guitar, but I am prepared for the fact that it may not all work at first and it may need modifying. That's the way...I didn't know either and every guitar is going to have it's quirks with the sustainer. Depends on things like the pickups suspetibility on picking up noise and such. It is only the wires (green and purple) that you have to worry about...the power and signal wires aren't a problem...and at some points they will need to get close, even on mine and eventuall at the circuit. If you look at that pic of the circuit you will see a round black trim pot. This was an added filter to deal with the high frequency interferance I was getting and is shown as a block on the wiring diagram...this has since been removed as the simple act of rerouting the wires a little away from the others rather than through the hole with the others and under the pickups fixed it. Now...if I had made firm plans, I may have tripped up... For instance if you see a pick of the sustainer guitar there is a bit of white tape on the pickguard near the mid pickup that hides a hole drilled for a momentary push-button sustainer control...great idea, but it doesn't work with simple switching like that an d had to be abandoned. I was so sure that I could make it work that I installed it before testing it and the hole is the result. Now...it that was the guitar top and not a replacable pickguard, I might have got real mad...hmmmm...how about front and back plates! Didnt think of that.. (well, I had no reason to, I had no idea that it could be a problem!) That's exactly what you are going to run up against all along, but if you perservere you will succeed...the guitar looks great and it may take a bit of wiring, but it should get there in the end! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwhiteandthemaple Posted April 7, 2006 Report Share Posted April 7, 2006 Ahhh pls.. As I said before.. Try a clear pickguard(?) if you're so worried. StewMac 10" x 13" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegarehanman Posted April 8, 2006 Report Share Posted April 8, 2006 Congrats on winning Guitar of the month, Russ! You can get rid of the "rightfully underappreciated" under your name now! Thanks. So what should I change the subtitle to, "potentially overappreciated?" heheh. I respect that you're set on sticking to the design that's in your head while realising that tweaking little details is not a bad thing. peace, russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 .how about front and back plates! I might seriously do that! It would solve the problem of fixing the hole on the back where I slipped with the router whist cutting the chambers! Ahhh pls.. As I said before.. Try a clear pickguard(?) if you're so worried. StewMac 10" x 13" I have some clear perspex the right thickness that I could use, but while exposing the wood grain may look good, exposing a rats nest of wires may not! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 I drew them all next to each other to help me decide: #4, with no pickguard at all is probably my least favourite... Problem is I like all the others pretty much equally! I cant decide! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~john~ Posted April 9, 2006 Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 I like number 2 best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitefly SA Posted April 9, 2006 Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 1 or 5 would be my picks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manquesa Posted April 9, 2006 Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 I vote #3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 Thanks for the opinions! Maybe I should post a poll in the vote section. I'm not entirely sure I'd go with what ever won the vote though, I need to decide for myself really. People like 1,2,3, and 5 then... that narrows it down! I think I can pretty much write off #4, if I was going to go for the more simple approach, I think #5 beats #4 hands down. Damn my indecisiveness! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwhiteandthemaple Posted April 9, 2006 Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 no.2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitey Posted April 9, 2006 Report Share Posted April 9, 2006 definatly 1..or 2...no 1...wait... 1...2 doh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lietuvis Posted April 10, 2006 Report Share Posted April 10, 2006 2 and 3 are my picks, although 2 seems best at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2006 The more I look at them, the more I think I maybe prefer 2 and 3 a little... I like 1 on paper, but on the real thing the shape of the top horn isnt quite the same, and I think that it might look better if the pickguard didnt cover it, that way I could carve the horn a little nicer. There's some nice wood grain pattern on the bit that 3 leaves uncovered on the lower horn, but it would be less convenient for the wiring if the pickguard didnt go to the end of the horn. I like 5 too, but I'm thinking it could be better for future on a guitar that has simpler electronics and less of a need for a pickguard. If I were going to use 5, I would rearrange the knobs to a Les Paul style layout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2006 Anyone know where I can get pickguard blanks that are big enough in the UK? Preferably B/W/B but plain black would be ok, I suppose. Everywhere I look seems to only sell them big enough for strat pickguards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azz230 Posted April 12, 2006 Report Share Posted April 12, 2006 Number 3 alll the way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marksound Posted April 12, 2006 Report Share Posted April 12, 2006 3 or 5, but 1 would be cool if you did the black in contrasting color wood instead of a pickguard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2006 I've done a fair bit, but I havent taken any photos yet, so I'll take some on monday and post them. I have slotted for all frets, glued the fingerboard to the neck, cut it to the correct width and carved the neck profile (a sort of chunky, slightly asymetric V-profile) Meanwhile I'm already coming up with ideas for my next guitar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitey Posted April 22, 2006 Report Share Posted April 22, 2006 wow! wats that blue monstrosity! lol the explorer design is cool,especially the headstock,but not the colour :s lol and that strat style,would look better if it were a but greener imo the rr and the rg are my faves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted April 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2006 (edited) It'll be a fair while and many design revisions before I build any of those! I've got my hands full with this project at the moment. The strat, RR and RG designs were all done using THIS SITE, (BTW Thanks to Fraser linking to that site on his Guitar Build Page, its great!). I just did a few designs because I was bored with my art coursework My next project is going to be a clear acrylic guitar actually. Any of these will have to be the project after that. Edited April 22, 2006 by Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitefly SA Posted April 23, 2006 Report Share Posted April 23, 2006 the explorer design is cool,especially the headstock i personally dont like it, it looks too much like a washburn IMO http://my.lostinfo.com/event_db/guitars/DCP01703.JPG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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