Bizman62 Posted November 5, 2021 Report Share Posted November 5, 2021 1 hour ago, asgeirogm said: I realized I cannot use splines as I glued the cap on á couple of days ago, so I can't hide the splines There's a guy in YouTube who's got several videos about repairing cracked headstocks from the bottom side, often leaving the cap unharmed. That would leave the splines more or less visible from the underside, though. But it's doable and quite easy to hide if the angled area is painted - many guitars have a burst at the ends of the neck. I wouldn't bother, though, since it requires a jig to get the grooves right. Too much effort for fixing something that isn't broken... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 11, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 So, back with some progress pics. Found my pattern router bit and routed the headstock with my 3d printed template Finishing up and a moment of lost concentration caused a bump into the headstock and template Used the offcut Made a small sanding jig thing for sanding the joint square Glued Turns out the repair failed as during glueing/clamping, the piece moved away from the front face of the headstock. I should have just cut it off and glued a new piece in, but instead of sanded the front face flush with the glued piece, which was a mistake, like I've covered earlier in the thread. Decided to glue a thin plate on top of the headstock to get the nut to the correct place again While planing the plate, a screw came loose from the depth thing and it fell into the bit. On the plus side, the screw/bit didn't go flying into my stomach, but on the not-so-plus side, the cutter took a beating. It can still be used for planing, but I have since used my 16mm pattern bit for all my planing needs. Two plates planed to a few millimeters over. I created two as I was thinking about putting a plate on the back as well, but ended up bailing on that Planed the front of the headstock and standed to prepare for gluing the plate on Rough cut and glued Routed flush So many pics, time for a new post 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted November 11, 2021 Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 Great save! I've only done a bit of 3D printing and I'm not too convinced by the accuracy or stability of parts so far. Then again, I've only used PLA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 11, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 I then thicknessed the headstock so that the headstock break was again in the correct place. Tuner holes drilled on the drill press Decided to try the tuners on for fun. I think they look good, but man they are heavier than I thought. I've read that Explorers sometimes tend to be neck divers, and with a 37mm thick body, this one might also become a neck diver. "Luckily" I rarely play, and if I do, I'm sitting, so not such a problem. I then cut the heel to the correctish length and routed the neck angle into the heel by putting a 10mm hex key at the right length from the heel end to give me a 2 degree angle Next I wanted to route the neck pocket, so I needed to make sure it was straight through the center. Removed the bulk of the material using a forstner bit, but left some at the bottom for the router to take Routed with some tape on the template to make sure the pocket was not too loose, but then realized my pattern bit is so long that this the deepest I could get with the MDF template things on, and without them, the pocked would be way to deep. Decided just to take 3 millimeters (the diff missing from the pocket) off the heel to make everything correct. 3d printed a template for the 8mm radius filets (to match my 16mm pattern bit) Sanded the pocket until I could fit the neck into it. It's still a little too snug on the end of the body, will loosen ever so slightly later. Hangs with no problem, but there is also a taper on the pocket, so that also helps Will work on the transition after the neck is roughly carved Centerline check: passed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 11, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Prostheta said: Great save! I've only done a bit of 3D printing and I'm not too convinced by the accuracy or stability of parts so far. Then again, I've only used PLA. Thanks! I'm also using PLA right now (have ABS but haven't fine tuned it my printer for it yet). For these sort of templates, the tolerances on my printer are fine, I used 5 parameters (walls) so I can sand the templates a bit, but I really love being able to model and print something in an hour or two and have it ready for the router. I will also model and 3d print templates soon for the control cavity and cover. Edited November 11, 2021 by asgeirogm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizman62 Posted November 11, 2021 Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 I'm a bit envious about how clean your work looks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 11, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 1 hour ago, Bizman62 said: I'm a bit envious about how clean your work looks! Wow thanks, that comment made my night! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 13, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2021 I just realized something annoying/tragic/funny, I can already see the neck is slightly twisted, ca 1mm from corner to corner, so I will have to sand the top of the neck down a bit regardless, maybe it will twist even more once I start carving the facets. This means that in order to have the headstock break in the correct place I might have to plane the entire top plate I added off the front of the headstock.. Sigh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 14, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2021 (edited) Just did the first facet. A dirt cheap, coarse rasp made easy work of removing the bulk of it, and then a finer file for smoothing it out a bit. It's not dead straight right now, it has very small hills and valleys as I didn't have time to finish, I will do that before I start the next facet in the next couple of days (provided the neck doesn't turn into a propeller. I also started working on the mini cnc router again as I will soon need to do the inlays, but no picture worthy progress on that yet. I still haven't totally decided on the inlays, I was thinking of doing some orangutans from padauk and other woods but I'm having second thoughts about whether it will make sense on this guitar, I'll need to do a mockup. Edited November 14, 2021 by asgeirogm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted November 14, 2021 Report Share Posted November 14, 2021 "Of Wolf And Orangutan"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 16 hours ago, Prostheta said: "Of Wolf And Orangutan"? That would be some concept Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizman62 Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 18 hours ago, asgeirogm said: It's not dead straight right now, it has very small hills and valleys A sanding beam is a good tool for straightening the facets. Any straight piece of board, plywood, aluminium profile or whatever will do as long as it's shorter than the facet. A long one is better since it won't carve the center thinner. 28 cm/11" is good as the sandpaper sheets are that long. Masking tape and super glue will keep the strip of sandpaper firmly on the stick, yet allowing for changing to a finer grit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistermikev Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 21 hours ago, asgeirogm said: Just did the first facet. A dirt cheap, coarse rasp made easy work of removing the bulk of it, and then a finer file for smoothing it out a bit. It's not dead straight right now, it has very small hills and valleys as I didn't have time to finish, I will do that before I start the next facet in the next couple of days (provided the neck doesn't turn into a propeller. I also started working on the mini cnc router again as I will soon need to do the inlays, but no picture worthy progress on that yet. I still haven't totally decided on the inlays, I was thinking of doing some orangutans from padauk and other woods but I'm having second thoughts about whether it will make sense on this guitar, I'll need to do a mockup. the best part here... shaping the neck. even using the facets method - everyone does it slightly different. Such a personal part of the guitar... in my mind it's the equiv of a "signature" on a painting. looking fwd to seeing how you sign yours. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 (edited) @mistermikev I've seen so many people say that their favorite part of a build is carving the neck, and I can understand what they mean just from the first facet. Just holding the neck in my hand with the first couple of facets is already such a huge step into making this feel like a guitar neck, and it's very satisfying! I really look forward to continuing working on it and getting it closer and closer to the final shape. I just really hope I don't have to scrap this neck due to twist, that would suck big time. I find it kind of funny in a way that I haven't really played a lot in the last 15 years or so, I have an Seagull acoustic that I love that I play on occasion, and a Squire Strat that I never play. What I'm trying to say is that I have no idea what kind of neck carve I like, so I just went with something/anything. It looks like it will end up being pretty thinish, it's a little under 15 mm at the first fret right now (+6 mm fretboard), and I will have to remove some from the top to get rid of the twist, so it will end up thinner, but I have no idea if I will like a thin neck or not. I went for a some sort of C profile along the entire neck, also don't know if I will like that or would prefer something like C->D or V, baseball or what. Of course I will try to make changes if I can feel that I would like it a bit more like this or like that, but if I would like it thicker somewhere, then I'm just out of luck That was a lot of mumbling, but I've been thinking I should go into a guitar store before my next build and just try all kinds of guitars to find what I like Edited November 15, 2021 by asgeirogm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 The apparent thickness is an aspect people don't talk about enough. This is a combination of the thickness of the wood, the frets, the radius and then the strings above that. It's something that's very hard to dial in just by dealing with neck thickness values alone. Then of course, there's the feel of the profile. A slightly thicker than optimal fingerboard can make a neck feel thicker for example, but a combination of other geometric aspects can make a neck feel thinner or thicker than it truly is. I don't entirely agree with this being an "art" since all of these aspects can be quantified and made more or less repeatable. Compare say, a Gibson's random profile against a higher-end production Ibanez. You can rely on the latter to be a known quantity, whereas the former seem scattershot at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 3 hours ago, Bizman62 said: A sanding beam is a good tool for straightening the facets. Any straight piece of board, plywood, aluminium profile or whatever will do as long as it's shorter than the facet. A long one is better since it won't carve the center thinner. 28 cm/11" is good as the sandpaper sheets are that long. Masking tape and super glue will keep the strip of sandpaper firmly on the stick, yet allowing for changing to a finer grit. Yeah I sanded a little bit with a straight piece of wood, but had 180 grit so I didn't take enough and then ran out of time. Didn't stick the sandpaper to the board though, alhough I know I should. I will do that when I continue Thanks for the tips Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 @Prostheta You summed up what I've been thinking on the subject quite nicely. It will probably take me (and people in general) some time to figure out what I like, in terms of all these different aspects that play a part in how it feels to play the guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistermikev Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 8 minutes ago, asgeirogm said: @mistermikev I've seen so many people say that their favorite part of a build is carving the neck, and I can understand what they mean just from the first facet. Just holding the neck in my hand with the first couple of facets is already such a huge step into making this feel like a guitar neck, and it's very satisfying! I really look forward to continuing working on it and getting it closer and closer to the final shape. I just really hope I don't have to scrap this neck due to twist, that would suck big time. I find it kind of funny in a way that I haven't really played a lot in the last 15 years or so, I have an Seagull acoustic that I love that I play on occasion, and a Squire Strat that I never play. What I'm trying to say is that I have no idea what kind of neck carve I like, so I just went with something/anything. It looks like it will end up being pretty thinish, it's a little under 15 mm at the first fret right now (+6 mm fretboard), and I will have to remove some from the top to get rid of the twist, so it will end up thinner, but I have no idea if I will like a thin neck or not. I went for a some sort of C profile along the entire neck, also don't know if I will like that or would prefer something like C->D or V, baseball or what. Of course I will try to make changes if I can feel that I would like it a bit more like this or like that, but if I would like it thicker somewhere, then I'm just out of luck That was a lot of mumbling, but I've been thinking I should go into a guitar store before my next build and just try all kinds of guitars to find what I like right on... it's very true. it is really the part that you will always be in contact with the guitar on... and small variances in the shape effect each of us differently. twist - well.. .I hear ya there... would be a shame to toss such lovely wood. that said, make sure to consider also how you'd feel if you get all the way done on this guitar and find it doesn't play well due to twist. I think most importantly... figure out how you got there and how to prevent it going fwd. easy for me to say as I live in a giant wood seasoner! afa preference... I have boatnecks I like... and I have thin necks I like. They all have things to offer. I think you just decide what's right for THIS guitar and go with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 Well, you can always leave a neck thicker than desired and shave it back based on how it feels to you when strung up. Thickness from the D/G strings through to the centre of the neck profile is one key point, as is the feel of how it transitions over the shoulders. I did a fair amount of fiddling with the profile on my Frankenstrat after final build in order to get a "fat fast" neck rather than replicating the feel of my #1 Ibanez. It's not slinky and insubstantial, but it's not clumsy and like playing tar. It's difficult to dial out a feel based on numbers off the desktop, so consider tuning it in situ if you can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 1 minute ago, mistermikev said: twist - well.. .I hear ya there... would be a shame to toss such lovely wood. that said, make sure to consider also how you'd feel if you get all the way done on this guitar and find it doesn't play well due to twist. I think most importantly... figure out how you got there and how to prevent it going fwd. My first problem was that when I was picking out the wood for the guitar (i,e. looking at these different parts of the table I bought), I saw a long beam that would be quite convenient to use for a neck. I checked the end grain and it looked pretty straight and that was the end of my inspections and considerations. Today I know more about what ideal neck wood looks like, it's not enough that it's quartersawn, the grain should also be straight throughout the blank, which this one just isn't. So, I already know more today than I did then that will help me going forward. Another thing that was pointed out to me in this thread (probably by Prostheta) was to laminate the neck. I have the other neck piece I got from the same long beam that I can see has straighter grain than the one I'm using now, but I will look into sawing that up and adding some nice stiff wood in between for a 3-piece laminate neck at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 13 minutes ago, Prostheta said: Well, you can always leave a neck thicker than desired and shave it back based on how it feels to you when strung up. Thickness from the D/G strings through to the centre of the neck profile is one key point, as is the feel of how it transitions over the shoulders. I did a fair amount of fiddling with the profile on my Frankenstrat after final build in order to get a "fat fast" neck rather than replicating the feel of my #1 Ibanez. It's not slinky and insubstantial, but it's not clumsy and like playing tar. It's difficult to dial out a feel based on numbers off the desktop, so consider tuning it in situ if you can. Good idea, likely a bit late for me on this current build but good food for thought on the next one for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistermikev Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 4 minutes ago, asgeirogm said: My first problem was that when I was picking out the wood for the guitar (i,e. looking at these different parts of the table I bought), I saw a long beam that would be quite convenient to use for a neck. I checked the end grain and it looked pretty straight and that was the end of my inspections and considerations. Today I know more about what ideal neck wood looks like, it's not enough that it's quartersawn, the grain should also be straight throughout the blank, which this one just isn't. So, I already know more today than I did then that will help me going forward. Another thing that was pointed out to me in this thread (probably by Prostheta) was to laminate the neck. I have the other neck piece I got from the same long beam that I can see has straighter grain than the one I'm using now, but I will look into sawing that up and adding some nice stiff wood in between for a 3-piece laminate neck at some point. certainly all things to consider. I'm not contradicting at all... but I wouldn't necc rely on any of those things thinking that they woudl guarantee a good neck. lots of folks build necks that aren't multi lam and they are fine... idk what they do but for me - just need to spot that sort of thing earlier on... which means planning to make an initial cut on some wood and then giving it some time to potentially change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 (edited) I have a question regarding attempting to prevent twist in a less-than-perfectly-straight neck blank. Consider this diagram: I expect that #2 is better than #1 as it gives a better balance, but I'm wondering how much of a difference #2 compares to #1 and #3? I ask because I already have the other piece of the neck blank like this, so it's not really feasible to do method #2 (or variations thereof): I guess then you could optimize all of these methods by possibly also rotating each piece instead of just flipping them, but with my blank, I don't have that luxury. I just wanted to see if you guys thought that method #1 or #3 would be enough for my second neck blank? And if so, which of the two would you go for (I know the grain on the actual piece of wood will matter here, I'm just wondering in general). My feeling is that #3 gives better balance than #1 Edited November 15, 2021 by asgeirogm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeirogm Posted November 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, mistermikev said: which means planning to make an initial cut on some wood and then giving it some time to potentially change. Makes sense. After I sawed up the beam into two neck blanks and thicknessed the one I'm using now, it stood inside for a few weeks before I did the first facet, and it had twisted a little in that time, about 1 mm or so from corner to corner. Judging by what I've read (which isn't that much but it's something), I wouldn't expect (hope ) it to move too much from now on. I hope I'm not wrong on that front, let's see Edited November 15, 2021 by asgeirogm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistermikev Posted November 15, 2021 Report Share Posted November 15, 2021 26 minutes ago, asgeirogm said: I have a question regarding attempting to prevent twist in a less-than-perfectly-straight neck blank. Consider this diagram: I expect that #2 is better than #1 as it gives a better balance, but I'm wondering how much of a difference #2 compares to #1 and #3? I ask because I already have the other piece of the neck blank like this, so it's not really feasible to do method #2 (or variations thereof): I guess then you could optimize all of these methods by possibly also rotating each piece instead of just flipping them, but with my blank, I don't have that luxury. I just wanted to see if you guys thought that method #1 or #3 would be enough for my second neck blank? And if so, which of the two would you go for (I know the grain on the actual piece of wood will matter here, I'm just wondering in general). My feeling is that #3 gives better balance than #1 I'm sure others will weigh in on this but number 1 and 3 are functionally equiv. #2 would be way more stable due to the opposing end grain. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.